Lebron

#128
#128
Kobe let the shadow of MJ get in his head. When everybody was looking for the next MJ, he bought into that and tried to be who he thought MJ was.

Lebron realized nobody is MJ. When people said "that's not what MJ would do" somewhere along the line Lebron stopped caring and said "I'm not MJ".

Both of them have the talent to be in the GOAT conversation, but that subtle difference in their approach to the game is what puts Lebron in the convo and takes Kobe out of it.
 
#131
#131
Kobe's teams sucked unless he had the best frontcourt in the NBA. Without it, he's a chucker losing in the first round just like Westbrook.
 
#132
#132
BadJerry20 said:
It would have let people see the other side of MJ, and would have had more "haters" as a result. He would have been the GOAT no matter what, but people's perception of who he was would be pretty altered. IMO
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There would be a lot more analysis about his dad's death and his reasons for "retiring" to play baseball
 
#133
#133
95 Vol Alum said:
How do you measure a productive career? I would think Tim Duncan but maybe I'm not seeing it the same way.
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Duncan has a better resume than Stockton, but Stockton has the better stats and that's what I mean by "productive". They both played 19 years. According to wins produced:

Duncan had 6 seasons where he was 2.5x as productive as the average PF and 14 seasons 2x as productive.

Stockton had 11 seasons where he was 3x as productive as the average PG and 17 seasons 2.5x as productive.

Stockton still has the greatest 2 seasons by a PG, IMO. He did 17 and 14 twice, shooting a TS% of .604+ with 4:1 a:to (and one of those seasons he was 2nd team all-defensive). He was a point god.
 
#134
#134
Freak said:
lol.

I'm at a point in my sports-watching career where I want to see legends. I want to be able to watch some of the best players who have ever played the game. Lebron is one of those guys, but I still think there's more. He has the body and the skills to be even more dominant than he is, imo.
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He could work on shooting, but other than that, how much more dominant can he be? In Miami, he had years where he shot like 56% and 40% from 3, and then last year's Finals was one of the most dominant performances of all time.
 
#135
#135
n_huffhines said:
Perception is reality. Kobe got 3 titles early and every time he hit a game winner or closed out a win, he got credited with being clutch. The misses got ignored...

...his success rate in the clutch was not that good. Also, Lakers had the highest scoring team over like a 13 year period but they were LEAGUE AVERAGE in 4th quarter scoring and that's when Kobe "takes over" and starts ballhogging.
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Fans like hero ball. Like you said, people remember when it works (against teams like the Magic) and forget when it doesn't (against most teams who are any good). People put too much stock into performances like Booker scoring 70 IMO.

The year Kobe's fanbase grew the most, at least around me, was when he scored like 35 a game, even though they missed the playoffs entirely.
 
#136
#136
NashVol11 said:
He could work on shooting, but other than that, how much more dominant can he be? In Miami, he had years where he shot like 56% and 40% from 3, and then last year's Finals was one of the most dominant performances of all time.
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He's well into his 30s* now and did 25, 8, 8, and 50% this year, which is almost as rare as averaging a triple double.

I don't understand how anybody could reasonably expect Lebron to be better than he is.

*MJ was 25 when he did it and Big O was 24 when he did it.
 
#137
#137
When MJ did it, he shot .538 FG% and only took 1.2 3PA per game.

Lebron shot .548 FG% and took 4.6 3PA per game.
 
#138
#138
BadJerry20 said:
Who is everybodys top 7? MJ, Magic, Bird, LBJ, Kareem, Wilt, and Duncan...today, i change my mind daily.
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How anyone names a couple bigs and excludes Olajuwon is beyond me.

https://youtu.be/9J-WJ5739Tg

One of the most electrifying bigs that will ever step on a court.

I love Shaq and Duncan, but Hakeem was unstoppable. He made Ewing, Robinson, and Shaq look silly trying to guard him.
 
#139
#139
TheColdVolTruth said:
How anyone names a couple bigs and excludes Olajuwon is beyond me.

https://youtu.be/9J-WJ5739Tg

One of the most electrifying bigs that will ever step on a court.

I love Shaq and Duncan, but Hakeem was unstoppable. He made Ewing, Robinson, and Shaq look silly trying to guard him.
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Because it was a top 7 and naming more guys would make it not a top 7. Lol

Hakeem was great, but he couldn't guard Shaq either, and Admiral was just as good. Ewing wouldn't make my top 20.
 
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