Is it just as easy as replacing the coach?

[sjt18]

Nebraska is a hard place to recruit to, the days of the teams filled with corn-fed mid-western boys beating up on everyone are over. They shouldn't have left the Big 12. Harbaugh just isn't a great coach.

There's still a formula for Nebraska and those "corn fed" boys... but it is far more difficult than it was. They could emulate Wisconsin... but they're never going to attract the types and quantities of athletes to run the kind of O or D that Clemson, Bama, et al run.

 

[rocky top buzz]

Nebraska is a hard place to recruit to, the days of the teams filled with corn-fed mid-western boys beating up on everyone are over. They shouldn't have left the Big 12. Harbaugh just isn't a great coach.

Harbaugh took an NFL team to the super bowl. We've seen college head coaches fail in the NFL (saban) but typically successful NFL coaches do great in college (Pete Carroll)

 

[hog88]

There's still a formula for Nebraska and those "corn fed" boys... but it is far more difficult than it was. They could emulate Wisconsin... but they're never going to attract the types and quantities of athletes to run the kind of O or D that Clemson, Bama, et al run.

Madison, WI is a much more attractive landing spot than Lincoln, NE.

 

[lifeVol]

No, it's not as easy as replacing the coach. That's obvious to everyone. But when your coach is in this far over his head and simply incapable of doing what needs to be done, you have to change the coach. No one is saying that's all it takes, we're saying it's step one.

And by the way, step 1B would be replace him with the *correct* coach. Fit means everything. Just promoting someone from a coordinator job because it's supposedly their turn, has been proven to not work consistently enough to rely on.

This program needs a true leader, someone experienced in managing people and leading an organization.

yes, this

 

[99gator]

I think Texas is proof that sometimes it can be more than the coach.

I don’t know what’s going on there, but too many people have failed at Texas for it to be just the coach

You only should be fired from Texas because you don’t win enough. How you get your face kicked in at that school is beyond me

 

[hog88]

Harbaugh took an NFL team to the super bowl. We've seen college head coaches fail in the NFL (saban) but typically successful NFL coaches do great in college (Pete Carroll)

I've heard that Harbaugh is very abrasive and hard to get along with, that might be one of his big problems at MI.

 

[EODVOL]

Scott Frost was a flash in the pan hire, not saying he can't get it done but his resume was very thin as a head coach and coordinator. He was only a coordinator for two years and that was under an offensive minded head coach and he was a head coach for two seasons at UCF. He was probably ill prepared to handle the mess at Nebraska. Jim Harbaugh has won nearly 50 games at Michigan in 5 and 1/2 seasons including 3 seasons of 10 wins. He has been anything but a failure. He just hasn't beaten OSU.

All good points, people often don't know or overlook that Frost inherited a really good team in UCF. As for Harbaugh, I thought he was a good hire. Anyone that can make Stanford competitive for as long as he has definitely got coaching ability. This begs the question, would TN hire Harbaugh if the opportunity presented itself, would TN fans like the hire?

 

[tastycar]

But first, can we talk about replacing the couch?

 

[hog88]

I think Texas is proof that sometimes it can be more than the coach.

I don’t know what’s going on there, but too many people have failed at Texas for it to be just the coach

You only should be fired from Texas because you don’t win enough. How you get your face kicked in at that school is beyond me

Texas is a head scratcher for sure.

 

[VolArmy74]

Harbaugh has had enough success at Michigan that he would not be under pressure at most schools, including here.

He just happens to be coaching Michigan at the worst possible time. Nick Saban turned Michigan State around and they went on to have their best run of football since the 1960s. Also the zenith of Ohio State's football program due to Tressel then Urban Meyer. It coincided with Michigan's population taking a massive hit. They've not been truly great since the 1990s. That 1997 team had remnants of the 95 scholarship era and Michigan's auto industry was still mostly in place. Michigan's population has crashed in the last 25 years. When Michigan was winning big for decades Detroit was the 4th or 5th biggest city in the United States. Now it's the 24th biggest city.

Their problems are not quite as bad as Nebraska's problems but they are similar. Michigan has lost population, it has good programs in each state where it would have a recruiting base. It's not easy to convince great southern kids to go there and freeze when they can stay home in the south where the population is booming.

