Jarret Guarantano better than most vol fans think

[Behr]

Oh my goodness. Lol.

 

[MiramarVol]

Got beat up last year. Held the ball when he should have threw it into the stands a lot.. He really didn't get much time for plays to develop so it's hard to know. It wasn't all on the oline though. The scheme, QB, Oline were all at fault at times. Chaney will at least help establish a identity this year i hope. Oline will have to be good enough to get a tough yard when they need it. Something they couldn't do last year.

You have to be able to make it outside the tackles inorder to throw it into the stands. When every 3-4 man rush looks like a jailbreak, your eyes tend to look down at the rush and not always down field. I get JG made mistakes. I get he held on to the ball sometimes too long. His mentality was to not turn the ball over. He had to keep the offense on the field as long as possible just to give the defense a break.

 

[k-town_king]

I hope he becomes a great QB but he hasn't been one. With a "great" QB, UT becomes a passing O last year. He would have been allowed to read and throw hot routes to burn pressure. They would have made a living in the short and medium middle. Basically, he would have been UT's version of Drew Lock.

He's a very physically talented QB. If he can put the mental and decision making part together with Chaney, Tee, and Weinke then the potential is there. But to blame what happened last year all on the OL is to deny what your eyes tell you actually watching the game. You can't hold the ball as long as he does. You can't be that slow making decisions. You can't fail to read the D pre-snap to know where pressure and coverage will be.


Like your new screen name k-town.

Numbers don't lie, but you sure love to. I, unlike you, don't have to make up alts to back up my point.

All the data and all the articles and analysis coming out back me up. Also most of our posters aren't blind or biased and see the same things.

He had similar numbers as Lock. Just less attempts. So . . .

We all know you have no interest in a good faith debate, just pushing an agenda for some reason. So I'm not going to smash each of your made up talking points individually. They have been debunked enough.

 

[njvols]

It comes down to time and players running the correct routes on quick reads. Like I said watch the ETSU game. They rushed three and he was knocked down, didn’t have a chance on most plays. Manning would’ve struggled last season with that line.

I get all that...but, if we're using Manning as an example, he'd have taken a more vocal leadership role and for sure we'd have had at least a couple more wins...based solely on his leadership intangibles. Everywhere he played...UT, Colts, Broncos, he demanded excellence and raised the bar...Manning would have been out drilling WR's making sure they were on the same page with breaks...JG hasn't necessarily done that...YET. Outside of needing better OL protection, I personally think it's the leadership intangibles that JG needs to show growth in this year. Pruitt says he's progressing here and he usually doesn't mince words...so, I feel pretty good about JG this year.

 

[illinoisvolfan1]

I think he will do well if he has longer than 0.05 second to drop back, read, and release the ball.

 

[alltimevol2331]

I hope he becomes a great QB but he hasn't been one. With a "great" QB, UT becomes a passing O last year. He would have been allowed to read and throw hot routes to burn pressure. They would have made a living in the short and medium middle. Basically, he would have been UT's version of Drew Lock.

He's a very physically talented QB. If he can put the mental and decision making part together with Chaney, Tee, and Weinke then the potential is there. But to blame what happened last year all on the OL is to deny what your eyes tell you actually watching the game. You can't hold the ball as long as he does. You can't be that slow making decisions. You can't fail to read the D pre-snap to know where pressure and coverage will be.


Like your new screen name k-town.

I just don’t understand you guys. What my eyes are seeing? He can’t hold onto the ball to long because he had less than 3 seconds on most plays to throw it.

Let’s for one more time break this down as an offensive coordinator and let’s look at how a very under average can make this offense look like it does. And I will compare both sides of the ball for both teams.

First like I said, he had on average 2.7 seconds to throw the ball. Ok, a defensive coordinator knows this by watching “film” something you guys don’t do apparently. Now look at the cornerbacks on each side, 9 out of 10 plays they are in the line of scrimmage and they bump the receivers coming off the snap which is legal up to five yards. This throws off the hot routes, quick reads and any shot for him to release the ball quickly because no one was open.

