Keep hearing how bad the East is so lets look at some history shall we?

#1
BigOrangeTrain

BigOrangeTrain

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#1
So I have seen quite a few people mention how bad the SEC East is and how Butch failed to win it. I was curious as to how "great" the East has been. So I went back to Fulmers first season in 1992 for my start. I only counted conference games.

1992
Florida (10)- 6-2
Georgia (8)- 6-2
Tenn (12)- 5-3
SC- 3-5
UK- 2-6
Vandy- 2-6

1993
UF (5)- 7-1
UT (12)- 7-1
UK- 4-4
SC- 2-6
UGA- 2-6
Vandy- 1-7

1994
UF (7)- 7-1
UT (22)- 5-3
SC- 4-4
UGA- 3-4
Vandy- 2-6
UK- 0-8

1995
UF (2)- 8-0
UT (3)- 7-1
UGA- 3-5
SC- 2-5-1
UK- 2-6
Vandy- 1-7

1996
UF (1)- 8-0
UT (9)- 7-1
SC- 4-4
UK- 3-5
UGA- 3-5
Vandy- 0-8

1997
UT (7)- 7-1
UGA (10)- 6-2
UF (4)- 6-2
SC- 3-5
UK- 2-6
Vandy- 0-8

1998
UT (1)- 8-0
UF (5)- 7-1
UGA (14)- 6-2
UK- 4-4
Vandy- 1-7
SC- 0-8

1999
UF (12)- 7-1
UT (9)- 6-2
UGA (16)- 5-3
UK- 4-4
Vandy- 206
SC- 0-8

2000
UF (10)- 7-1
UGA (20)- 5-3
SC (19)- 5-3
UT- 5-3
Vandy- 1-7
UK- 0-8

2001
UT (4)- 7-1
UF (3)- 6-2
SC (13)- 5-3
UGA (22)- 5-3
UK- 1-7
Vandy- 0-8

2002
UGA (3)- 7-1
UF- 6-2
UT- 5-3
UK- 3-5
SC- 3-5
Vandy- 0-8

2003
UGA (7)- 6-2
UT (15)- 6-2
UF (24)- 6-2
SC- 2-6
UK- 1-7
Vandy- 1-7

2004
UT (13)- 7-1
UGA (7)- 6-2
UF- 4-4
SC- 4-4
UK- 1-7
Vandy- 1-7

2005
UGA (10)- 6-2
UF (12)- 5-3
SC- 5-3
UT- 3-5
Vandy- 3-5
UK- 2-6

2006
UF (1)- 7-1
UT (25)- 5-3
UK- 4-4
UGA- 4-4
SC- 3-5
Vandy 1-7

2007
UT (12)- 6-2
UGA (2)- 6-2
UF (13)- 5-3
SC- 3-5
UK- 3-5
Vandy 2-6

2008
UF (1)- 7-1
UGA (13)- 6-2
Vandy- 4-4
SC- 4-4
UT- 3-5
UK- 2-6

2009
UF (3)- 8-0
UGA- 4-4
UT- 4-4
UK- 3-5
SC- 3-5
Vandy- 0-8

2010
SC (22)- 5-3
UF- 4-4
UGA- 3-5
UT- 3-5
UK- 2-6
Vandy- 1-7

2011
UGA (19)- 7-1
SC (9)- 6-2
UF- 3-5
Vandy 2-6
UT- 1-7

2012
UGA (5)- 7-1
UF (9)= 7-1
SC (8)- 6-2
Vandy (23)- 5-3
Missori- 2-6
UT- 1-7
UK- 0-8

2013
Missouri (5)- 7-1
SC (4)- 6-2
UGA- 5-3
Vandy (24)- 4-4
UF- 3-5
UT- 2-6
UK- 0-8

2014
Missouri (14)- 7-1
UGA (9)- 6-2
UT- 3-5
SC- 3-5
UK- 2-6
Vandy- 0-8

2015
UF (25)- 7-1
UT (22)- 5-3
UGA- 5-3
Vandy- 2-6
Missouri- 1-7
SC- 1-7

2016 so far and lets assume
UF (13)- 6-2
UT (24)- 5-3
UGA- 4-4
UK- 4-4
SC- 3-5
Vandy 2-6
Missouri- 1-7

So now that's all done, I wanted to look at the bowl eligibility of each team in those seasons. Since 6 wins gets you to a bowl game.

