New ESPN rankings for 2021

#51

Voldopia

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#51
An additional thought on the UA/Fudd situation involves the NCAA's NIL rules and what they look like. One issue that has been discussed is the possibility of a student-athlete endorsing one product line while playing for a school sponsored by a different product line. In other words, could player A sponsor UA products while playing for a Nike school? It seems that would be possible under the NCAA rules being considered. The endorsement could not be done while representing the school of course.

Azzi Fudd is already endorsing Under Armour through IG. It's entirely possible she could do that for money while playing for a Nike school. Will she hold off committing to see what NIL rules look like?
 
#52

sgacock

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#52
Here's a different way to look at the top 15. Thanks to Boneyarder @mbr33ct for doing the composit:
mbr33ct redid list a couple of times after the initial posting. Great work.

The top 18 of this de-do list done by mbr33ct is what I consider the true composite 5 stars because they are consensus Top 30 in all 5 services. (note: splitting hairs Saniya River is ranked #2 by Prospects Nation and should have an average rank of 3.3)



Of course, it will all change when the other four services update their rankings, but it was great work by mbr33ct
 
#53

Amb3096

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#53
Yep, we can argue all we want but it is highly probable we have to get a top five rated kid or two if we want to be relevant nationally. You do not have to be UConn or USC to grab an elite kid. Maybe three top tens is out of the question at this point unless you find some kids that want to play together. But you can get a kid or two over a couple of years.
I don't disagree much with this. I just think that it would be hard to convince top 5 kids to come to Tennessee until Kellie turns the program around first. If she can win (not SEC or NCAA titles...but just enough) with a team mostly comprised of mid-tier players, it will make Tennessee a more attractive destination. Unfortunately, Holly's horrid results with All American-laden teams probably turned off a lot of top recruits, and it will take time to convince them that it's a new era.
 
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#54

GameTime

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#54
I don't disagree much with this. I just think that it would be hard to convince top 5 kids to come to Tennessee until Kellie turns the program around first. If she can win (not SEC or NCAA titles...but just enough) with a team mostly comprised of mid-tier players, it will make Tennessee a more attractive destination. Unfortunately, Holly's horrid results with All American-laden teams probably turned off a lot of top recruits, and it will take time to convince them that it's a new era.
It is disappointing not to see a LV recruit in the top 30.....However sports fans, the talent coming next season may not have caught the eye of the rating services yet, there is no way in hell anyone can tell me that Striplin and Puckett are not going to be tigers on the blocks for the LVs next season...No way in hell!

Miles, by her own words, has got to improve her outside shooting, but she will be a speedster to penetrate the lane and make the defenses break down to stop her....When her outside shot starts falling, mama mia, our crowds will roar...

Also, Kaiya Wynn will bring her A game when she puts on her LV uniform...Her slashing to the basket and bombing from behind the heart break line, will keep her in the starting lineup......She's a demon...She is going to be FANTASTIC!
 
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#55

Bballnut1952

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#55
It is disappointing not to see a LV recruit in the top 30.....However sports fans, the talent coming next season may not have caught the eye of the rating services yet, there is no way in hell anyone can tell me that Striplin and Puckett are not going to be tigers on the blocks for the LVs next season...No way in hell!

Miles, by her own words, has got to improve her outside shooting, but she will be a speedster to penetrate the lane and make the defenses break down to stop her....When her outside shot starts falling, mama mia, our crowds will roar...

Also, Kaiya Wynn will bring her A game when she puts on her LV uniform...Her slashing to the basket and bombing from behind the heart break line, will keep her in the starting lineup......She's a demon...She is going to be FANTASTIC!
Love the positivity, Gametime.

These young ladies will bring great energy to the Lady Vol program. And great quality kids as well.

It doesn’t change the need for some top ten recruits in the future.
 
#56

GameTime

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#56
Win and they will come....

When we were young we had so much.....Now we are older, and our plates are a little bare....We're so hungry for that satisfying meal.
 
#57
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#57
Win and they will come....

When we were young we had so much.....Now we are older, and our plates are a little bare....We're so hungry for that satisfying meal.
I hear you GT

Coach K will get the same time constraints as all coaches get....

