Lebron

#102
#102
Freak said:
As you should. Z is like 13. His basketball knowledge goes back to like the last five years.
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Lol Don't tell him but as far as old school guys go I value his opinion on here more than anyone's. Now I have to go scrub in bleach. Lol
 
#105
#105
zjcvols said:
Agree that crew sucked but I think people overrate Kobe a lot on his first three rings when that was all Shaq/Phil and a hell of a supporting cast.
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I don't know, seems like you want to diminish the titles he had, then punish him for not getting back.

Kobe was a fantastic player, but like most greats, he needs a sidekick on the team. He couldn't handle that, and it hurts his legacy greatly.
 
#108
#108
BadJerry20 said:
Lol Don't tell him but as far as old school guys go I value his opinion on here more than anyone's. Now I have to go scrub in bleach. Lol
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Fair enough. When it comes to sports, he's the smartest teenager I know.
 
#109
#109
Freak said:
I don't know, seems like you want to diminish the titles he had, then punish him for not getting back.

Kobe was a fantastic player, but like most greats, he needs a sidekick on the team. He couldn't handle that, and it hurts his legacy greatly.
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My main point is Kobe gets overrated being Shaq's sidekick when a lot of really good two guards could have taken his place.
 
#112
#112
zjcvols said:
My main point is Kobe gets overrated being Shaq's sidekick when a lot of really good two guards could have taken his place.
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We're not going to agree. I feel like we're talking about two different players. Idk, maybe my memory is selective, but I remember Kobe being able to take over games and put the team on his back at times. Apparently, I'm in the minority that thinks highly of his career, even though I never really liked him as a player.
 
#114
#114
I've been a LBJ fan my whole life growing up. I always thought he was very exciting to watch but I will say this. I do think he over exaggerates contact and plays soft a times. I don't know if he's just trying to get inside his opponents heads or what but if he was more mentally tougher, I don't think he could be stopped by any team regardless how good they are. I do think Lebron will finish in the NBA's Top 5 best players when he retires. He's a rare talent.
 
#116
#116
VolFreakJosh said:
I've been a LBJ fan my whole life growing up. I always thought he was very exciting to watch but I will say this. I do think he over exaggerates contact and plays soft a times. I don't know if he's just trying to get inside his opponents heads or what but if he was more mentally tougher, I don't think he could be stopped by any team regardless how good they are. I do think Lebron will finish in the NBA's Top 5 best players when he retires. He's a rare talent.
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yep.
 
#117
#117
Freak said:
I don't disagree with this. Lebron took a huge step last year.
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Lebron has had probably the top 3 greatest finals performances i've ever seen. That's counting the last loss to the spurs. He was incredible and should have won mvp
 
#118
#118
zjcvols said:
Thia is the question I always ask about Kobe. Switch him with Tracy McGrady or Vince Carter during the Shaq years. Does anything change? Kobe's teams did nothing after Shaq and before Pau.
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Jeff Hornacek in his prime makes them better than Kobe did. JH had all the tools and tho not as much talent as Kobe, he's a much better shooter and setup guy. I think they win 4-5 titles with shaq and JH. Kobe was not a great fit with that team.

To Kobe's credit, he was awesome in the other 2 title runs and JH couldn't have done that.
 
#121
#121
Freak said:
We're not going to agree. I feel like we're talking about two different players. Idk, maybe my memory is selective, but I remember Kobe being able to take over games and put the team on his back at times. Apparently, I'm in the minority that thinks highly of his career, even though I never really liked him as a player.
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I'm with ya on Kobe
 
#122
#122
Freak said:
We're not going to agree. I feel like we're talking about two different players. Idk, maybe my memory is selective, but I remember Kobe being able to take over games and put the team on his back at times. Apparently, I'm in the minority that thinks highly of his career, even though I never really liked him as a player.
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Perception is reality. Kobe got 3 titles early and every time he hit a game winner or closed out a win, he got credited with being clutch. The misses got ignored...

...his success rate in the clutch was not that good. Also, Lakers had the highest scoring team over like a 13 year period but they were LEAGUE AVERAGE in 4th quarter scoring and that's when Kobe "takes over" and starts ballhogging.

If Kobe doesn't have a crippling ego, i think he's the 2nd best SG of all time. He made a career out of taking bad shots and being a bad teammate. He's not quite in my top 10 SGs.
 
#123
#123
BTW, people were talking GOAT conversation...

To me, there are few different directions this conversation can go. I'll stick to modern era players.

If GOAT is the most dominant player, it's MJ. In his prime, he was unstoppable.

If GOAT is the guy who had the best 10-12 year of basketball, it's Magic and it's not even close.

If GOAT is the guy who had the most productive career, it's John Stockton.

If GOAT is the guy you would start at all 5 positions if you had to, it's Lebron and it's not even close.

Honorable mention, Rodman brought so much value and you could literally add him to any squad and he wouldn't interrupt the flow of the team and he'd be able to give you his best ball. Think about adding any of these guys to Golden St this year, who would you pick? For me it's Rodman and it's no question.
 
#124
#124
n_huffhines said:
Perception is reality. Kobe got 3 titles early and every time he hit a game winner or closed out a win, he got credited with being clutch. The misses got ignored...

...his success rate in the clutch was not that good. Also, Lakers had the highest scoring team over like a 13 year period but they were LEAGUE AVERAGE in 4th quarter scoring and that's when Kobe "takes over" and starts ballhogging.

If Kobe doesn't have a crippling ego, i think he's the 2nd best SG of all time. He made a career out of taking bad shots and being a bad teammate. He's not quite in my top 10 SGs.
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I have to somewhat agree with you. I don't think Kobe is an NBA Top 10 player but I still believe he's very underrated despite his ego. One thing that still bugs me is you still have people that believe Kobe was a better player than Lebron was. I think Lebron has already accomplished more than Kobe being at the age of 32. I guarantee if you switched Lebron's & Kobe's older teams, Lebron would have more titles. The Cavaliers were nothing until Lebron got there. He WAS their team.
 
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