Let's see what happens Saturday

#51
#51
gasguy98 said:
I get it, fans want to win the SEC E and the SEC outright. Prolly should have beat the lizards and a boring win over a pathetic UMASS team has the future looking bleak.

Yet here we are at 3-1. I am going to watch the season play out before I get on the Butch has got to go train.

He is sitting on one heck of a class for '18. If he can give me at least 7 wins I am OK for one more chance.

HOWEVER, next year we absolutely must end the year in the top 10.

Just my thoughts as of today...
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I get it, but are you really ok with BJ winning 3 games and losing 5 games in the SEC? Who are the 3 SEC wins? 5 years with an SEC record of 17 - 23 and 2 (maybe 3) losses to Vandy? I just can't get behind that.
 
#52
#52
ATLVols said:
We need to get behind the team and let the season play out. Whether Butch stays or we make a change, those decisions need to happen near the end of the season. It does no good to demand firing our head coach which would put our team with a bad interim situation for the rest of the season.

The only time you fire a coach before the end is if the wheels fall completely off the bus and the coach completely loses the team. We're 3-1 still and lots to play for. The season and record at the end will take care of all that.
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This I can get behind. But if we go 3-5 in the SEC, not so much.
 
#53
#53
I just don't get it. Don't multi-year patterns of bad coaching mean anything??

There's a reason he has been national joke fodder for awhile now, because he is.

For the money he's making we should be getting much more than we are.
 
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#56
#56
Caspian said:
Here's a different perspective on things.

I just now watched the Florida game for the first time. The only thing I knew about it was what I had read on VN. And, of course, I saw the live score update at the end of the game - very frustrating.

Here's my reaction to actually watching the game. Very proud of the team effort and grit. Kelly is a beast. A few breaks went against us - could have gone the other way (e.g. the pick-6, Palmer's dropped TD pass, Kelly's dropped TD pass). That's just the way the ball bounced that day. 95 times out of 100, Kelly catches that slant pass over the middle on TN last drive for a TD and a win.

I did not feel even remotely discouraged about the team I saw at Florida. I remember the old days of being down 35 - 3 at halftime. There was none of that. I will take our chances to win a game like that against Florida every year.

Frustrated by the loss - yes. But from reading VN, I thought the world had come to an end. I got a very different feeling watching this TN team in that game for myself.
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The problem is, as much as it sucked to lose to them in the past it was mostly because they had more talent than us. Hate losing to those idiots but if a team is better then it is what it is. This year, last year, 2015 and 2014 we had more talent than them and guess what we are 1-3, why? Poor coaching.
 
#57
#57
gasguy98 said:
Another thing to consider. We get rid of Jones, and...
Who takes his place? It is not like Nick Saban grows on trees. Is there a bona fide coach that can turn around a program and be contending for a Natty in 5 years NOT names Saban?

Les Miles is a buffoon that rode Sabans coattails as long as he could before being seen as a fraud.
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The same old argument. This is what comes with mediocre coaching hires on the level of Kiffin, Dooley and Jones. This crap wont fly anymore. If this were 2012, then I would totally agree with you. Its likely no big time coacn wanted to come here. Different story now.

Butch has brought us back to national relevance. He has restocked the UT coffers with cash and has brought in great talent. Also, the state of Tennessee seems to be improving in producing elite HS football talent. This team and job are ripe for the picking for a good coach to come in and dominate.

Nick Saban should not be used as any example when measuring coaching success. He is the GOAT and a coach of his magnitude comes along maybe once in a generation. But there are plety of good coaches out there who could walk in with the talent UT has and have us winning big quickly.
 
#58
#58
rocketskates said:
The problem is, as much as it sucked to lose to them in the past it was mostly because they had more talent than us. Hate losing to those idiots but if a team is better then it is what it is. This year, last year, 2015 and 2014 we had more talent than them and guess what we are 1-3, why? Poor coaching.
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Not in 2014, they were better. But I agree with the rest of what you said.
 
#59
#59
sjt18 said:
If you are going to open the check book... my choice is Fuente. Really think highly of him. This week will help define him even more when they play Clemson.

Some point to his loss vs Jones... but the same people claimed Jones needed at least a year if not two before his "system" would be installed. That was Fuente's first game at VT with a new QB who had never played with his new team. Fuente won his division last year and lost by only 7 to Clemson. His team improved all year... Jones' team... not so much.

Fuente's contract is VERY attractive for buyout. His buyout is only $6 million now and drops to $5 million after Dec 15th. His salary this year is projected at $3.25 million and his incentives aren't very strong.... $25K for making the CG and $50K for winning it.

He's a very good target both from a capability standpoint and a financial standpoint.
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He definitely would be a great hire. Just not sure we would be willing to pay a 5 mill buyout on top of the 10 to Butch and his staff. And would he leave VA Tech? I would definitely make him say no thanks.
 
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#60
#60
VolunteerHillbilly said:
I guess the flipside is do you settle for 8-win seasons and winning some meaningless bowl games against pedestrian competition, or do you do something to try and get better results?
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That's the $64K question. I'm in the former camp unless the AD can start laying the groundwork to bring in a "sure thing" improvement. We were sorta in this situation in 08' and we know how choosing the latter bit us. If you can't land a beast of a coach, then ride it another season.

