Kellie Harper discussion/debate thread [merged]

#2,101
#2,101
OrangeBeachVol said:
I don't think there is poster on here who doesn't 'like' Kellie, including Darth, ha. But liking her coaching is another thing. College sports is a business and with the LV's comes high expectations. The old guard is gone now. We have an AD that looks at winning and wants all TN sports teams to be successful at a high level. Under this new AD Kellie's history with LV's will only carry her so far. And I also like Kellie and want her to take this team to the next level but.....................
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Very likeable and she looks like she can coach some of the time. This year seems to be her worst as she got a better roster and then tried to give some players a lot of minutes that probably shouldn't be in the rotation. Added that she has decided on man to man defense and have some players in the game to much that can't cut it . They may have the right technique and know how, but you also need to have speed and athletic ability to play in that defense see Barnes Vols. The Lady Vols are getting beaten on drives badly to many times in a game and to slow closing out on the three. Just a matter of not having the ability more than the know how they have been taught.
 
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#2,102
#2,102
Volfan2012 said:
Very likeable and she looks like she can coach some of the time. This year seems to be her worst as she got a better roster and then tried to give some players a lot of minutes that probably shouldn't be in the rotation. Added that she has decided on man to man defense and have some players in the game to much that can't cut it . They may have the right technique and know how, but you also need to have speed and athletic ability to play in that defense see Barnes Vols. The Lady Vols are getting beaten on drives badly to many times in a game and to slow closing out on the three. Just a matter of not having the ability more than the know how they have been taught.
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I have more doubts about Kellie than I did last year. I was really impressed at how the team responded after Rae's injury and how they played up to the injury to Green. And that team played with great defensive intensity and their defense kept them in games when the offensive was lacking. And they did it with many of these same players. Missing are Key and Dye (and Green and Burrell). But the transfers with the exception of Key correspond to those roster losses. But, the team is just not as locked in and has not adjusted (even now) to not having Key patrolling the paint. I don't think Kellie is lacking in X&O knowledge and I think she still has player buy-in. For me the question is she adaptable? She seems too slow to adjust to changes like Key's loss or the ineffectiveness of her preferred sub patterns. I would hate to see a promising coach done in by stubbornness.
 
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#2,103
#2,103
madtownvol said:
She seems too slow to adjust to changes like Key's loss
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On defense yes, but not sure how you adjust to not having an uber tall shot swatting machine as your failsafe.

OTOH, I give KJH credit for quickly trying to go with a more mobile offense when TK went out. We all noted how passing improved, spacing was better, assists went up, t.overs went down. Now we're in the harder part of the schedule and some personnel issues are cropping up again, such as PG play. She did see and act on the opportunity there tho.
 
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#2,104
#2,104
madtownvol said:
I have more doubts about Kellie than I did last year. I was really impressed at how the responded after Rae's injury and how they played up to the injury to Green. And that team played with great defensive intensity and their defense kept them in games when the offensive was lacking. And they did it with many of these sames players. Missing are Key and Dye (and Green and Burrell). But the transfers with the exception of Key correspond to those losses. But, the team is just not as locked in and has not adjusted (even now) to not having Key patrolling the paint. I don't think Kellie is lacking in X&O knowledge and I think she still has player buy-in. For me the question is she adaptable? She seems too slow to adjust to changes like Key's loss or the ineffectiveness of her preferred sub patterns. I would hate to see a promising coach done in by stubbornness.
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I want her to succeed here haven't been disappointed in what she did up until this season. I really expected more. Regular season is important but the NCAA Tourney is where is get your answer on success. I thought we were an elite 8 and possibly a final four in the beginning. I don't think about the final four anymore, but if they could pull together I think they could still reach the elite eight. I know that sounds like crazy talk now, but I think we have the talent we just need better coaching decisions with the personnel. I can see who is effective on defense and who isn't. The coaches have to be able to see it too. Coach Kellie keeps saying we have to get better on defense and yes they do and it has to happen soon.
 
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#2,106
#2,106
OrangeBeachVol said:
I don't think there is poster on here who doesn't 'like' Kellie, including Darth, ha. But liking her coaching is another thing. College sports is a business and with the LV's comes high expectations. The old guard is gone now. We have an AD that looks at winning and wants all TN sports teams to be successful at a high level. Under this new AD Kellie's history with LV's will only carry her so far. And I also like Kellie and want her to take this team to the next level but.....................
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That's absolutely accurate. And honestly, I 'like" Holly too. That doesn't make them the coaches to take this program where it needs to go. They made the mistake of keeping Holly around too long, I hope they don't make the same mistake twice...
 