 

[LittleVol]

Madison, WI is a much more attractive landing spot than Lincoln, NE.

Wisconsin never has a highly ranked class.
They just have an identity and recruit to it to a T.

 

[VolArmy74]

Harbaugh took an NFL team to the super bowl. We've seen college head coaches fail in the NFL (saban) but typically successful NFL coaches do great in college (Pete Carroll)

Harbaugh is a great coach. The guy took Stanford from doormat to 12-1 and as you mentioned, won an NFC championship and multiple coach of the year awards in college and the NFL. He's had multiple 9 and 10 win seasons at Michigan in the toughest era to win for them ever.

 

[rocky top buzz]

I think Texas is proof that sometimes it can be more than the coach.

I don’t know what’s going on there, but too many people have failed at Texas for it to be just the coach

You only should be fired from Texas because you don’t win enough. How you get your face kicked in at that school is beyond me

Texas is a really great example that I did not think to include. People say the Tennessee job is tough because you have to complete for so many recruits. Texas could get 22 top ranked players without any trouble yet they too seem unable to make a coaching hire that solves their woes. So again I say it goes deeper than the coach. I would argue Clemson and Tennessee have a lot in common both reginally competing for recruits and the makeup of the student body. You can argue it's easier to complete in the ACC but they didn't win an ACC championship in the 90's or 2000's. I think they have found something institutionally that works, and until Tennessee figures that out, you're just going to keep making rich coaches richer.

 

[gtin723]

Yea but no one else has a 6 year senior leading the nation in pic 6's and fumbles turned into pic 6's the guy is amazing how he can make so many blunders that result in touchdowns for the other team.

Maybe our offense needs more practice tackling defensive players?

 

[rocky top buzz]

Harbaugh is a great coach. The guy took Stanford from doormat to 12-1 and as you mentioned, won an NFC championship and multiple coach of the year awards in college and the NFL. He's had multiple 9 and 10 win seasons at Michigan in the toughest era to win for them ever.

He has yet to beat OSU, and didn't they suffer their worst loss ever this year? I think he is a great coach, but I don't think he has been great at michigan.

 

[The Ron Mexico]

I have zero confidence in the administration at UT to make a good hire. Great talent has no desire to come to Knoxville to be the king of our three ring circus.

So just keep Jeremy. It could be fun just watching the answers he comes up with every week as to why he still sucks.

 

[DiderotsGhost]

I look at how toxic the fanbase has become, and I question whether any head coach can ever succeed here again.

Our fans are chasing off recruits right now. And yes, recruits pay attention to what people are saying on Twitter and VolNation. So even if we fire Pruitt, the next guy is stuck in the same situation; a 4-5 year rebuild and the fans want him fired in Year 2 or Year 3. Cycle repeats.

Other than the money, what appeal does the UT job have right now? If I were a coach, I'd rather be at UNC or NC State. The fans show up to games, but they don't bombard social media with toxic junk. You actually have time to build a program. Hell, NC State has given Dave Doeren 8 years and he probably should've been fired after Year 4. He's having his best season this year, which is a testament to stability more so than his coaching prowess.

Now couple that with administrative dysfunction and it's difficult to imagine hiring a top-tier coach. Haslam wants "his guy". Fulmer wants "his guy". What no one seems to care about is hiring the best coach, other than Currie when he went renegade and tried to hire Mike Leach. Seriously, Currie got fired not because he was a bad AD (he was), but because he stopped towing the line, went renegade, and tried to hire an A-tier coach. If Currie had continued trying to hire Haslam's crap candidates, he'd still be AD.

Bama is lucky they got Nick Saban before the social media era blew up. And it was kinda dumb luck that they ended up with him to begin with; they tried to hire RichRod and he jilted them at the altar. That's the only reason they got Saban. Otherwise, Bama probably looks a lot like Michigan right now.