The oline was the entire problem last year, go back and read the article posted to this. 32% of all running plays were stopped behind the line of scrimmage. ETSU made the oline look like a community college line.

I get most of you on here can’t read plays, can’t break down film. You guys are fans and that is fine but don’t try to tell others on here who have coached all their lives and watched and break down film that they are wrong.

This team can’t become a passing offensive until the offensive line improves. Look at Fulmer time here, The offense most years were good the one thing he had was a dominate oline.

 

[alltimevol2331]

I get all that...but, if we're using Manning as an example, he'd have taken a more vocal leadership role and for sure we'd have had at least a couple more wins...based solely on his leadership intangibles. Everywhere he played...UT, Colts, Broncos, he demanded excellence and raised the bar...Manning would have been out drilling WR's making sure they were on the same page with breaks...JG hasn't necessarily done that...YET. Outside of needing better OL protection, I personally think it's the leadership intangibles that JG needs to show growth in this year. Pruitt says he's progressing here and he usually doesn't mince words...so, I feel pretty good about JG this year.

Did you listen to him at media days last week? He wasn’t allowed to change a play or even check off on coverage. Which I hope with it being Pruitt second season along with an experience coach as Chaney he will be opened up to be more of a leader.

 

[alltimevol2331]

I'm glad we haven't discussed this at all this offseason....

This time it comes with facts. Something volnation completely throws away.

 

[Behr]

This time it comes with facts. Something volnation completely throws away.

Both sides are guilty if either are. FFS.

There is only 1 or 2 that act like he's the next best thing to sliced bread and unless you just like to argue and be called a liar, you're wasting time.

Also, there are only 2-3 that seem to enjoy talking chit about JG and nothing realistically will change that.

No need to drag everyone on VN down to this stupidity.

 

[BeardedVol]

I just don’t understand you guys. What my eyes are seeing? He can’t hold onto the ball to long because he had less than 3 seconds on most plays to throw it.

Let’s for one more time break this down as an offensive coordinator and let’s look at how a very under average can make this offense look like it does. And I will compare both sides of the ball for both teams.

First like I said, he had on average 2.7 seconds to throw the ball. Ok, a defensive coordinator knows this by watching “film” something you guys don’t do apparently. Now look at the cornerbacks on each side, 9 out of 10 plays they are in the line of scrimmage and they bump the receivers coming off the snap which is legal up to five yards. This throws off the hot routes, quick reads and any shot for him to release the ball quickly because no one was open.

The oline was the entire problem last year, go back and read the article posted to this. 32% of all running plays were stopped behind the line of scrimmage. ETSU made the oline look like a community college line.

I get most of you on here can’t read plays, can’t break down film. You guys are fans and that is fine but don’t try to tell others on here who have coached all their lives and watched and break down film that they are wrong.

This team can’t become a passing offensive until the offensive line improves. Look at Fulmer time here, The offense most years were good the one thing he had was a dominate oline.

How long should it take a quarterback to make a pass play? Only 2.8 seconds
"Duke coach David Cutcliffe believes football games often are decided in a string of 2.8-second segments. That’s the optimal amount of time, he said, that a quarterback should take from receiving the snap to releasing the ball on a pass play. "

Is more time in the pocket better? Sure, but if your quarterback needs 4 seconds to get a pass play off, that is a problem.

 

[Johnnyreb#VFL]

I think the stats proves he is a great qb. Over 32% of running plays last season didn’t make it back to the line of scrimmage. He can go through his reads all day long but when you are playing Eat Tennessee State and they are only rushing three guys and he still doesn’t have three seconds to throw. That is a huge offensive line problem. In fact it’s offensive in every way possible.

9-15 record as a starter (2-14 SEC). That’s not a knock, just facts.
Again not all his fault, but he is the starting qb.
Hope he kills it this year and BECOMES a great qb.

 

[Behr]

9-15 record as a starter (2-14 SEC). That’s not a knock, just facts.
Again not all his fault, but he is the starting qb.
Hope he kills it this year and BECOMES a great qb.

