Jerry Green Question? Just Curious.

#51
#51
Won a lot of games with great talent, but underachieving post season record. We had North Carolina beat in the sweet 16 but choked it away.

I heard he didn't get along with UTAD, he supposedly has a "don't like it, then fire me" attitude.

He wasn't really a coach that warmed up to the fans either.
If we had beaten that UNC we play Florida for the NC (and we likely would’ve won)
 
  • Like
Reactions: vols 30
#52
#52
That was rough down the stretch

I used to get so mad at Charles Hathaway. 6'10 and built like a defensive lineman but could only manage 2 or 3 points a game

Hathaway and Black were recruited as two of the better post players in the country.

We lost to UNC as solid favorites.

One of the more explosive dunks I've seen at UT was what Haislip did to Kentucky.
 
#55
#55
If we had beaten that UNC we play Florida for the NC (and we likely would’ve won)
The UNC game was in the Sweet 16. If we had beaten UNC, we would have played Tulsa (coached by Bill Self) in the Elite 8. Tulsa had beaten Tennessee in December 88-68 in the championship game of a pre-season tournament just before Christmas. If Tennessee had beaten Tulsa, they would have advanced to the Final Four and played Florida. A win there would have put them in the NCAA Tournament Championship Game vs Michigan State.
 
#57
#57
The UNC game was in the Sweet 16. If we had beaten UNC, we would have played Tulsa (coached by Bill Self) in the Elite 8. Tulsa had beaten Tennessee in December 88-68 in the championship game of a pre-season tournament just before Christmas. If Tennessee had beaten Tulsa, they would have advanced to the Final Four and played Florida. A win there would have put them in the NCAA Tournament Championship Game vs Michigan State.
I had forgotten all about that beating Tulsa gave us that year. It was in the finals of the Puerto Rican Shootout, or something like that.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BowlBrother85
#58
#58
Cuonzo is an average (at best) coach. His system is about as fun as nails across a chalkboard. And he left on his own accord, possibly because some rednecks got mad (that he wasn't Bruce Pearl).
Bruce Pearl disagrees. He stated, correctly, that Martin got more out of his roster than Bruce could have. Yes, Martin did not have the used car salesman personality that UT fans find so entertaining . But that should not absolve the UT fans from the deplorable treatment to which Cuonzo was subjected. By the way, Cuonzo decided to leave after being told by his wife that she was not going to remain married to an Uncle Tom and he had to grow a pair or else.
 
  • Like
Reactions: StarRaider
#59
#59
Bruce Pearl disagrees. He stated, correctly, that Martin got more out of his roster than Bruce could have. Yes, Martin did not have the used car salesman personality that UT fans find so entertaining . But that should not absolve the UT fans from the deplorable treatment to which Cuonzo was subjected. By the way, Cuonzo decided to leave after being told by his wife that she was not going to remain married to an Uncle Tom and he had to grow a pair or else.
Martin did what he has done his whole career, have mediocre results, leave a place after 3-4 years and move on to the next disaster...

He had teams with 3 NBA players and was borderline NIT every year but 1
 
#60
#60
Bruce Pearl disagrees. He stated, correctly, that Martin got more out of his roster than Bruce could have. Yes, Martin did not have the used car salesman personality that UT fans find so entertaining . But that should not absolve the UT fans from the deplorable treatment to which Cuonzo was subjected. By the way, Cuonzo decided to leave after being told by his wife that she was not going to remain married to an Uncle Tom and he had to grow a pair or else.
Don’t let the screen door hit you on the way out honey
 
#61
#61
Bruce Pearl disagrees. He stated, correctly, that Martin got more out of his roster than Bruce could have. Yes, Martin did not have the used car salesman personality that UT fans find so entertaining . But that should not absolve the UT fans from the deplorable treatment to which Cuonzo was subjected. By the way, Cuonzo decided to leave after being told by his wife that she was not going to remain married to an Uncle Tom and he had to grow a pair or else.
Surely you realize that Pearl is being coy by saying that. Pearl left a very young and inexperienced roster, but that same roster would have looked much different had Pearl never been fired for his misdeeds and lost recruiting momentum due to the uncertainty of his own future. Regardless, Zo posted respectable results with what he had to work with in Year 1. The questionable coaching concern came in Year 3 when he had firmly established his archaic Devoe-esque system and took a team with Elite 8 talent and experience and struggled to make the NCAAT.

The "deplorable treatment" angle is also quite overstated. An extremely microscopic portion of our fanbase wanted Cuonzo gone for any reason unrelated to the fact that he relatively underachieved in year 3 with a pretty stacked roster, or the simple idea that he wasn't Bruce Pearl, and neither of those reasons were really legitimate coming off of a S16 run, regardless of how it happened. He deserved, and would have received more time based solely off of that equity, even if the following year was easily doomed to be a crash back to earth based on returning talent and the incoming class.