Honestly, after the 1st and goal at the 1/2 fade route, and another laid egg in the Swamp, I accepted the reality. Would love to be surprised in 17'.
 
#61
#61
jasonvol18 said:
These are different Florida teams than the ones we fell behind again years ago. I honestly felt even worse about losing the game after watching UK go up and down the field on them. They just couldn't close it out and settled for FG's and Not TD's. This year's Flor team isn't anywhere close to being a top 25 team. After watching them Sat it had me scratching my head all over again on how Butch continues to lose those kind of games. I think the mistakes cost both teams points. The fumble into the end zone would have put UF by 17 and it's over then. There was plays and missed plays by both teams that could have put the game out of reach. And we have had that same chance the last 4 yrs vs Flor and we are 1-3. We find new ways to lose to Fla every year.S sadly we have played 4 straight games of bad football. The better teams would have run us off the field. Been frustrating to watch on both sides of the ball and the kicking game.
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This blows my mind. We should be at least 3-1 if we were going somewhere. It's unnaceptable as they say.
 
#62
#62
gasguy98 said:
I get it, fans want to win the SEC E and the SEC outright. Prolly should have beat the lizards and a boring win over a pathetic UMASS team has the future looking bleak.

Yet here we are at 3-1. I am going to watch the season play out before I get on the Butch has got to go train.

He is sitting on one heck of a class for '18. If he can give me at least 7 wins I am OK for one more chance.

HOWEVER, next year we absolutely must end the year in the top 10.

Just my thoughts as of today...
Click to expand...

*Spoiler Alert*

We lose.
 
#63
#63
gasguy98 said:
I get it, fans want to win the SEC E and the SEC outright. Prolly should have beat the lizards and a boring win over a pathetic UMASS team has the future looking bleak.

Yet here we are at 3-1. I am going to watch the season play out before I get on the Butch has got to go train.

He is sitting on one heck of a class for '18. If he can give me at least 7 wins I am OK for one more chance.

HOWEVER, next year we absolutely must end the year in the top 10.

Just my thoughts as of today...
Click to expand...

I agree and in all honesty am good with 9 won seasons! There was a short period of time where we became accustomed to 10+ win seasons..... we haven’t been there for a while and not really too many SEC teams that are. 9 won season with a SEC East championship sprinkled in and I’d be ok with Butch for the foreseeable future.

My concern is that that is not accomplishable this year if we lose Saturday.
 
#64
#64
I'm with you, OP.

My view on Butch after the past two games has become much more decidedly pessimistic, but I also think a lot depends on whether Larry Scott can figure out the offense. He is a 1st Year OC. It's possible that by late October or November, we're suddenly putting up 40 points per game and the early season struggles look like a thing of the past.
 
#65
#65
DiderotsGhost said:
I'm with you, OP.

My view on Butch after the past two games has become much more decidedly pessimistic, but I also think a lot depends on whether Larry Scott can figure out the offense. He is a 1st Year OC. It's possible that by late October or November, we're suddenly putting up 40 points per game and the early season struggles look like a thing of the past.
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The offense hasn’t changed in 5 years. It’s not the OC.
 
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#66
#66
jasonvol18 said:
He definitely would be a great hire. Just not sure we would be willing to pay a 5 mill buyout on top of the 10 to Butch and his staff. And would he leave VA Tech? I would definitely make him say no thanks.
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Sunday on tv Hyams said UT has 17 mil in reserve. Said it wouldn't be a problem.
 
#67
#67
VolunteerHillbilly said:
I guess the flipside is do you settle for 8-win seasons and winning some meaningless bowl games against pedestrian competition, or do you do something to try and get better results?
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We have a LOCK on the Music City and Belk Bowls for a generation....if only we are brave enough to grasp it!
 
#68
#68
If Butch Jones could lead team 121 past this Georgia team, I may have to consider it a miracle and worthy of exceptional merit, But, I'm not sure I believe in miracles, you?:good!:
 
#69
#69
VOL_Lyfe said:
We have a LOCK on the Music City and Belk Bowls for a generation....if only we are brave enough to grasp it!
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I guess, in this crazy world we live in, the Vols are getting what they paid for in Butch Jones, no?:cray:
 
#70
#70
DiderotsGhost said:
I'm with you, OP.

My view on Butch after the past two games has become much more decidedly pessimistic, but I also think a lot depends on whether Larry Scott can figure out the offense. He is a 1st Year OC. It's possible that by late October or November, we're suddenly putting up 40 points per game and the early season struggles look like a thing of the past.
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It’s Butch’s offense. Doesn’t matter who the OC. We’ve had a couple and the offense hasn’t really changed that much. He will live or die by his offense and his refusal to adapt it to the players he recruited.
 
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#71
#71
Mediocre people settle for mediocre results, and subsequently, mediocre lives. If you still think Butch can coach at this point, you're simply refusing to accept reality. Or you are content with mediocrity.
 
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#72
#72
volfan_89 said:
It’s Butch’s offense. Doesn’t matter who the OC. We’ve had a couple and the offense hasn’t really changed that much. He will live or die by his offense and his refusal to adapt it to the players he recruited.
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Indeed!
"refusal to adapt it to the players he recruited."

The DEATH SENTENCE for BUTCH JONES?
 
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