But he just said VN throws facts away.

 

[FlyFishnVol]

Tennessee football: More stats favoring Jarrett Guarantano slam Vols OL


As I’ve said all along he is much better than some of you guys say or think. If the scouts are correct then Oregon quarterback Justin Herbert will be in the NFL draft. According to the sports source this morning in four categories Guarantano was better in three of them and tied the other.

Give this guy time and he will a top qb in the SEC.

My opinion is that JG has all the tools to be successful, not knowing how hand tied he was at changing the play at the line, but he did have challenges checking off or adjusting for an obvious blitz. I am not a coach, it just appeared that way to me.

 

[FlyFishnVol]

9-15 record as a starter (2-14 SEC). That’s not a knock, just facts.
Again not all his fault, but he is the starting qb.
Hope he kills it this year and BECOMES a great qb.

QBs, they get too much credit for the win, and too much blame for the loss.

 

[Johnnyreb#VFL]

QBs, they get too much credit for the win, and too much blame for the loss.

Fair enough.
But there is a reason why people say Brady has 6 rings as opposed to the patriots have 6 rings.

 

[sjt18]

I just don’t understand you guys. What my eyes are seeing? He can’t hold onto the ball to long because he had less than 3 seconds on most plays to throw it.

Sometimes yes. But many times he has plenty of time if he could just process faster and throw the ball. It causes him to get hit. It causes him to be short on long balls. It happens over and over. It isn't us "guys" you don't understand... it is that JG's slow decisions and a weak OL were BOTH part of the problem.

Let’s for one more time break this down as an offensive coordinator and let’s look at how a very under average can make this offense look like it does. And I will compare both sides of the ball for both teams.

First like I said, he had on average 2.7 seconds to throw the ball.

And Cutcliffe teaches his QB's that they should never expect more than 2.5 seconds to deliver the ball. When he took over again with Ainge a train wreck, the FIRST THING Cut did was work on his pre-snap reads and speed his clock up. The "dink and dunk" O produced big numbers and points.

Ok, a defensive coordinator knows this by watching “film” something you guys don’t do apparently. Now look at the cornerbacks on each side, 9 out of 10 plays they are in the line of scrimmage and they bump the receivers coming off the snap which is legal up to five yards. This throws off the hot routes, quick reads and any shot for him to release the ball quickly because no one was open.

If this were true then it would be universally true and no one could hit hot routes against pressure. You're engaging in special pleading.

What DC's recognize by watching film ALSO is that JG takes a long time to make decisions and doesn't do pre-snap reads particularly well. They do what you describe not just because the OL can't hold but because they don't believe JG can find the right receiver quickly enough to burn them.

It was foolish to blitz Drew Lock. He could see it and hit the hot route so consistently that you just couldn't do it.

The oline was the entire problem last year, go back and read the article posted to this. 32% of all running plays were stopped behind the line of scrimmage. ETSU made the oline look like a community college line.

Ah, so you are the unicorn that so many here claim does not exist... throw the OL under the bus and deny JG had any responsibility... and you managed to do it in condescending manner too!

An OL can be good or even great at pass pro and not be good at run blocking. This one wasn't great at either but they were better in pass pro than is convenient to your narrative. I just watched the video posted of all JG's pass attempts. Did you? He was clean except for when they brought the house. Several of the hits he took were after he had about 3 seconds to throw. A QB should never expect more than 3 seconds.

The other pressure they got was when they brought extra guys or overloaded a side. The QB is responsible for seeing that and anticipating the void.

I get most of you on here can’t read plays, can’t break down film. You guys are fans and that is fine but don’t try to tell others on here who have coached all their lives and watched and break down film that they are wrong.

You are wrong. I don't care who you are or what you've done all your life. The problem was two sided. JG didn't read D's well and the OL had too many breakdowns... and too often they just got whipped.

This team can’t become a passing offensive until the offensive line improves. Look at Fulmer time here, The offense most years were good the one thing he had was a dominate oline.