And again, we seemingly agree that Zo left on his own accord. No one forced him out, not even his wife. He had a choice, and he chose the door that left for Berkeley. Good for him, too. He cashed in on a really good NCAA run, and got paid well to do it. He knew his returning roster was a dumpster fire and he reset his clock by heading west.
 
#62
#62
Bruce Pearl disagrees. He stated, correctly, that Martin got more out of his roster than Bruce could have. Yes, Martin did not have the used car salesman personality that UT fans find so entertaining . But that should not absolve the UT fans from the deplorable treatment to which Cuonzo was subjected. By the way, Cuonzo decided to leave after being told by his wife that she was not going to remain married to an Uncle Tom and he had to grow a pair or else.
That is a deeply personal anecdote. How would you know something like that? It sounds made up.
 
#64
#64
My only insider story. Makes me no difference whether you believe
Sure ... and I guess poor little Cuonzo split on Cal, also after 3 seasons with 1 trip to the NCAA Tournament, because he was a victim there too? This is what Cuonzo does... he stays one year ahead of the ax. Although, this may have run its course with his latest stop. He may not be able to convince another Power 5 school to take him on, if he doesn't start recruiting better at Missouri. We will see.
 
#66
#66
Surely you realize that Pearl is being coy by saying that. Pearl left a very young and inexperienced roster, but that same roster would have looked much different had Pearl never been fired for his misdeeds and lost recruiting momentum due to the uncertainty of his own future. Regardless, Zo posted respectable results with what he had to work with in Year 1. The questionable coaching concern came in Year 3 when he had firmly established his archaic Devoe-esque system and took a team with Elite 8 talent and experience and struggled to make the NCAAT.

The "deplorable treatment" angle is also quite overstated. An extremely microscopic portion of our fanbase wanted Cuonzo gone for any reason unrelated to the fact that he relatively underachieved in year 3 with a pretty stacked roster, or the simple idea that he wasn't Bruce Pearl, and neither of those reasons were really legitimate coming off of a S16 run, regardless of how it happened. He deserved, and would have received more time based solely off of that equity, even if the following year was easily doomed to be a crash back to earth based on returning talent and the incoming class.

And again, we seemingly agree that Zo left on his own accord. No one forced him out, not even his wife. He had a choice, and he chose the door that left for Berkeley. Good for him, too. He cashed in on a really good NCAA run, and got paid well to do it. He knew his returning roster was a dumpster fire and he reset his clock by heading west.
We were not ranked in the preseason. This Elite Eight talent bs is just that.

He finished above expectations each year. There are literal polls to go by. Not what 10 people on a message board think.

Barnes had a much more talented roster in year three and got put out earlier in the tourney. Way more NBA talent and just as much experience. He had five NBA players on that team.

Barnes had the same expectations in the first two years as Zo and won less.

Year 4 Zo would have had Jaylen Brown so we don't know what he would have done.

Yet people think Zo was bad and hate him. Pretty funny to me. So yes deplorable would be correct.
 
#67
#67
We were not ranked in the preseason. This Elite Eight talent bs is just that.

He finished above expectations each year. There are literal polls to go by. Not what 10 people on a message board think.

Barnes had a much more talented roster in year three and got put out earlier in the tourney. Way more NBA talent and just as much experience. He had five NBA players on that team.

Barnes had the same expectations in the first two years as Zo and won less.

Year 4 Zo would have had Jaylen Brown so we don't know what he would have done.

Yet people think Zo was bad and hate him. Pretty funny to me. So yes deplorable would be correct.
They had Elite 8 talent by virtue of coming one possession shy of making the E8. Talent wasn't the issue. And honestly, if Zo had comfortably made the NCAAT with a 24-9 record instead of sneaking in with a 21-12 record and met the same fate (a narrow loss in the S16), that season would be remembered with much more appreciation instead of contention. In fact, that very season is the proof I use to combat the argument that the regular season doesn't mean anything in college basketball because "it is a postseason sport."

So, if you judge the results of that season by the final result, I say he met expectations. I believe I predicted us making it to the S16 and that was based on our talent and experience. I didn't care what the preseason polls said. I believed they were wrong to start with based on that talent and experience, but we spent the better part of 4 months proving them right by underachieving during the regular season with multiple unexplained losses. The team recovered at the right time rallying around a couple loud-mouth fans and a stupid petition.
 
#68
#68
They had Elite 8 talent by virtue of coming one possession shy of making the E8. Talent wasn't the issue. And honestly, if Zo had comfortably made the NCAAT with a 24-9 record instead of sneaking in with a 21-12 record and met the same fate (a narrow loss in the S16), that season would be remembered with much more appreciation instead of contention. In fact, that very season is the proof I use to combat the argument that the regular season doesn't mean anything in college basketball because "it is a postseason sport."