Year one: Familiarization and beginning to work into their approach-
(SEC 4th place or better...Make the NCAA tourney and no less than the round of 32 (Considering the talent already here S16 should be the expectation))

Year two: Begin the weeding out process and start the flowering in process, also, should see a few steps into the right direction for the team
(SEC, 3rd or better....NCAA minimal S16)

Year three: Should begin to have a system intact and beginning to show marked advancement
(SEC strong 2nd or 3rd....NCAA's minimal S16 but an E8 or better should be the goal)

Year four: Should have weeded out all of the weeds and now headed full steam into the visible and marked advancement of the program
(SEC Strong 2nd and fighting for 1st...NCAA time to get back into the E8 or F4)

Year five: If the prior steps have not been met, time to consider the next step for the program

This is Tennessee, not Missouri State, so the expectations should be what they are. Not what they were headed towards with CHW. If we're going to climb back into prominence, WE have to be as strong as supporters of the organization as the org itself.

I would expect this of myself and I expect it of Coach K

I am a coach and if I were in Coach K's position, I would expect these parameters and required steps of myself as well
 
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#58
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#58
Generally, the women’s basketball recruiting rankings are spot on. I don’t know how they can get it so right in women’s but not men’s.??? I also know that Pat wouldn’t have won the SEC with the players we are bringing in. The women’s game is ran and won by the teams with the best players. We are not getting those players anymore. Dawn is getting those players. We should have hired a coach that already had a reputation or more notoriety! I’m willing to bet Kara won’t need 3 years to prove to recruits that they should want to play for her. Texas is already getting great recruits, because they hired an established coach with those top recruits. Plus, he is a proven winner. The idea that Kellie has to prove to these recruits that she’s a good coach, should have disqualified her from consideration. We are not and never have been a program to build your resume at! When Tennessee makes a hire, it should be to win immediately! This idea that it will take 5-6 years to compete again is unacceptable! A great coach could have came in and won within two recruiting classes. There are only a handful of great coaches out there and one of them should be walking the sideline of TBA.
 
#59

GameTime

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#59
Generally, the women’s basketball recruiting rankings are spot on. I don’t know how they can get it so right in women’s but not men’s.??? I also know that Pat wouldn’t have won the SEC with the players we are bringing in. The women’s game is ran and won by the teams with the best players. We are not getting those players anymore. Dawn is getting those players. We should have hired a coach that already had a reputation or more notoriety! I’m willing to bet Kara won’t need 3 years to prove to recruits that they should want to play for her. Texas is already getting great recruits, because they hired an established coach with those top recruits. Plus, he is a proven winner. The idea that Kellie has to prove to these recruits that she’s a good coach, should have disqualified her from consideration. We are not and never have been a program to build your resume at! When Tennessee makes a hire, it should be to win immediately! This idea that it will take 5-6 years to compete again is unacceptable! A great coach could have came in and won within two recruiting classes. There are only a handful of great coaches out there and one of them should be walking the sideline of TBA.
Here you go champ....
Call this number (865) 656-1200
Tell them you have all the answers....
 
#60
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#60
Generally, the women’s basketball recruiting rankings are spot on. I don’t know how they can get it so right in women’s but not men’s.??? I also know that Pat wouldn’t have won the SEC with the players we are bringing in. The women’s game is ran and won by the teams with the best players. We are not getting those players anymore. Dawn is getting those players. We should have hired a coach that already had a reputation or more notoriety! I’m willing to bet Kara won’t need 3 years to prove to recruits that they should want to play for her. Texas is already getting great recruits, because they hired an established coach with those top recruits. Plus, he is a proven winner. The idea that Kellie has to prove to these recruits that she’s a good coach, should have disqualified her from consideration. We are not and never have been a program to build your resume at! When Tennessee makes a hire, it should be to win immediately! This idea that it will take 5-6 years to compete again is unacceptable! A great coach could have came in and won within two recruiting classes. There are only a handful of great coaches out there and one of them should be walking the sideline of TBA.
"I can be there tomo..."

you know ;o)
 
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#61
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#61
Oh, if they would listen, I would call! But, everyone wants to be all positive and HOPE things go well. You know how things go well? By putting yourself in the best position to succeed! Sorry if you don’t want to hear that the players Kellie has recruited aren’t good enough to compete on a national level. We can finish in the middle of the SEC with these recruits....maybe. She needed an elite point guard, a couple dead-eye shooters and a bonafide star! Our facilities and tradition should be enough to recruit great players! We could have had Jeff Walz, but we are obsessed with hiring former players. We need an infusion of new ideas and an actual offensive system! Sorry if that angers all the sunshine pumpers, but I’ve been watching and going to Lady Vols games for over 30 years and we are not going to be winning anything with these players.
 