But places like Georgia and LSU can afford to f' up; there's just so much talent there, that any coach, no matter how bad, can get top 10 classes. Tennessee doesn't have that luxury. Sure, we get top 10 classes, but only with a coach that can recruit. We're like Clemson and Bama in that regard. The right person can bring in top-notch talent, but it won't automatically come like it does in Athens and Baton Rouge.

I'm rambling a bit, but I'm not optimistic about the football program's future. I see how toxic this board and Twitter have become and I can't imagine recruits reading this stuff and thinking "Tennessee is the place I want to spend my next 4-5 years." I don't know that changing the coach is going to change that. And given how dysfunctional our administration is, it's difficult to imagine us ever hiring a top-tier coach anyway.

Ok, so you fire Pruitt? You just get another up-and-comer who everyone will want to fire 3-4 years down the road. I seriously doubt we'll hire Hugh Freeze or any other A-list candidate. Everyone thinks it's about the money, but I don't think it is; it's politics more than money. All the people in control want to hire "their guy"; not the best guy.

 

[chef3531]

Scott Frost was a flash in the pan hire, not saying he can't get it done but his resume was very thin as a head coach and coordinator. He was only a coordinator for two years and that was under an offensive minded head coach and he was a head coach for two seasons at UCF. He was probably ill prepared to handle the mess at Nebraska. Jim Harbaugh has won nearly 50 games at Michigan in 5 and 1/2 seasons including 3 seasons of 10 wins. He has been anything but a failure. He just hasn't beaten OSU.

Biggest detriment to success for Scott Frost is having to recruit to Lincoln, Nebraska. That's the biggest hurdle for him to overcome. The playoffs are killing college football as well because all the elite kids are going to about half a dozen schools. It's a recipe for mediocrity at all but that handful of schools.

 

[spyfish007]

If you want to win championships, then everyone in the organization in a leadership role must be championship caliber. AD, coaches and top players. Any gaps, no championships. Keep going with this and the more gaps you have, the less you win.

 

[hog88]

I look at how toxic the fanbase has become, and I question whether any head coach can ever succeed here again.

Our fans are chasing off recruits right now. And yes, recruits pay attention to what people are saying on Twitter and VolNation. So even if we fire Pruitt, the next guy is stuck in the same situation; a 4-5 year rebuild and the fans want him fired in Year 2 or Year 3. Cycle repeats.

Other than the money, what appeal does the UT job have right now? If I were a coach, I'd rather be at UNC or NC State. The fans show up to games, but they don't bombard social media with toxic junk. You actually have time to build a program. Hell, NC State has given Dave Doeren 8 years and he probably should've been fired after Year 4. He's having his best season this year, which is a testament to stability more so than his coaching prowess.

Now couple that with administrative dysfunction and it's difficult to imagine hiring a top-tier coach. Haslam wants "his guy". Fulmer wants "his guy". What no one seems to care about is hiring the best coach, other than Currie when he went renegade and tried to hire Mike Leach. Seriously, Currie got fired not because he was a bad AD (he was), but because he stopped towing the line, went renegade, and tried to hire an A-tier coach. If Currie had continued trying to hire Haslam's crap candidates, he'd still be AD.

Bama is lucky they got Nick Saban before the social media era blew up. And it was kinda dumb luck that they ended up with him to begin with; they tried to hire RichRod and he jilted them at the altar. That's the only reason they got Saban. Otherwise, Bama probably looks a lot like Michigan right now.

But places like Georgia and LSU can afford to f' up; there's just so much talent there, that any coach, no matter how bad, can get top 10 classes. Tennessee doesn't have that luxury. Sure, we get top 10 classes, but only with a coach that can recruit. We're like Clemson and Bama in that regard. The right person can bring in top-notch talent, but it won't automatically come like it does in Athens and Baton Rouge.

I'm rambling a bit, but I'm not optimistic about the football program's future. I see how toxic this board and Twitter have become and I can't imagine recruits reading this stuff and thinking "Tennessee is the place I want to spend my next 4-5 years." I don't know that changing the coach is going to change that. And given how dysfunctional our administration is, it's difficult to imagine us ever hiring a top-tier coach anyway.