This team cannot become a passing offense until JG learns to read D's and get the ball out faster also. No one here that I've seen has suggested the OL wasn't a problem. Laying it all on the OL... is just ridiculous.

 

[BeardedVol]

QBs, they get too much credit for the win, and too much blame for the loss.

QB as a position, has the single largest effect on the game, of any other position. QB play effects the receivers ability to catch the ball, running game efficiency with the handoff, the field position for special teams, time of possession for how long the defense is on the field, clock management, literally everything minus kickoff. A team can scheme or adjust around having an underperforming unit at any other position, except for QB. See Josh Dobbs in the 2016 USCe game. Josh's performance, one of his worst if not his worst, hampered every aspect of that game and was the primary factor in that loss.

 

[BigOrangeMojo]

Both sides are guilty if either are. FFS.

There is only 1 or 2 that act like he's the next best thing to sliced bread and unless you just like to argue and be called a liar, you're wasting time.

Also, there are only 2-3 that seem to enjoy talking chit about JG and nothing realistically will change that.

No need to drag everyone on VN down to this stupidity.

Agree. The answer to the JG question lies in the middle. He is tough, he is accurate. He does struggle moving in the pocket and doesn't process what the defense throws at him as quick as he should.

JG has also been shouldered with lousy OL play, lack of elite playmakers at skill positions, and really bad coordinators. One of his coordinators had never coordinated a P5 team before (his only coordinating experience was running Brohm's offense). The other coordinator's relative experience was being a co-coordinator at a HS almost 20 years ago all while trying to run Butch's offense. I actually had more coordinating experience than Larry Scott and I don't think anyone here would trust me to run Butch's offense.....

 

[sjt18]

Numbers don't lie, but you sure love to. I, unlike you, don't have to make up alts to back up my point.

All the data and all the articles and analysis coming out back me up. Also most of our posters aren't blind or biased and see the same things.

He had similar numbers as Lock. Just less attempts. So . . .

We all know you have no interest in a good faith debate, just pushing an agenda for some reason. So I'm not going to smash each of your made up talking points individually. They have been debunked enough.

Still lying huh? Thought you were going to stop responding. You can't even be intellectually honest about something that simple... why would you be trustworthy on anything more complex?

I have shared numbers with you over and over. To rehash it again would just be talking to a wall... again. You haven't debunked ANYTHING. You have evaded constantly and/or blamed someone else. You claim to believe JG isn't perfect then go absolutely nuts over the mildest suggestion that he actually has a weakness.

He had less attempts than Lock in an ineffective offense... because he was not trusted to carry more of the offense. I'm sure you'll either deny or blame that on the coaches... but two consecutive staffs took the same approach with him.

He wasn't even close to Lock last year. Not even the same universe. Lock excelled at pre-snap reads and started his throwing motion before even getting his eyes around to the target.

I trust Chaney. He's done good things with mediocre talents. JG isn't a mediocre talent if they can speed his clock up and get him to read D's well.

 

[savannahfan]

I hope he becomes a great QB but he hasn't been one. With a "great" QB, UT becomes a passing O last year. He would have been allowed to read and throw hot routes to burn pressure. They would have made a living in the short and medium middle. Basically, he would have been UT's version of Drew Lock.

He's a very physically talented QB. If he can put the mental and decision making part together with Chaney, Tee, and Weinke then the potential is there. But to blame what happened last year all on the OL is to deny what your eyes tell you actually watching the game. You can't hold the ball as long as he does. You can't be that slow making decisions. You can't fail to read the D pre-snap to know where pressure and coverage will be.


Like your new screen name k-town.

First, not disagreeing.. Yes it doesn't take too long to decide to "throw it away", even if you know you will have to do it again next play. But if that's the way you feel, then maybe you just try to wait and maybe some miracle will present itself. As to "pre-read", I think that would show pressure coming through from everywhere. Therefore, "panic" before the play starts.

 

[FlyFishnVol]

Sometimes yes. But many times he has plenty of time if he could just process faster and throw the ball. It causes him to get hit. It causes him to be short on long balls. It happens over and over. It isn't us "guys" you don't understand... it is that JG's slow decisions and a weak OL were BOTH part of the problem.