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#2,107
#2,107
glv98 said:
On defense yes, but not sure how you adjust to not having an uber tall shot swatting machine as your failsafe.

OTOH, I give KJH credit for quickly trying to go with a more mobile offense when TK went out. We all noted how passing improved, spacing was better, assists went up, t.overs went down. Now we're in the harder part of the schedule and some personnel issues are cropping up again, such as PG play. She did see and act on the opportunity there tho.
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Simple. You guard the ball better. The UT men’s team doesn’t have a great shot blocker but they’re on track to have the greatest defense in modern college basketball history. A big reason why is they rarely get beaten off the dribble. That happens to this LV team all the time. We need to recruit more athletic guards.
 
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#2,108
#2,108
Fatoldman said:
Based on what? Because she did well in high school? This is D1. Her D1 performances have been so so at best.
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So so based off time go given. I do agree this is D1, which is why those ahead of her with experience lack athleticism and point production in big games is frustrating. Tess has to give more than 6 points if her job is to be stationary catch and shoot. I’m not saying she’s a starter but based off what’s ahead of her, her number should be drastically higher. Holdsclaw isn’t who’s in front of her.
 
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#2,109
#2,109
madtownvol said:
I have more doubts about Kellie than I did last year. I was really impressed at how the team responded after Rae's injury and how they played up to the injury to Green. And that team played with great defensive intensity and their defense kept them in games when the offensive was lacking. And they did it with many of these same players. Missing are Key and Dye (and Green and Burrell). But the transfers with the exception of Key correspond to those roster losses. But, the team is just not as locked in and has not adjusted (even now) to not having Key patrolling the paint. I don't think Kellie is lacking in X&O knowledge and I think she still has player buy-in. For me the question is she adaptable? She seems too slow to adjust to changes like Key's loss or the ineffectiveness of her preferred sub patterns. I would hate to see a promising coach done in by stubbornness.
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I think that it's also highly likely that having someone like Key last season masked a lot of the coaching problems and made Kellie look like a better coach than she really was. Yeah, the offense was ragged, but Key was such a defensive presence that she kept them in games that otherwise they would've lost. To an extent, Rickea and Jordan are doing the same thing this season with great 1-on-1 play on offense...which works great until one (or both) of them gets bottled up by the right defensive strategy. Then the game proceeds with the other 3 players either just standing around watching or praying for an offensive rebound.
 
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#2,110
#2,110
Volfan2012 said:
Very likeable and she looks like she can coach some of the time. This year seems to be her worst as she got a better roster and then tried to give some players a lot of minutes that probably shouldn't be in the rotation. Added that she has decided on man to man defense and have some players in the game to much that can't cut it . They may have the right technique and know how, but you also need to have speed and athletic ability to play in that defense see Barnes Vols. The Lady Vols are getting beaten on drives badly to many times in a game and to slow closing out on the three. Just a matter of not having the ability more than the know how they have been taught.
Click to expand...
 
#2,111
#2,111
Volfan2012 said:
I want her to succeed here haven't been disappointed in what she did up until this season. I really expected more. Regular season is important but the NCAA Tourney is where is get your answer on success. I thought we were an elite 8 and possibly a final four in the beginning. I don't think about the final four anymore, but if they could pull together I think they could still reach the elite eight. I know that sounds like crazy talk now, but I think we have the talent we just need better coaching decisions with the personnel. I can see who is effective on defense and who isn't. The coaches have to be able to see it too. Coach Kellie keeps saying we have to get better on defense and yes they do and it has to happen soon.
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I am gonna give Darth his due in his diagnosis that Kellie is a mid-major coach but I draw a different conclusion. I don't think being a mid major is a genetic condition that can't be changed or that it means she lacks some secret knowledge shared by power 1 coaches. It is a tendency and a successful mid major coach gets use to coaching a team of work horses. None of them stars and there is not a lot of differentiation in their abilities (they are generally fair to good players). So, you platoon with this army and try to out work and out hustle more talented teams. And it easy to treat everybody the same and have them have the same responsibilities (every body crashes the boards and so on),

Power 1 coaches recognize the necessity of star power and letting players have different roles. For example, Rickea has been getting a lot of points of rebounds. Is that good? That means we are using a race horse as a work horse. I would rather see Rickea out on the perimeter, moving and cutting and creating. A start oriented coach might have handled Justine differently (though I think it will turn out well for her but I think she could have been fast tracked) and, as per gvl98, you can't be loyal to the dependable work horse when a faster race horse is available. I remember CPS said, when the Candace Parker class was coming in, that it motivated her existing players because they knew who was coming (in other words, get my game up our I am sitting behind these freshman)

Kellie has cut the rotation but we are still not at the point of riding Rickea and Horston the way that Iowa using Clark or UConn uses Fudd or Bueckers (when healthy).
 