Ok, so you fire Pruitt? You just get another up-and-comer who everyone will want to fire 3-4 years down the road. I seriously doubt we'll hire Hugh Freeze or any other A-list candidate. Everyone thinks it's about the money, but I don't think it is; it's politics more than money. All the people in control want to hire "their guy"; not the best guy.

Fans are not chasing off recruits and this fanbase has every right to be pissed off.

No coach is going to turn down the opportunity to come to UT because the fans are upset at being 2-6 and getting blown out 6 straight times and every time we our rivals. They understand and expect that.

 

[vettefool]

Biggest detriment to success for Scott Frost is having to recruit to Lincoln, Nebraska. That's the biggest hurdle for him to overcome. The playoffs are killing college football as well because all the elite kids are going to about half a dozen schools. It's a recipe for mediocrity at all but that handful of schools.

This

 

[sjt18]

Madison, WI is a much more attractive landing spot than Lincoln, NE.

I've been to Wisconsin and Nebraska. I'll take Nebraska for a lot of reasons.

 

[99gator]

I look at how toxic the fanbase has become, and I question whether any head coach can ever succeed here again.

Our fans are chasing off recruits right now. And yes, recruits pay attention to what people are saying on Twitter and VolNation. So even if we fire Pruitt, the next guy is stuck in the same situation; a 4-5 year rebuild and the fans want him fired in Year 2 or Year 3. Cycle repeats.

Other than the money, what appeal does the UT job have right now? If I were a coach, I'd rather be at UNC or NC State. The fans show up to games, but they don't bombard social media with toxic junk. You actually have time to build a program. Hell, NC State has given Dave Doeren 8 years and he probably should've been fired after Year 4. He's having his best season this year, which is a testament to stability more so than his coaching prowess.

Now couple that with administrative dysfunction and it's difficult to imagine hiring a top-tier coach. Haslam wants "his guy". Fulmer wants "his guy". What no one seems to care about is hiring the best coach, other than Currie when he went renegade and tried to hire Mike Leach. Seriously, Currie got fired not because he was a bad AD (he was), but because he stopped towing the line, went renegade, and tried to hire an A-tier coach. If Currie had continued trying to hire Haslam's crap candidates, he'd still be AD.

Bama is lucky they got Nick Saban before the social media era blew up. And it was kinda dumb luck that they ended up with him to begin with; they tried to hire RichRod and he jilted them at the altar. That's the only reason they got Saban. Otherwise, Bama probably looks a lot like Michigan right now.

But places like Georgia and LSU can afford to f' up; there's just so much talent there, that any coach, no matter how bad, can get top 10 classes. Tennessee doesn't have that luxury. Sure, we get top 10 classes, but only with a coach that can recruit. We're like Clemson and Bama in that regard. The right person can bring in top-notch talent, but it won't automatically come like it does in Athens and Baton Rouge.

I'm rambling a bit, but I'm not optimistic about the football program's future. I see how toxic this board and Twitter have become and I can't imagine recruits reading this stuff and thinking "Tennessee is the place I want to spend my next 4-5 years." I don't know that changing the coach is going to change that. And given how dysfunctional our administration is, it's difficult to imagine us ever hiring a top-tier coach anyway.

Ok, so you fire Pruitt? You just get another up-and-comer who everyone will want to fire 3-4 years down the road. I seriously doubt we'll hire Hugh Freeze or any other A-list candidate. Everyone thinks it's about the money, but I don't think it is; it's politics more than money. All the people in control want to hire "their guy"; not the best guy.

The problem is....

1. The program has higher expectations than to be NC State.

2. Recruiting is a problem because you (in theory) are trying to pursue kids who have the option to go anywhere. They have offers to Alabama, Florida, Georgia, Auburn, LSU, Ohio State, Clemson, etc. So, you have to give them a reason on the field to come to Tennessee. They are not coming to stay close to momma, because they aren’t from Tennessee. And going 2-6 and not putting people in the NFL makes it a hard sell.

If you have North Carolina, NC State and Iowa expectations, then by all means give him time and let him sign all the recruiting scraps left over after all the big boys have had their fill to eat.