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#62

Voltopia

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#62
I appreciate the positivity but I also think sometimes people talk themselves into believing things that are unfounded when it comes to recruits and recruiting. It’s not a habit unique to this sport; people do it about football and other sports too. A recruiting tape that only shows good highlights, or a game against an outmatched opponent, so on, so forth. Happens all the time. Sometimes things are what they are. Tennessee got some players this year but a lot of game changers looked elsewhere. This is not a sport with an embarrassment of riches when it comes to elite talent. And you have to wonder how wide the gap between Tennessee’s class and the sort of class South Carolina has brought in this year looks like. A lot of work ahead to bridge that gap, it seems, and Harper has to build that bridge in the next few years. It’s on her now. A good coach gets everything they can out of their players, (Summitt was the best at that, bar none), and Harper will have to be at her best to elevate the current roster, outduel more talented programs, and send the message that Tennessee is closing the gap.
 
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#63

JohnnyPayne

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#63
I’ve said on here several times that recruiting rankings mean nothing. Most everyone is or was excited about the players that all gave verbals. Then someone arbitrarily ranks them lower, and now they aren’t good. They could be right or wrong. Someone’s opinion doesn’t change how good a player is. Wait till they get here and then let’s decide if they’re good or bad. Because I’m assuming other than Coach Jumper, who has even seen any of them play in person. We finally have a semblance of building a team as opposed to just getting tall and athletic players. That hadn’t worked out recently.
 
#64

Voltopia

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#64
I’ve said on here several times that recruiting rankings mean nothing. Most everyone is or was excited about the players that all gave verbals. Then someone arbitrarily ranks them lower, and now they aren’t good. They could be right or wrong. Someone’s opinion doesn’t change how good a player is. Wait till they get here and then let’s decide if they’re good or bad. Because I’m assuming other than Coach Jumper, who has even seen any of them play in person. We finally have a semblance of building a team as opposed to just getting tall and athletic players. That hadn’t worked out recently.
Statistically, recruiting rankings absolutely mean something. If you look at the championship teams, you're going to find a lot of top ten recruits filling out those box scores. Think Stewart and Tuck, Shepard and Ogunbewale, Wilson and Gray. And you occasionally get an Ionescu, (but she's also a top ten recruit so). There's definitely a perceptible pattern relating top ten ranked recruits who are signed, who go on to produce national titles in their junior and senior years in women's basketball (sometimes sooner). Pretending like recruiting rankings don't matter isn't logical.

That's not to say that ESPN's rankings are the be-all end-all of determining who's what; they're not. But there's some correlation between schools who sign groups of 2-3 top recruits, and their success in 3-4 years. With better results if they're stable programs who can complement with other talented players in that same category.
 
#65
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#65
I’ve said on here several times that recruiting rankings mean nothing. Most everyone is or was excited about the players that all gave verbals. Then someone arbitrarily ranks them lower, and now they aren’t good. They could be right or wrong. Someone’s opinion doesn’t change how good a player is. Wait till they get here and then let’s decide if they’re good or bad. Because I’m assuming other than Coach Jumper, who has even seen any of them play in person. We finally have a semblance of building a team as opposed to just getting tall and athletic players. That hadn’t worked out recently.
The four players coming in, Wynn, Striplin, Puckett and Miles,,,My take on each is as follows:

Puckett is the shooter. She will be good for 10-14 points a game as mainly long and mid-range gunner. Her shot is quick in rhythm and she can get a reception off in a blink

Striplin is a workhorse who has excellent foot work (on both off and def) and is not one to back down from contact or intimidation. She can play players taller than her because she has a middle-center body, meaning, she isn't all legs, thus her center of gravity and longer torso gives her a power advantage against the taller posts.

