It's Interesting To Note...

#1
hatvol96

hatvol96

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#1
that in all 1,888,977 posts about prospective coaching candidates, I can't find a single person that mentions a coach's graduation rate as part of his qualifications. I think that reflects very poorly on our fan base, myself included. We talk about how much we "love the University of Tennessee" when, in fact, our main(in some cases only) concern is how well the teams in the two major sports do on the scoreboard. Personally, I'm a bit angry at myself. I think I'll take the majority of my VASF donation next year and give it to one of the academic programs.
 
#2
#2
hatvol96 said:
that in all 1,888,977 posts about prospective coaching candidates, I can't find a single person that mentions a coach's graduation rate as part of his qualifications. I think that reflects very poorly on our fan base, myself included. We talk about how much we "love the University of Tennessee" when, in fact, our main(in some cases only) concern is how well the teams in the two major sports do on the scoreboard. Personally, I'm a bit angry at myself. I think I'll take the majority of my VASF donation next year and give it to one of the academic programs.
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Powerful stuff, but graduation rates will unfortunately be the SECOND or THIRD or even FOURTH priority in this coaching search. Winning will always come first at UT.
 
#4
#4
The UTAD and the University of Tennessee, Knoxville have become such separate entities that I honestly forget to mentally connect them together sometimes.
 
#6
#6
Vercingetorix said:
The UTAD and the University of Tennessee, Knoxville have become such separate entities that I honestly forget to mentally connect them together sometimes.
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I had a conversation during the basketball game last night that got me headed down this mental path. The UTAD can't give ushers a hot dog and a Coke at the games now because, if they do, Sodexho is contractually entitled to the same fee they would get from a regular patron. That led to a simple question. Why the hell is there a deal with Sodexho in the first damn place? You're telling me the University of Tennessee is incapable of running its own hot dog stands? That's pathetic. Why not just let Food City and Kahn's, for example, provide the goods and let the various academic programs rotate running the stands to raise some cash?
 
#7
#7
hatvol96 said:
Why not just let Food City and Kahn's, for example, provide the goods and let the various academic programs rotate running the stands to raise some cash?
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If the goal is to finance academics, then that makes too much glorious sense. If the goal is to put as much money back in the pockets of the UTAD, though, then you've got to have a lucrative contract with a concessions vendor. Screw those losers over in the Humanties Buildling.

The whole thing really is just ridiculously self-perpetuating. The UTAD acts essentially like a separate business that contracts with the university to use its trademarks and rent its land. They bring in an insane amount of money, spend it to upgrade their own facilities, and then pass a pittance back to the general university at a time when budgets are being slashed and tuition jacked up. They're not even beholden to anybody on campus, of course, since the UTAD reports directly to Petersen's office. They're basically like the Big Orange Army, in a way, except that they're the outfit that actually puts the games on.

I try not to think about it too much. No wonder I forget to worry about things like, you know, graduation rates.
 
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#8
#8
Vercingetorix said:
If the goal is to finance academics, then that makes too much glorious sense. If the goal is to put as much money back in the pockets of the UTAD, though, then you've got to have a lucrative contract with a concessions vendor. Screw those losers over in the Humanties Buildling.

The whole thing really is just ridiculously self-perpetuating. The UTAD acts essentially like a separate business that contracts with the university to use its trademarks and rent its land. They bring in an insane amount of money, spend it to upgrade their own facilities, and then pass a pittance back to the general university at a time when budgets are being slashed and tuition jacked up. They're not even beholden to anybody on campus, of course, since the UTAD reports directly to Petersen's office. They're basically like the Big Orange Army, in a way, except that they're the outfit that actually puts the games on.

I try not to think about it too much. No wonder I forget to worry about things like, you know, graduation rates.
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The funny thing is, it doesn't have to be an either or proposition. Say what you will about the off field behavior of Miami's teams under Jimmy Johnson, their graduation rate was far better than most of the teams they were competing for national titles with during that era. There are a myriad of schools that do a far better job of blending academics and athletics than UT does. There's a simple reason for that: They actually try.
 
#9
#9
Vercingetorix said:
If the goal is to finance academics, then that makes too much glorious sense. If the goal is to put as much money back in the pockets of the UTAD, though, then you've got to have a lucrative contract with a concessions vendor. Screw those losers over in the Humanties Buildling.

The whole thing really is just ridiculously self-perpetuating. The UTAD acts essentially like a separate business that contracts with the university to use its trademarks and rent its land. They bring in an insane amount of money, spend it to upgrade their own facilities, and then pass a pittance back to the general university at a time when budgets are being slashed and tuition jacked up. They're not even beholden to anybody on campus, of course, since the UTAD reports directly to Petersen's office. They're basically like the Big Orange Army, in a way, except that they're the outfit that actually puts the games on.

I try not to think about it too much. No wonder I forget to worry about things like, you know, graduation rates.
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It is funny, the Athletic Department certainly loves to tout its association with the academic side when it can do so in order to get favorable tax treatment for its donors.
 