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#2,112
#2,112
Volfan2012 said:
I want her to succeed here haven't been disappointed in what she did up until this season. I really expected more. Regular season is important but the NCAA Tourney is where is get your answer on success. I thought we were an elite 8 and possibly a final four in the beginning. I don't think about the final four anymore, but if they could pull together I think they could still reach the elite eight. I know that sounds like crazy talk now, but I think we have the talent we just need better coaching decisions with the personnel. I can see who is effective on defense and who isn't. The coaches have to be able to see it too. Coach Kellie keeps saying we have to get better on defense and yes they do and it has to happen soon.
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If this team ends up a 7 seed as currently projected, they will have to upset a 2 seed just to get to the sweet 16. Elite 8 or beyond feels like a bridge too far at this point.
 
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#2,113
#2,113
SGMVols said:
If this team ends up a 7 seed as currently projected, they will have to upset a 2 seed just to get to the sweet 16. Elite 8 or beyond feels like a bridge too far at this point.
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That is the dark cloud looming on the horizon. They have to play themselves into at least a 5 slot or it looks really grim and the clock is ticking.
 
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#2,115
#2,115
SGMVols said:
If this team ends up a 7 seed as currently projected, they will have to upset a 2 seed just to get to the sweet 16. Elite 8 or beyond feels like a bridge too far at this point.
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To far at this point for sure was counting on improvement which may or may not happen.
 
#2,116
#2,116
madtownvol said:
I am gonna give Darth his due in his diagnosis that Kellie is a mid-major coach but I draw a different conclusion. I don't think being a mid major is a genetic condition that can't be changed or that it means she lacks some secret knowledge shared by power 1 coaches. It is a tendency and a successful mid major coach gets use to coaching a team of work horses. None of them stars and there is not a lot of differentiation in their abilities (they are generally fair to good players). So, you platoon with this army and try to out work and out hustle more talented teams. And it easy to treat everybody the same and have them have the same responsibilities (every body crashes the boards and so on),

Power 1 coaches recognize the necessity of star power and letting players have different roles. For example, Rickea has been getting a lot of points of rebounds. Is that good? That means we are using a race horse as a work horse. I would rather see Rickea out on the perimeter, moving and cutting and creating. A start oriented coach might have handled Justine differently (though I think it will turn out well for her but I think she could have been fast tracked) and, as per gvl98, you can't be loyal to the dependable work horse when a faster race horse is available. I remember CPS said, when the Candace Parker class was coming in, that it motivated her existing players because they knew who was coming (in others, get my game up our I am sitting behind these freshman)

Kellie has cut the rotation but we are still not at the point of riding Rickea and Horston the way that Iowa using Clark or UConn uses Fudd or Bueckers (when healthy).
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I think this is exactly true everyone seems to have equal billing and there seems to be no idea who the top five are and who the backups should be. We all rebound we all shoot. Rodman didn't shoot that much he had a different role on the teams he was on. Roles are important. How much you should ride the elite players cause they have star power means they are the ones that are going to be the most efficient scorers so yes they need more opportunity. Of course Rickea needs to be on the perimeter and we need to be running a lot of plays for her to get the ball in her spots not just having to create off a pass.
 
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#2,117
#2,117
madtownvol said:
That is the dark cloud looming on the horizon. They have to play themselves into at least a 5 slot or it looks really grim and the clock is ticking.
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Yes were in a bad situation we could make it better, but I don't really have a good feeling that we will.
 
#2,120
#2,120
larjoranj said:
Would Kellie have an equal amount of support today if she had played at Nebraska or Bumfuzzle State instead of UT?
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Hey now, Bumfuzzle State is a good damn school. My cousin got his degree in Labology at Bumfuzzle State. They know how to box out down there. And set high ball screens.
 
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