is it still acceptable to say "look what heupel inherited"

[Budalicious]

I seem to remember Saban walking into a mess in 2007 and he won a national title in year three.

How many Sabans you know?

 

[UTFranklinVol]

As long as the team stays engaged and bought in for JH, then you can have one “meh” season.

Heupel already had his "meh" season in 2023 with joe Milton at QB

 

[StuckInBamaVol]

I demand to know the people who vote yes and ban them from the forum.

 

[Rickyvol77]

my ideal coach is Josh Heupel with better coaching staff and better decision making, vision casting and killer instinct.

but if we are really going to play the game of "unlimited resources and suspend reality the I would put these coaches on the list:

Kirby Smart - wild success at a football program that is beneath the university of tennessee
Ryan Day - inherited a good program but has made his own name in not dropping off even one little bit.
Nick Saban (yes that's right Nick Saban)
Curt Cignetti (yes old but that guy did more good with less talent than Tennessee on its worst day ever) if he can win like that at Indiana he could win multiple titles with the resources Tennessee has.

I also think Lane Kiffin is just now entering his peak years of his career

we can't have any of those coaches but you specifically said "who is your model coach" and "unlimited resources" so I am suspending reality here.

Smart - fine
Day finally won a big game and NC last year so sure
Saban - yea obviously
Cignetti - no way, he's won ONE decent game against an Oregon team that we aren't even sure how good they are yet... he purposefully has made his easy schedule even EASIER for five straight years...he's a fraud

Kiffin is Heupel with less success

 

[Rickyvol77]

the recruiting restrictions are a headwind but never an excuse. if Curt Cignetti can win 11 games at Indiana when Indiana has never sniffed a recruiting class as good as Tennessee during these years of probation (or ever) then this argument that in year 5 these restrictions are an excuse is just a bad look. if you can coach, you can coach.

If Huepel played Indiana's schedule he would be 11-1 or 12-0 every season

 

[JMSqb11]

Just curious for those saying we are mediocre, or that we have hit our ceiling, or whatever, and I mean this in all seriousness...who is your model coach? If you had all the resources in the world right now who would you go get right now and replace Heupel with?

I would keep Heupel but I would make him shake up the staff. It’s no secret he isn’t changing up the staff because of loyalty and his trauma from being fired at OU. He doesn’t really believe he has built the best staff in America.

 

[UTFranklinVol]

If Huepel played Indiana's schedule he would be 11-1 or 12-0 every season

with Tennessee's team or with Cignetti's team? with Tennessee's recruiting or with Indiana's recruiting?

 

[JMSqb11]

Smart - fine
Day finally won a big game and NC last year so sure
Saban - yea obviously
Cignetti - no way, he's won ONE decent game against an Oregon team that we aren't even sure how good they are yet... he purposefully has made his easy schedule even EASIER for five straight years...he's a fraud

Kiffin is Heupel with less success

Yet I would trust Kiffin with Tennessee’s resources to field a better roster and actually having a quality staff.

Heupel is loyal to a fault to his staff and I’ll never understand it. He’s the head coach at Tennessee. This promoting from within after Golesh left was absurd. Tennessee isn’t hamstringing Heupel’s staff spending either.

Ryan Day won a title after he made big name hires at the coordinator position.

Saban elevated a title program to a dynasty by evolving his offensive philosophy.

 

[Rickyvol77]

with Tennessee's team or with Cignetti's team? with Tennessee's recruiting or with Indiana's recruiting?

Either...Indiana went last year during their "dream" season and didn't even play a ranked or winning team until the 3rd week of November and lost

Then the coach cancels games with Louisville and UVA because he knows he can likely make playoffs going 10-2 with the big ten's weak ass schedule...he has no P4 opponents in the OOC for SEVEN SEASONS

Outside of a decent win vs Oregon, Cignetti has won nothing and hasn't beaten other any good teams

 

[Rickyvol77]

Yet I would trust Kiffin with Tennessee’s resources to field a better roster and actually having a quality staff.

Heupel is loyal to a fault to his staff and I’ll never understand it. He’s the head coach at Tennessee. This promoting from within after Golesh left was absurd. Tennessee isn’t hamstringing Heupel’s staff spending either.

Just like he did before here?

7-6 with terrible decision making and roster usage, losing to mediocre teams and then leaving in the middle of the night to fail at three other places?