So, if you judge the results of that season by the final result, I say he met expectations. I believe I predicted us making it to the S16 and that was based on our talent and experience. I didn't care what the preseason polls said. I believed they were wrong to start with based on that talent and experience, but we spent the better part of 4 months proving them right by underachieving during the regular season with multiple unexplained losses. The team recovered at the right time rallying around a couple loud-mouth fans and a stupid petition.
It is a postseason sport. People who think otherwise don't know basketball.

There are plenty of teams that lost 3 or less games in a year and had failures of a season due to coming up short in the postseason.
 
#69
#69
They had Elite 8 talent by virtue of coming one possession shy of making the E8. Talent wasn't the issue. And honestly, if Zo had comfortably made the NCAAT with a 24-9 record instead of sneaking in with a 21-12 record and met the same fate (a narrow loss in the S16), that season would be remembered with much more appreciation instead of contention. In fact, that very season is the proof I use to combat the argument that the regular season doesn't mean anything in college basketball because "it is a postseason sport."

So, if you judge the results of that season by the final result, I say he met expectations. I believe I predicted us making it to the S16 and that was based on our talent and experience. I didn't care what the preseason polls said. I believed they were wrong to start with based on that talent and experience, but we spent the better part of 4 months proving them right by underachieving during the regular season with multiple unexplained losses. The team recovered at the right time rallying around a couple loud-mouth fans and a stupid petition.
IMO the bolded part is why many fans felt we underachieved that year. However, it is hard to argue with the postseason success, regardless of the path they took to get there.
The only part I would argue is whether or not his system was "fun." I don't ever recall leaving a game thinking that during his era. Most of the time even a win seemed mired in offensive philosophy deficiencies. Either way, seems like a good man and I hope he survives at Mizzou.
 
#70
#70
It is a postseason sport. People who think otherwise don't know basketball.

There are plenty of teams that lost 3 or less games in a year and had failures of a season due to coming up short in the postseason.
Edit: Nevermind, not worth it.

Just keep drinking the Cuonzo kool-aid. His track record everywhere he's been speaks for itself. His regular season record in the one successful postseason he's had as a high-major HC speaks for itself.

•12 years as a D1 HC at 4 schools
•3 trips to the NCAAT
•1 trip past the 1st rd.

A real picture of coaching success.
 
#71
#71
IMO the bolded part is why many fans felt we underachieved that year. However, it is hard to argue with the postseason success, regardless of the path they took to get there.
The only part I would argue is whether or not his system was "fun." I don't ever recall leaving a game thinking that during his era. Most of the time even a win seemed mired in offensive philosophy deficiencies. Either way, seems like a good man and I hope he survives at Mizzou.
I agree with most of that.

But, in a sense though, your issue with the offensive philosophical deficiencies in wins is seemingly a microcosm of other peoples' issues with the uninspiring seasonal path to postseason success in that 2013-14 run, right?
 
#72
#72
I agree with most of that.

But, in a sense though, your issue with the offensive philosophical deficiencies in wins is seemingly a microcosm of other peoples' issues with the uninspiring seasonal path to postseason success in that 2013-14 run, right?
If you're asking if the sluggish offense was secondary to the path the season took, I'd say absolutely. IMO, fans will support defensive-minded coaches as long as the team shows a continual path of progression. That team did not.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cncchris33
#73
#73
If you're asking if the sluggish offense was secondary to the path the season took, I'd say absolutely. IMO, fans will support defensive-minded coaches as long as the team shows a continual path of progression. That team did not.
Agree. I'm just saying that taking issue with offensive philosophy in a win is similar to taking issue with a mediocre, underachieving regular season that results in a successful postseason run.

The path/process matters to me. I can enjoy the result and still criticize the journey. It seems like we may agree on that.
 
  • Like
Reactions: lostsheep
#74
#74
Agree. I'm just saying that taking issue with offensive philosophy in a win is similar to taking issue with a mediocre, underachieving regular season that results in a successful postseason run.

The path/process matters to me. I can enjoy the result and still criticize the journey. It seems like we may agree on that.
I see what you’re saying, and agree. IMO, the meandering journey that team took, along with an off year in recruiting sealed his fate in the eyes of many fans.
 
#75
#75
Edit: Nevermind, not worth it.

Just keep drinking the Cuonzo kool-aid. His track record everywhere he's been speaks for itself. His regular season record in the one successful postseason he's had as a high-major HC speaks for itself.

•12 years as a D1 HC at 4 schools
•3 trips to the NCAAT
•1 trip past the 1st rd.

A real picture of coaching success.
Funny, I thought we were discussing UT basketball. Anything non UT tenure is irrelevant.
 

VN Store



Back
Top