More on Gruden

#1
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sterlingpearling

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#1
Spoke to my friend just now (formerly worked for Lamonte)You can peruse my previous threads for further background. Please remember: I am sharing info to be helpful, not attacking your religion. I am a UT fan, my friend is indifferent to UT's success, but more connected to the day to day than the reporters who originally shared this info.

Things he knows 100%:

There is no contract. There is not even an MOU. There has been an OFFER LETTER extended, and terms have been discussed, but not agreed to. As we will all recall, coaches almost never receive a drafted contract until months after they begin their job, and usually don't even sign them for months, if not years due to their complexity and the back and forth. There is no contract. There is no MOU. There is an offer letter.

UT's most recent terms (as of Tuesday) EXCEEDED Gruden's requested staff salary.

JG (through BM) has requested some things that make Cheek/Hart uncomfortable. They include: Staff negotiation, hiring and firing of staff (normally a function performed by the AD), Scheduling out of conference opponents (normally a function performed by the AD), staff incentives and bonuses (not normally part of a deal like this). He also wants to choose UT brand endorsements for the university, and wants the freedom to do endorsements himself (ones that do not acknowledge him as the UT coach). Also JG wants a long list of (non-causal) related reasons why he can leave UT, but won't be pinned down to any success metrics that give UT an out (Hart's counter).

While Haslam and others have stayed out of the fray, some other very vocal boosters have told BM and Jon that they will get what they want. This is like baby deer giving a wolf permission to lick it as long as there is "no biting". Hart is now in a terrible spot. If he takes this deal, he is betting his career that this arrangement will be a miracle cure, and will have done so with terms unheard of in any other college deal. It will be "his deal" whether he likes the terms or not. If he does not take the deal, the fan base will be furious, and it will be very hard to carry on the search without paying another coach way too much money. The bar has been set so high that even a lesser hire, will bring disproportionally high dollars to his deal.

There is still a pending request from AD for an in person sit down by today at 5. Yesterday's developments do not reflect new terms from AD. They reflect new pressure being exerted by boosters. Hart's plan to use the 5pm deadline today is now wrecked. Expect someone to deny the "contract" report as they will be able to be honest in saying that there isn't one as they talk through the last terms of the offer letter.

Again- I don't have a horse in the race. I only hope we get the best coach for the program. I do fear the risk, but it is what it is. I will ask my friend some more specific questions via email before lunch, and report back.
 
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#3
#3
If all this is true, I think I am no longer interested in Gruden. He is asking for way to much. With a SEC schedule, we don't need to have a hard out of conference schedule. Plus UT would need an out.
 
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#4
#4
For some reason I never considered the "out" options for Gruden being a hold up. Now that it has been said, it makes perfect sense. UT is going to have to stand hard on that one, and not give him easy outs. However it happens, i hope it all works out.
 
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#5
#5
With all due respect, I am now convinced this is well written BS. Believe what you want, but no way any agency leaks as much specific info as contained in these elaborate fables.

Carry on.
 
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#6
#6
I believe this because these were the supposed same reasons Miami stepped away from the Gruden negotiating table.
 
#7
#7
I don't doubt the OP at all however this is a leak from the Hart camp to control whatever they are trying to control.

Negotiating 101, private conversations remain private unless an individual(s) decides to leak them to gain an advantage over the other, for good or bad!

Not picking sides here, just my opinion. All I want is Gruden! Hopefully everything works out beneficial to all parties involved.......
 
#8
#8
IhateGA said:
If all this is true, I think I am no longer interested in Gruden. He is asking for way to much. With a SEC schedule, we don't need to have a hard out of conference schedule. Plus UT would need an out.
Click to expand...

Last time I heard Oregon was pretty good, who we play in 2013.
 
#11
#11
Not sure if true or not, but... If this is true, it is unethical behavior by our boosters, and one more instance of over-zealous boosters putting their university in a hard spot.

No booster, even with the best of intentions, should put the AD in a hard spot when trying to negotiate on UT's behalf. If this is true, I will not be heart-broken if we don't get Gruden (though i want him), and will hope for the best second option.
 