And you’ll be Arkansas 2.0

In addition, losing to people who would love to trade rosters with you....that’s also different than the NC States of the world

 

[BSAvol]

Texas was mentioned above. They hired a big name coach who hasn't performed. Guess what? He's on the hot seat and he knows it. Texas has not been secretive about their desire to replace Herman with Urban Meyer.

Pruitt's stubbornness has also been mentioned; he sure does not act as though his butt is on the hot seat. Maybe he has another year but he needs to know that significant improvement is the only thing that will cool that seat off next year. I've heard Doug Mathews state the he has the full support of the AD. I think the best thing to do is to relieve Fulmer of his duties and take our time to hire a top notch AD, maybe Blackburn if that bridge isn't burned. We need someone with great coaching connections and I cannot believe a top notch coach would work for Fulmer.

A new AD would send the message to Pruitt, he'd know his seat is hot and the new AD will replace him without a trend towards excellence. Maybe we'd get a coach we could be proud of.

 

[sjt18]

I look at how toxic the fanbase has become, and I question whether any head coach can ever succeed here again.

Our fans are chasing off recruits right now. And yes, recruits pay attention to what people are saying on Twitter and VolNation. So even if we fire Pruitt, the next guy is stuck in the same situation; a 4-5 year rebuild and the fans want him fired in Year 2 or Year 3. Cycle repeats.

Other than the money, what appeal does the UT job have right now? If I were a coach, I'd rather be at UNC or NC State. The fans show up to games, but they don't bombard social media with toxic junk. You actually have time to build a program. Hell, NC State has given Dave Doeren 8 years and he probably should've been fired after Year 4. He's having his best season this year, which is a testament to stability more so than his coaching prowess.

Now couple that with administrative dysfunction and it's difficult to imagine hiring a top-tier coach. Haslam wants "his guy". Fulmer wants "his guy". What no one seems to care about is hiring the best coach, other than Currie when he went renegade and tried to hire Mike Leach. Seriously, Currie got fired not because he was a bad AD (he was), but because he stopped towing the line, went renegade, and tried to hire an A-tier coach. If Currie had continued trying to hire Haslam's crap candidates, he'd still be AD.

Bama is lucky they got Nick Saban before the social media era blew up. And it was kinda dumb luck that they ended up with him to begin with; they tried to hire RichRod and he jilted them at the altar. That's the only reason they got Saban. Otherwise, Bama probably looks a lot like Michigan right now.

But places like Georgia and LSU can afford to f' up; there's just so much talent there, that any coach, no matter how bad, can get top 10 classes. Tennessee doesn't have that luxury. Sure, we get top 10 classes, but only with a coach that can recruit. We're like Clemson and Bama in that regard. The right person can bring in top-notch talent, but it won't automatically come like it does in Athens and Baton Rouge.

I'm rambling a bit, but I'm not optimistic about the football program's future. I see how toxic this board and Twitter have become and I can't imagine recruits reading this stuff and thinking "Tennessee is the place I want to spend my next 4-5 years." I don't know that changing the coach is going to change that. And given how dysfunctional our administration is, it's difficult to imagine us ever hiring a top-tier coach anyway.

Ok, so you fire Pruitt? You just get another up-and-comer who everyone will want to fire 3-4 years down the road. I seriously doubt we'll hire Hugh Freeze or any other A-list candidate. Everyone thinks it's about the money, but I don't think it is; it's politics more than money. All the people in control want to hire "their guy"; not the best guy.

No one went ballistic on Pruitt after the first year. There were some voices after the start of last year but a lot of people held their tongues and felt pretty good after the end of the season.

I believe that almost anyone who had not already made a decision on Pruitt prior to this season would have bought the "its a strange year" excuse if the team were competitive and had beaten UK and Ark (as roster talent says they should). Shoot... If he'd had the spine to make a QB change and play for the future at least by UK... I'd be defending him right now even with 5 or 6 losses. But this is a culmination of poor strategy, poor coaching, poor philosophy of play, stubbornness, poor player management, and now serious questions about his leadership and respect in the locker room.

The "toxicity" of the fanbase didn't come out of nowhere. It is a product of what Pruitt has done. BECAUSE UT has to go out of state to pull recruits... they cannot afford to play around with under performing coaches.