1992- 3
1993- 3
1994- 2
1995- 2
1996- 2
1997- 3
1998- 4
1999- 3
2000- 4
2001- 4
2002- 4
2003- 3
2004- 3
2005- 3
2006- 5
2007- 4
2008- 4
2009- 5
2010- 5
2011- 4
2012- 4
2013- 4
2014- 5
2015- 3
2016- 5 (possibly 6)


So this year, there is the possibility of 6 teams being bowl eligible. That has not happened at least since 1992. As a matter of fact, 5 teams being bowl eligible in Fulmer's time only happened once. These numbers are skewed a little bit because Missouri came in to the East in 2012.

In the 90's, the East was basically a 2 team division. Georgia was decent for a few seasons but that's it. Vandy, UK and SC were basically trash for a decade at least.

So if someone wants to say the East is somehow so much weaker then the 90's, then stats disagree with you. The East was infinitely weaker in the 90's.
 
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#2
#2
Great stats and I agree, I will say that people will argue with validity that Tenn and Florida were more dominant nationally in the 90's. But your point is correct and well taken, the east has always had bad teams in the bottom half with bad records. I don't take the bowl thing as serious as they have added way to many bowl games, heck these days they have to hope for enough 6 win teams just to fill all the bowls. Great stats though and sheds some true light on things. GBO!
 
#3
#3
I think it's mainly because of the East's record vs the West being so terrible that people are drawing these conclusions.
 
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#4
#4
OP I think your on to something here.

Kentucky & Candy, not just this year but over the past 4-5 years, are much more competitive than they have historically been over the past 20-30 years.

I'll ignore Safe-Place-U, they were brought in to the SEC so Candy would have a team to be better than. Candy just screwed that up this year.

Where the SEC is actually at an all time low is in not having a consensus top-10 team. Between USCe, Florida, & Georgia over the last ten years the east seemed to always have at least one team start or finish in the top 10. After the last 10 years you could easily go back another 10 for 20 years of the east having a top 10 team with UT in the mix.

So in not having at least one consensus top 10 team then yes; the east is at a pretty historic low.

However the bottom 3-7, or 3-6, has certainly been much less competitive than it's present state.
 
#6
#6
Can you remember a season where 3 teams in the SECE had 1st year head coaches? I can't. You also have to remember that now you can get to a bowl with 5-7 record.
 
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#7
#7
Made a quick graph using that data to average yearly SEC wins for all of the East teams. This should show when the East was up or down relative to the SEC as a whole...

SEC EAST2.jpg


**** Averaging 4 wins means we are dead even with the West
 
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#8
#8
BeardedVol said:
Can you remember a season where 3 teams in the SECE had 1st year head coaches? I can't. You also have to remember that now you can get to a bowl with 5-7 record.
Click to expand...

Doesnt really matter does it? I mean people want to bash Butch unabated and dont want to be bothered by nothing more than wins and losses right? Its all about winning and losing right? Well then details dont mean jack. Stats are stats and facts are facts.
 
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#9
#9
SayNoToJorts said:
Made a quick graph using that data to average yearly SEC wins for all of the East teams. This should show when the East was up or down relative to the SEC as a whole...

View attachment 123831


**** Averaging 4 wins means we are dead even with the West
Click to expand...

Nobody has talked about whether the East has been down compared to the SEC as a whole. The crux of the argument is this, Butch failed to win the East whe its been the weakest its ever been. Taking the stats I have produced, obliterated that argument.
 
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#10
#10
BigOrangeTrain said:
Nobody has talked about whether the East has been down compared to the SEC as a whole. The crux of the argument is this, Butch failed to win the East whe its been the weakest its ever been. Taking the stats I have produced, obliterated that argument.
Click to expand...

Did you? Isn't it a lot easier to get in a bowl now than the early 90's?
 
#12
#12
BigOrangeTrain said:
So I have seen quite a few people mention how bad the SEC East is and how Butch failed to win it. I was curious as to how "great" the East has been. So I went back to Fulmers first season in 1992 for my start. I only counted conference games.


So now that's all done, I wanted to look at the bowl eligibility of each team in those seasons. Since 6 wins gets you to a bowl game.

1992- 3
1993- 3
1994- 2
1995- 2
1996- 2
1997- 3
1998- 4
1999- 3
2000- 4
2001- 4
2002- 4
2003- 3
2004- 3
2005- 3
2006- 5
2007- 4
2008- 4
2009- 5
2010- 5
2011- 4
2012- 4
2013- 4
2014- 5
2015- 3
2016- 5 (possibly 6)


So this year, there is the possibility of 6 teams being bowl eligible. That has not happened at least since 1992. As a matter of fact, 5 teams being bowl eligible in Fulmer's time only happened once. These numbers are skewed a little bit because Missouri came in to the East in 2012.