#12
#12
Carter- I agree that agents use silence as a tool. I also believe they (like the boosters) use talking and the press as a tool. In a twitter/chat board world, they decide when they will talk, and about what. From my thread last week, you'll recall that my friend had five straight days of no response from the BL office. When they want this to be quiet, it will be. Right now, they like the heat. Its good for them, and hard on Hart. I also said in my first thread some weeks ago, that Gruden would ask for unconventional terms that would make the AD and the university uncomfortable. He did, and they are.
 
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#13
#13
Jon Gruden is not better than UT football. Hart needs to man up and not allow a coaching candidate and his agent to railroad him. The kicker to me would be him wanting to endorse things "not as the UT head coach". When your in a job paying 5+ million a year you are the face of the program. You can't just turn it off to make a few extra bucks on the side advertising for the pink taco down on sunset blvd with their 2/1 lap dances before 10. I could see that being a very big issue. Sounds like he would scrap Adidas(can't say that would bother me), but would that not cost UT a large amount of money as we are probably under contract with them? Alot of things scream foul about this if it is accurate. The easy outs should not even be an option at all. If he wants an 8-10 year deal, UT deserves the same from Mr. Gruden.
 
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#14
#14
bcartervol98 said:
With all due respect, I am now convinced this is well written BS. Believe what you want, but no way any agency leaks as much specific info as contained in these elaborate fables.

Carry on.
Click to expand...
An agent in such negotiations is not going to leak any information to anyone, much less a former employee until the deal has been signed.
 
#15
#15
IhateGA said:
If all this is true, I think I am no longer interested in Gruden. He is asking for way to much. With a SEC schedule, we don't need to have a hard out of conference schedule. Plus UT would need an out.
Click to expand...

I disagree with the scheduling comment.. I favor a tough schedule year in and year out.. They tend to leave no doubt as to where your team stands compared to others.. I hate great teams playing the weaker "directional" schools.. IF you have to play one gimme, make it your first game tune up..
 
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#16
#16
I'm with the boosters! Dave Hart needs to make this happen. Give JG what he wants, and watch the f'ing magic show! Because he would make our tired, old program look like an NFL team!
 
#17
#17
sterlingpearling said:
....

UT's most recent terms (as of Tuesday) EXCEEDED Gruden's requested staff salary.

JG (through BM) has requested some things that make Cheek/Hart uncomfortable. They include: Staff negotiation, hiring and firing of staff (normally a function performed by the AD), Scheduling out of conference opponents (normally a function performed by the AD), staff incentives and bonuses (not normally part of a deal like this). He also wants to choose UT brand endorsements for the university, and wants the freedom to do endorsements himself (ones that do not acknowledge him as the UT coach). Also JG wants a long list of (non-causal) related reasons why he can leave UT, but won't be pinned down to any success metrics that give UT an out (Hart's counter).

....
Click to expand...

Staff negotiation, hiring and firing of staff (normally a function performed by the AD) - In his press conference, Hart said he did not choose the assistant coaches so are you talking about some other staff positions. He didn't comment on negotiations but I have no problem giving this function to the head coach. I would assume he would have a budget from the AD and it's up to him to manage that and not create any waves for the university. You know, sort of like the department head of a major corporation.

Scheduling out of conference opponents (normally a function performed by the AD) - Give it to him

staff incentives and bonuses (not normally part of a deal like this) - I don't understand this exactly. Maybe you are saying something different but there were incentives (bonuses) in the current staff contracts. I read them.

. He also wants to choose UT brand endorsements for the university, - Can we list these in advance? I mean does he want to endorse Hooters? or choose between nike and adidas? Whichever I don't care as long as we don't get into anything that would be bad taste.

and wants the freedom to do endorsements himself (ones that do not acknowledge him as the UT coach).
- Are there NCAA rules that govern this? If not, I'm think I'm okay with this too as long as the good taste test applies.