And Cutcliffe teaches his QB's that they should never expect more than 2.5 seconds to deliver the ball. When he took over again with Ainge a train wreck, the FIRST THING Cut did was work on his pre-snap reads and speed his clock up. The "dink and dunk" O produced big numbers and points.

If this were true then it would be universally true and no one could hit hot routes against pressure. You're engaging in special pleading.

What DC's recognize by watching film ALSO is that JG takes a long time to make decisions and doesn't do pre-snap reads particularly well. They do what you describe not just because the OL can't hold but because they don't believe JG can find the right receiver quickly enough to burn them.

It was foolish to blitz Drew Lock. He could see it and hit the hot route so consistently that you just couldn't do it.

Ah, so you are the unicorn that so many here claim does not exist... throw the OL under the bus and deny JG had any responsibility... and you managed to do it in condescending manner too!

An OL can be good or even great at pass pro and not be good at run blocking. This one wasn't great at either but they were better in pass pro than is convenient to your narrative. I just watched the video posted of all JG's pass attempts. Did you? He was clean except for when they brought the house. Several of the hits he took were after he had about 3 seconds to throw. A QB should never expect more than 3 seconds.

The other pressure they got was when they brought extra guys or overloaded a side. The QB is responsible for seeing that and anticipating the void.

You are wrong. I don't care who you are or what you've done all your life. The problem was two sided. JG didn't read D's well and the OL had too many breakdowns... and too often they just got whipped.


This team cannot become a passing offense until JG learns to read D's and get the ball out faster also. No one here that I've seen has suggested the OL wasn't a problem. Laying it all on the OL... is just ridiculous.

We could "if and but" this to death, the OL was a big issue in his ability to connect down field, but wasn't there some times he just missed the blitz?

 

[Pride85]

I hope he becomes a top SEC QB, but he isn’t yet nor has he been. Why do people keep apologizing for him?? Let the kid prove it his way.

No one is apologizing. He is good, not great, but has a large upside and potential. Some posters act he is a fifth year senior that had been the starter for ten years. This is only his second full year as starter, and first with a real OC and QB coach. I am very encouraged by the potential.

 

[sjt18]

We could "if and but" this to death, the OL was a big issue in his ability to connect down field, but wasn't there some times he just missed the blitz?

It appeared so.

I am hoping for improvement in both. I think both have potential. I think to the extent the coaching argument works for JG... it works even more for the OL. Jones' "revolutionary" techniques... handicapped them.

 

[sjt18]

First, not disagreeing.. Yes it doesn't take too long to decide to "throw it away", even if you know you will have to do it again next play. But if that's the way you feel, then maybe you just try to wait and maybe some miracle will present itself.

No miracle needed. He needs to work at it. Hopefully it isn't just an innate weakness. Hopefully something good (maybe great) coaching will fix.

As to "pre-read", I think that would show pressure coming through from everywhere. Therefore, "panic" before the play starts.

So to judge JG's weaknesses we should wait... but to blame it on the OL is OK to do now?

That's actually untrue anyway. There were a lot of plays when they blocked well and he had plenty of time.... and still got hit. There were just too many when they broke down.

 

[FlyFishnVol]

QB as a position, has the single largest effect on the game, of any other position. QB play effects the receivers ability to catch the ball, running game efficiency with the handoff, the field position for special teams, time of possession for how long the defense is on the field, clock management, literally everything minus kickoff. A team can scheme or adjust around having an underperforming unit at any other position, except for QB. See Josh Dobbs in the 2016 USCe game. Josh's performance, one of his worst if not his worst, hampered every aspect of that game and was the primary factor in that loss.

I don't think anyone would argue that, but there are stats that fall on the QB, dropped ball on a perfect pass and what about tipped balls that end up as a INT for the QB? YAC? Yards Lost do to sacks? not a QB stat, but fumbles lost. We all know the QB's job, but there are too many factors that go into his ability to execute a play, and that is on the 10 other players on the field being on the same page.