#10
#10
Hat that is one helluva point to throw out there. Since you brought it up, do you know where UT ranks in graduation rate?
 
#11
#11
I think that UT's institutional setup -- where the atheltic department is so completely independent from its campus -- hurts us a lot in that regard. The structure is such that nobody has much incentive to do a better job, either in the UTAD or in the UTK campus administration. It's hard to have an institutional commitment to a higher purpose when there's such a cleavage right down the middle of the institution.

Loren Crabtree wanted to help change that, of course, and bring the athletic department under local UTK administration -- like it is at UTC and UT-Martin. Too much money and power for Petersen to cede personal control of, of course.
 
#12
#12
hatvol96 said:
It is funny, the Athletic Department certainly loves to tout its association with the academic side when it can do so in order to get favorable tax treatment for its donors.
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Do you miss a trick Hat? Insightful suff above.There too.
 
#13
#13
Volgrad98 said:
Hat that is one helluva point to throw out there. Since you brought it up, do you know where UT ranks in graduation rate?
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By the 2008 measure, the only SEC team doing a poorer job of graduating its players than UT is UGA.
 
#14
#14
hatvol96 said:
It is funny, the Athletic Department certainly loves to tout its association with the academic side when it can do so in order to get favorable tax treatment for its donors.
Click to expand...

Not only is the percentage of UTAD revenue that ends up going towards general university and scholarship funds laughable to begin with, but I remember reading that even that is pretty inflated -- a big chunk of their "contributions to academics" end up financing the band, for example.

It really is a farce. The SEC schools are about to be awash in cash from the new CBS and ESPN TV contracts, right? But yet watch what happens over the next few years to the university's budget and tuition costs.
 
#15
#15
Vercingetorix said:
Not only is the percentage of UTAD revenue that ends up going towards general university and scholarship funds laughable to begin with, but I remember reading that even that is pretty inflated -- a big chunk of their "contributions to academics" end up financing the band, for example.

It really is a farce. The SEC schools are about to be awash in cash from the new CBS and ESPN TV contracts, right? But yet watch what happens over the next few years to the university's budget and tuition costs.
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The last two days, I've been going back to something Bob Knight said while he was at IU. Something to the effect of: "If the basketball program shuts down tomorrow, Indiana University will be fine. The same can't be said about the biology department."
 
#16
#16
Knight's a man with unusual perspective, that's for sure. I want UT's sports teams to win, and I'm fully aware of what that means with regard to the financial side of things, but still -- a part of me dies inside when I read in one section of the paper that UTK is having to cut academic programs because of a budget crunch, and then on the sports page that the UTAD has millions of dollars just sitting around in an account in case they have to buy out their football coach. There's sometimes more of a disconnect than I'm really comfortable with.
 
#17
#17
hatvol96 said:
that in all 1,888,977 posts about prospective coaching candidates, I can't find a single person that mentions a coach's graduation rate as part of his qualifications. I think that reflects very poorly on our fan base, myself included. We talk about how much we "love the University of Tennessee" when, in fact, our main(in some cases only) concern is how well the teams in the two major sports do on the scoreboard. Personally, I'm a bit angry at myself. I think I'll take the majority of my VASF donation next year and give it to one of the academic programs.
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woah... you actaully made me frown...

give it to us hat..

what is Kelly's, Davis, Brewster's graduation rate..
 
#19
#19
Speaking of UT and money:

I saw the tail end of a clip on WATE about UTK droipping 2 million on something about student downloads. What's that all about for people in the know?
 
#20
#20
I don't want to read too far into the original post....but I'm connecting the dots....
 
#21
#21
This topic is quite interesting. One of my two daughters that attends UT told me last night that one of the buildings she has the majority of her classes in was basically "shut down". She said the building's lights were turned out in the hallways and the instructors were told to keep the heat off, even on some of these 40 degree days. She said people were sitting there in coats with runny noses trying to "learn". This is just one pathetic example of our priorities, and quite frankly, I am embarrassed that it has come to this sort of thing.
 
#22
#22
hatvol96 said:
I had a conversation during the basketball game last night that got me headed down this mental path. The UTAD can't give ushers a hot dog and a Coke at the games now because, if they do, Sodexho is contractually entitled to the same fee they would get from a regular patron. That led to a simple question. Why the hell is there a deal with Sodexho in the first damn place? You're telling me the University of Tennessee is incapable of running its own hot dog stands? That's pathetic. Why not just let Food City and Kahn's, for example, provide the goods and let the various academic programs rotate running the stands to raise some cash?
Click to expand...

The university just wanted to get out of the business of being a vendor all together... and Sodexho came in with this deal where they offered the UTAD $1 million or so to run the opperation and take that "burden" off of them. Not saying I disagree with your idea because it makes too much sense, but that is the response you will get from Tiffany Carpenter...
 
#24
#24
tm3 said:
a few years ago CPFs rate was published as 36%.

pat summitt's is 100% plus 8 NCs. nobody, nowhere, can touch that.
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Speaking of graduation rates, I think you just used a double negative.:p
 
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