Also JG wants a long list of (non-causal) related reasons why he can leave UT, - look if we only had him for 2 or 3 years I'm actually okay with that. I think we get back on top and it's a lot easier for someone else to keep us there. I just think that you go thru the list line by line and try to see where you could work with him keeping in mind, we need him more than he needs us.

but won't be pinned down to any success metrics that give UT an out - This is tough. Just have to work on it.
 
#18
#18
m1al said:
I disagree with the scheduling comment.. I favor a tough schedule year in and year out.. They tend to leave no doubt as to where your team stands compared to others.. I hate great teams playing the weaker "directional" schools.. IF you have to play one gimme, make it your first game tune up..
Click to expand...

I am not completely opposed to the idea, I just think the first few years we need to get the talent built up before we tackle a harder schedule.
 
#19
#19
IhateGA said:
If all this is true, I think I am no longer interested in Gruden. He is asking for way to much. With a SEC schedule, we don't need to have a hard out of conference schedule. Plus UT would need an out.
Click to expand...

Its not and just about 90% of this and the rest of the garbage he has posted has been 100% false.
 
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#20
#20
bcartervol98 said:
With all due respect, I am now convinced this is well written BS. Believe what you want, but no way any agency leaks as much specific info as contained in these elaborate fables.

Carry on.
Click to expand...

Agree. First, no legal counsel would ever leak these kinds of details. Second, common sense people....Gruden is not going to wreck our program! What would that do to his rep? Third, these are known details from previous negotiations, and as such, are being pimped to represent the current situation. These things don't come out until after it's done, for better or worse.

In summary, I've posted Saban's and Meyer's denials and their documented chronology. Bottom line, there was so much smoke around those situations, which is so similar to this one.

I believe it's done.

Stall tactics. See Urban Meyer for comparison.

Rocky Top is back.
 
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#21
#21
As far as the schedule goes I would much rather see UT playing more home and home games with the Georgia Tech/NC State/UNC teams instead of the Georgia State/Akron games and keeping the money in our pocket.

We can not allow the man to have an easy way out while not having anything in the deal to protect UT. The way I read that is Gruden could go 2-10 5 straight years making close to 40 million dollars and UT could not do anything about it. You can't agree to something like that.
 
#22
#22
Sponsors pick you..you don't pick them..in most cases..and then there is the issue of said contracts with sponsors...
 
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#23
#23
Just as an outsider with no dog in the hunt, if this was Florida and the coach we were interviewing was asking for any of this, I'd tell him thank you and have a nice day, but we are no longer interested.

You can't cut off your nose to spite your face. This just seems like too much.

I think there has to be something to it because if Gruden wanted to be your coach that bad, he would find a way. This isn't on UT as far as the hold up, it's on Gruden. If you want to be at a place that bad, you make concessions on YOUR end to make it happen.
 
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#24
#24
I don't think those details are true.... but if they are then Hart would be a moron to agreeing to them. Look that contract basically gives Gruden all power and lets him do whatever he wants and gives the university none. Like if a coach wants causal parts, fine, but you are going to give us the same so if you end up sucking goat tits we aren't stuck. The rest is just petty stuff, but the out clause to him is a joke. If the university is going to invest that kind of money they should be doing all they can to protect it. Yes Gruden would be an awesome hire, but not sell your soul to the devil and lay down in front of a speeding train awesome.
 
#25
#25
sterlingpearling said:
Carter- I agree that agents use silence as a tool. I also believe they (like the boosters) use talking and the press as a tool. In a twitter/chat board world, they decide when they will talk, and about what. From my thread last week, you'll recall that my friend had five straight days of no response from the BL office. When they want this to be quiet, it will be. Right now, they like the heat. Its good for them, and hard on Hart. I also said in my first thread some weeks ago, that Gruden would ask for unconventional terms that would make the AD and the university uncomfortable. He did, and they are.
Click to expand...

Please stop with this my fiend crap! If anyone reads your post its very easy to see your just spouting your opinion. I really can't believe people would buy into what you are putting down.


LMAO you're a tool!!!
 
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