Wynn has an off-court work ethic to match her on court play...She will be an exceptional student of the game. She is extremely athletic and has VG hops...(I expect her and Puckett to be immediate impact players)

Miles has the mighty-mite game we have needed for a very long time. Mental toughness and effort are my concerns with her. I have no doubt about the potential of her game and her ability to shut down and create with her speed. This one Coach K will have to "coach".

I have said it from day one and I stay with it
"Stars are for Astronomers"
Give me an athlete with heart, work ethic and ambition and you can have all of those "stars", because I will have the "planets"
 
#66

JohnnyPayne

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#66
Statistically, recruiting rankings absolutely mean something. If you look at the championship teams, you're going to find a lot of top ten recruits filling out those box scores. Think Stewart and Tuck, Shepard and Ogunbewale, Wilson and Gray. And you occasionally get an Ionescu, (but she's also a top ten recruit so). There's definitely a perceptible pattern relating top ten ranked recruits who are signed, who go on to produce national titles in their junior and senior years in women's basketball (sometimes sooner). Pretending like recruiting rankings don't matter isn't logical.

That's not to say that ESPN's rankings are the be-all end-all of determining who's what; they're not. But there's some correlation between schools who sign groups of 2-3 top recruits, and their success in 3-4 years. With better results if they're stable programs who can complement with other talented players in that same category.
My mistake. I guess a better way of putting it is there is a correlation overall between recruiting rankings and what the player achieves. But I stand by the recruiting rankings themselves mean nothing since it’s so subjective. Those players you mentioned didn’t win because they were “ranked high”. They won because they were generally the best players, were coached well, etc. We won’t win or lose games because our players are ranked x.

I think in some ways we are saying the same thing. But hopefully we will wait till those players are here to pass judgment as opposed to looking at a star or grade. We probably still have a top 10 class, but honestly who cares until they score a point.
 
#70

Darth_Vol

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#70
The idea that Kellie has to prove to these recruits that she’s a good coach, should have disqualified her from consideration.
I agree this is a weak argument, essentially nullified by the coach at North Carolina. Good recruiters can make connections to young women, sell the vision of the program, convince them they will reach their potential. It's a skill some coaches have, and some coaches don't.

If last season is any indication, fans waiting for Kellie to "prove it on the court" might be waiting a while...
 
#72

lfvol

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#72
Statistically, recruiting rankings absolutely mean something. If you look at the championship teams, you're going to find a lot of top ten recruits filling out those box scores. Think Stewart and Tuck, Shepard and Ogunbewale, Wilson and Gray. And you occasionally get an Ionescu, (but she's also a top ten recruit so). There's definitely a perceptible pattern relating top ten ranked recruits who are signed, who go on to produce national titles in their junior and senior years in women's basketball (sometimes sooner). Pretending like recruiting rankings don't matter isn't logical.

That's not to say that ESPN's rankings are the be-all end-all of determining who's what; they're not. But there's some correlation between schools who sign groups of 2-3 top recruits, and their success in 3-4 years. With better results if they're stable programs who can complement with other talented players in that same category.

This is spot on.
 
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#75

Bballnut1952

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#75
The four players coming in, Wynn, Striplin, Puckett and Miles,,,My take on each is as follows:

Puckett is the shooter. She will be good for 10-14 points a game as mainly long and mid-range gunner. Her shot is quick in rhythm and she can get a reception off in a blink

Striplin is a workhorse who has excellent foot work (on both off and def) and is not one to back down from contact or intimidation. She can play players taller than her because she has a middle-center body, meaning, she isn't all legs, thus her center of gravity and longer torso gives her a power advantage against the taller posts.

Wynn has an off-court work ethic to match her on court play...She will be an exceptional student of the game. She is extremely athletic and has VG hops...(I expect her and Puckett to be immediate impact players)

Miles has the mighty-mite game we have needed for a very long time. Mental toughness and effort are my concerns with her. I have no doubt about the potential of her game and her ability to shut down and create with her speed. This one Coach K will have to "coach".

I have said it from day one and I stay with it
"Stars are for Astronomers"
Give me an athlete with heart, work ethic and ambition and you can have all of those "stars", because I will have the "planets"
Are you saying Puckett will average 10-14 PPG in her freshman year?
 

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