 

[GBOx2]

Are we not short on scholarships? Didn't we take a major hit when he took over? Those have been a hinderance and not a help to the football program since he took the job.

Yes we are still on probation until 2027 which is reducing scholarships. But more importantly to the coaching staff it means LESS recruiting, LESS visits, LESS evaluations, and LESS communication with recruits until 2027 among other things. For some reason there is a portion of the fan base who thinks that doesn't have any impact on the team right now.

@MiramarVol There is a list up in post #37 that shows more details of what the coaches are dealing until they are off probation.

 

[JMSqb11]

Just like he did before here?

7-6 with terrible decision making and roster usage, losing to mediocre teams and then leaving in the middle of the night to fail at three other places?

Ah yes. Using a single season from (checks notes) 16 years ago to grade a coach currently is totally logical.

People really are incapable of using their brains objectively.

I’m sure the coach who’s winning at a 72% clip at a historical 50% winning program would not do the same at a bigger school with bigger spending and resources in the exact same environment / league / schedule that he’s already coaching in.

That would just be looney tunes.

 

[UTFranklinVol]

Just like he did before here?

7-6 with terrible decision making and roster usage, losing to mediocre teams and then leaving in the middle of the night to fail at three other places?

lane kiffin is NOT the same coach he was 16 years ago at UT, not even close. he's way better now. if you can have a 6-1 record at Ole Piss then you're a damn good coach

 

[OrangeTsar]

No. Next question.
Year five in the NIL era

 

[njvols]

Heupel already had his "meh" season in 2023 with joe Milton at QB

Obviously you’re correct but was more talking that back to back seasons puts you squarely on hot seat.

 

[Matt2496]

Yet I would trust Kiffin with Tennessee’s resources to field a better roster and actually having a quality staff.

Heupel is loyal to a fault to his staff and I’ll never understand it. He’s the head coach at Tennessee. This promoting from within after Golesh left was absurd. Tennessee isn’t hamstringing Heupel’s staff spending either.

Ryan Day won a title after he made big name hires at the coordinator position.

Saban elevated a title program to a dynasty by evolving his offensive philosophy.

You are hitting the nail on the head today. I think people underestimate the importance of the staff. No single human being can be an expert at everything. A head coach or any leader for that matter has to be able to delegate responsibilities when he needs to. The staff that carry those responsibilities can't be incompetent. Otherwise, the entire organization/football team suffers.

It's just leadership 101. You have to hire great people around you to succeed. Heupel will have to make some uncomfortable decisions moving forward because this could (long-term) jeopardize his tenure at Tennessee.

 

[UTFranklinVol]

You are hitting the nail on the head today. I think people underestimate the importance of the staff. No single human being can be an expert at everything. A head coach or any leader for that matter has to be able to delegate responsibilities when he needs to. The staff that carry those responsibilities can't be incompetent. Otherwise, the entire organization/football team suffers.

It's just leadership 101. You have to hire great people around you to succeed. Heupel will have to make some uncomfortable decisions moving forward because this could (long-term) jeopardize his tenure at Tennessee.

with money and recognition Tennessee should be able to attract a better level of coaching than just Heupel's cronies. we should be able to get ex-head coches or NFL coaches to come run our offense and defense. we are a big enough school to do this.

 

[Matt2496]

with money and recognition Tennessee should be able to attract a better level of coaching than just Heupel's cronies. we should be able to get ex-head coches or NFL coaches to come run our offense and defense. we are a big enough school to do this.

100% Tennessee is a much higher profile program now. We could bring in exceptional coordinator/coaching talent if we wanted to. One of the things that made Saban great was his ability to hire exceptional coordinators so I don't know why we couldn't do the same thing.

 

[UTFranklinVol]

100% Tennessee is a much higher profile program now. We could bring in exceptional coordinator/coaching talent if we wanted to. One of the things that made Saban great was his ability to hire exceptional coordinators so I don't know why we couldn't do the same thing.

sometimes I feel like Heupel is worried about being outclassed by his coordinators. he has to be the best guy in the room rather than relying on experts in their area of practice.

nobody would ever consider replacing huepel with any of his current coordinators and he's good with that

 

[Brave Volunteer]

People were willing to give Heupel 5 years and that was fair.