In the 90's, the East was basically a 2 team division. Georgia was decent for a few seasons but that's it. Vandy, UK and SC were basically trash for a decade at least.

So if someone wants to say the East is somehow so much weaker then the 90's, then stats disagree with you. The East was infinitely weaker in the 90's.
Click to expand...

only problem with your theory is not every team that had 6 wins was bowl eligible...6 wins has become the new barometer of if a team is average...8 to 9 wins used to be considered average...10 to 12 wins was good/great year...

Of the times when everyone gets an participation award...average is somehow good...

...in 1992, there were only 18 available bowl games. In 2015, there are now 39 bowl games available.

And, BAM... Average is the new good and expectations are lowered..ala the millennial generation.
 
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#13
#13
I don't need a chart.

I know what kind of team Florida has put on the field during that time. I know what kind of team Florida has now.

Florida is not a good football team and they have won the division two years in a row. I know there are Gator teams in the past that did not win the division that would take this current Gator team and beat the hell out of them.

To argue that the division isn't that bad when a one dimensional team with quarterbacks such as Treon Harris, Luke Del Rio, and Austin Appleby are actually winning the thing is really a stretch.

There are Ron Zook teams that would kick the hell out of this Gator squad and I'm not kidding.
 
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#14
#14
99gator said:
I don't need a chart.

I know what kind of team Florida has put on the field during that time. I know what kind of team Florida has now.

Florida is not a good football team and they have won the division two years in a row. I know there are Gator teams in the past that did not win the division that would take this current Gator team and beat the hell out of them.

To argue that the division isn't that bad when a one dimensional team with quarterbacks such as Treon Harris, Luke Del Rio, and Austin Appleby are actually winning the thing is really a stretch.

There are Ron Zook teams that would kick the hell out of this Gator squad and I'm not kidding.
Click to expand...

It helps not having to play Bama every year.
 
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#16
#16
This analysis completely ignores how bad the SEC outside of Alabama is this year. Of course there are a lot of potential bowl teams. The teams with the best talent have had bad or at least subpar coaching, and there are a ton of bad rosters in this league. Alabama has a massive talent advantage and the best coaching staff, but after that there is a massive dropoff.
 
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#17
#17
BigOrangeTrain said:
Nobody has talked about whether the East has been down compared to the SEC as a whole. The crux of the argument is this, Butch failed to win the East whe its been the weakest its ever been. Taking the stats I have produced, obliterated that argument.
Click to expand...

No it didn't. The SEC East is still as weak as it's ever going to be. The SEC is down, too.
 
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#18
#18
When you try to win the East, the top is a far greater concern than the bottom. Vanderbilt, Kentucky, and maybe South Carolina are better than they used to be, but that doesn't make them good. Our 1990's teams would blow through the East this year, and Florida can make that claim as well.

Also, when you consider that there are more bowl games, an extra non-conference game, another horrible team in the division, and the fact that some teams can reach a bowl game with 5 wins, you realize that making a bowl just isn't what it used to be. There was a time (before the 1990's, even) where making a bowl was an accomplishment. That is no longer the case.
 
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#19
#19
All you've proven is that the top of the East has gotten so bad that the bottom of the league can compete with them.
 
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#20
#20
99gator said:
You do know this was the first time you beat Florida since Shula was at Alabama, right?

Count for me the amount of years where Alabama being on the scbedule was the determining factor
Click to expand...

Exactly right. South Carolina was the determining game this year. Thank you for bringing some sanity to this thread.
 
#21
#21
Since 2009 the SEC E. hasn't had a really dominant team. S. Carolina was decent for a few years. UGA was pretty good in '12. Had they beaten Bama in the '12 SEC CG they may have gotten a crack at ND. But that's about it.

The East is down as a whole. As far as making a bowl game keep in mind it's much easier with the addition of the 12th game. Look no further than UT schedule in 2014. UT had wins over:

Utah St.
Ark. St
UTC
S. Carolina
UK
Vandy

That's all it took to become bowl eligible.
 
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#22
#22
99gator said:
I don't need a chart.

I know what kind of team Florida has put on the field during that time. I know what kind of team Florida has now.

Florida is not a good football team and they have won the division two years in a row. I know there are Gator teams in the past that did not win the division that would take this current Gator team and beat the hell out of them.

To argue that the division isn't that bad when a one dimensional team with quarterbacks such as Treon Harris, Luke Del Rio, and Austin Appleby are actually winning the thing is really a stretch.

There are Ron Zook teams that would kick the hell out of this Gator squad and I'm not kidding.
Click to expand...

Sorry that stats disagree with you. Go back to your sewer now.
 
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