What people didn’t expect was an expedited process where Heupel elevated the program on a nuclear pace with the 2022 season.

It’s been 3 years since the 2022 season and all we have to show for it is an expanded playoff appearance and a 2-6 record vs Georgia, Bama, and Florida.

All these people crying “look where we were 5 years ago” aren’t educated. Heupel deserves all the credit for how quickly this program got turned around and elevated. He also deserves criticism for the current feeling of plateauing.

Well said!

 

[Rickyvol77]

Ah yes. Using a single season from (checks notes) 16 years ago to grade a coach currently is totally logical.

People really are incapable of using their brains objectively.

I’m sure the coach who’s winning at a 72% clip at a historical 50% winning program would not do the same at a bigger school with bigger spending and resources in the exact same environment / league / schedule that he’s already coaching in.

That would just be looney tunes.

I know you have some kind of weird man crush on that loser, but Kiffin is a decent coach at best..not elite

His record at Ole Miss is fine, it's not Johnny Vaught level but yes much better than say Matt Luke...but he has issues with big games

He would not be a threat at Florida just like he wasn't a threat at Tennessee or USC or Ole Miss (see a pattern here?)

 

[Heupel's Offseason Beard]

it's an opinion that those things have a meaningful impact on the on field results with NIL and the portal. heupel has already achieved good recruiting results and I refute the notion that having 2 more scholarships and a couple more visits per year would have significantly altered the trajectory of this program. to think otherwise is to be willfully ignorant. are those things headwinds? sure. are they an excuse for our results, absolutely not. we won 10 games in heupel's 2nd season. that's all the proof you need to see that it's not a real issue just an annoyance.

You're just telling the rest of the world "I don't fully understand how college football works," so why would we listen to you further? The things you're saying are ridiculous. Understand a topic before speaking on it with so much passion. Do you think recruiting is coaches just going "I want this guy" and then giving them a pitch? It's a years long process and not being able to do as much communicating, having less scholarships, and visits as other teams puts you at a massive disadvantage. They literally have had SEVEN MONTHS less time where they're allowed to call or text recruits during probation. Do you understand how that might affect relationship? Jeez man yall are the worst

 

[VOLumeS]

one of the favorite volnation excuses when evaluating the current coach is the ole "look what he inherited" and while it's true that heupel inherited a mess just like every coach in the country to comes into a situation where the previous coach was fired, but it is now the middle of year 5.

none of the players heupel inherited are still playing for this team.

he's had multiple recruiting cycles to bring in top rated players

he won 10 games in his second season so clearly it's not a real excuse for lack of success.

scholarship limits were increased by 20 so any limitations placed on UT due to sanctions (which were actually incredibly small limitations to begin with) are basically a non issue anymore.

so should this excuse be tolerated on this message board again? should people who use this excuse be reported and banned from this place?

His first 2 years whatever but year 5 no this is his players and his development, anyone saying otherwise isn't being realistic.

 

[JMSqb11]

I know you have some kind of weird man crush on that loser, but Kiffin is a decent coach at best..not elite

His record at Ole Miss is fine, it's not Johnny Vaught level but yes much better than say Matt Luke...but he has issues with big games

He would not be a threat at Florida just like he wasn't a threat at Tennessee or USC or Ole Miss (see a pattern here?)

He’s literally going to cakewalk to being the second best coach to ever be there. The comparisons of who is better don’t just stop at Matt Luke. He’s better than any coach they’ve had in 40+ years.

It’s also funny how broken the brains of some Tennessee fans have gotten. They’d rather get beat down by a coach than possibly try to win with said coach because of spilt milk.

Also Kiffin is literally a playoff appearance away from essentially being neck and neck with Heupel at Tennessee. If Kiffin isn’t a threat, it’s only logical that you feel Heupel isn’t a threat either.

 

[Rickyvol77]

lane kiffin is NOT the same coach he was 16 years ago at UT, not even close. he's way better now. if you can have a 6-1 record at Ole Piss then you're a damn good coach

So just like Cutcliffe, Billy Brewer, Hugh Freeze, etc?

Way better? He almost has lost to Tulane and Washington St THIS season...he lost to Kentucky and Florida last season...he's won 10 games at Ole Miss when they don't even play a P4 OOC team.

He had all the resources at Tennessee and USC and did squat