IRS admits to targeting Conservative groups

#1,478
#1,478
YorkVol said:
Anyone want to explain to LG the process of responding to a Congressional Inquiry?
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He seems to have the playbook down pretty pat:

Lie, falsify, omit, destroy evidence, claim ignorance, be snarky with Representatives and if all else fails...

"It's a GOP fundraising plot!"
 
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#1,479
#1,479
lawgator1 said:
1) That is EXACTLY what you said.

2) Now you are changing your claim to be one based on speculation because "in all likelihood" she knew.

How about let's get some facts before we jump off into "in all likelihood" land?
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When have facts ever effected your arguements? Your arguements are shaped soley on whether they have a "D" or an "R" next to their name. You made that apparent a long time ago.
 
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#1,481
#1,481
lawgator1 said:
So now the IRS = "the administration."

I think I am seeing the GOP game plan here.
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Let's see, the IRS falls under the Dept of the Treasury, which is a cabinet of the Executive Branch of govt, which is currently headed by Obama. So yes, the IRS = part of the administration.

Let's theorize for a moment that Obama and/or his top staffers knew nothing of what the IRS was doing. It still falls on his shoulders. It's like the ship analogy I've used in the past. The captain of the ship is responsible for everything that happens aboard his vessel. It doesn't matter if he had a direct hand in it. He's the captain and it's his responsibility to keep that ship running steady. Time and again this ship has strayed way off course and the captain has yet to be held accountable. If this were the navy, he'd have been relieved of his command by now.
 
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#1,482
#1,482
37L1 said:
So what we have is a letter requesting information from the IRS regarding IRS conduct towards certain groups from the Chair of the House Ways and Means, dated June 3, 2011. On June 13, 2011 Lois Lerner's computer crashes. IRS Tech is unable to recover content from hard drive. Hard drive is recycled. Taped back up is recycled. Two months later, Sonasoft, (IRS e-mail archiving contractor) 6 year relationship with the IRS is cancelled. Lois Lerner evidently did not make any hard copies of these emails.

This certainly does not pass the smell test.
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So the tapes were readily available when her drive crashed and were for 6mos following. Why not just restore from there if they were so important? Why go through the trouble of trying to restore it from the corrupt drive at all?
 
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#1,483
#1,483
utvolpj said:
So the tapes were readily available when her drive crashed and were for 6mos following. Why not just restore from there if they were so important? Why go through the trouble of trying to restore it from the corrupt drive at all?
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Because that would make way too much sense.








Plus they just might implicate others up the food chain.
 
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#1,484
#1,484
Weezer said:
Let's see, the IRS falls under the Dept of the Treasury, which is a cabinet of the Executive Branch of govt, which is currently headed by Obama. So yes, the IRS = part of the administration.

Let's theorize for a moment that Obama and/or his top staffers knew nothing of what the IRS was doing. It still falls on his shoulders. It's like the ship analogy I've used in the past. The captain of the ship is responsible for everything that happens aboard his vessel. It doesn't matter if he had a direct hand in it. He's the captain and it's his responsibility to keep that ship running steady. Time and again this ship has strayed way off course and the captain has yet to be held accountable. If this were the navy, he'd have been relieved of his command by now.
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If he served on my old ship he'd have been tossed off the aft end in the middle of the Mediterranean Sea..
 
#1,485
#1,485
utvolpj said:
So the tapes were readily available when her drive crashed and were for 6mos following. Why not just restore from there if they were so important? Why go through the trouble of trying to restore it from the corrupt drive at all?
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Last night Koskinen said something like it was too expensive or not worth the trouble etc. He doesn't really have an answer for it. Clearly it wasn't deemed a priority to preserve them for whatever reason.
 
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#1,486
#1,486
Grand Vol said:
I think we have already proven that the case of targeting wasn't limited to just one person at the IRS.

Was there an arbitrary number we should slap on this to make it sound better or worse?

ETA: Just because you've never made that claim doesn't mean it's not up your lawyer's sleeve as a card to play if needed. I notice you made that distinction.
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Well actually, if you are correct and it was politically motivated and coordinated, the number of people involved or who knew about it would probably be well over 100. Maybe more like 1,000.
 
#1,488
#1,488
Grand Vol said:
Do I hear a 10,000? Going once...
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I'm just saying, the broader and wider the GOP suggests, the more likely it would seem that there is some evidence to substantiate the claim that it was politically motivated and directed or at least coordinated. That there has been no such evidence is interesting.
 
#1,489
#1,489
lawgator1 said:
I'm just saying, the broader and wider the GOP suggests, the more likely it would seem that there is some evidence to substantiate the claim that it was politically motivated and directed or at least coordinated. That there has been no such evidence is interesting.
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How broad and wide does this go?
 
#1,490
#1,490
lawgator1 said:
Well actually, if you are correct and it was politically motivated and coordinated, the number of people involved or who knew about it would probably be well over 100. Maybe more like 1,000.
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I don't see this. Only takes a handful in the WH and a handful at IRS. Others may have played a role but not known why they were being asked to do certain things.

Someone at the WH could have worked it out with Lerner and she took it from there. WH could have easily directed talking points to Dem Congressional members to hammer issues with conservative not-for-profits.

Whatever happened to her hard drive; those working on it wouldn't need to be in on some effort to end up not being able to retrieve them. Since she won't talk we don't know if she sought to get them off the servers after the crash. If she didn't ask or told people not to bother then again they don't have to be in on anything.

I'm not saying any of this happened. Just showing why it doesn't have to be some grand plot involving hundreds or thousands to have been political targeting via the IRS and thus a major scandal.
 
#1,491
#1,491
Guess Koskinen was wrong when he said the law wasn't broken (maybe if he knew the laws he'd have been better able to assess this)

National Archives boss: IRS

Archivist of the U.S. David Ferriero, speaking before the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, made clear that federal agencies are supposed to report whenever their records are destroyed or even accidentally deleted. But he said that after emails from embattled IRS official Lois Lerner vanished after a computer failure in 2011, nobody told the National Archives.

"They did not follow the law," Ferriero said.
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#1,492
#1,492
volinbham said:
I don't see this. Only takes a handful in the WH and a handful at IRS. Others may have played a role but not known why they were being asked to do certain things.

Someone at the WH could have worked it out with Lerner and she took it from there. WH could have easily directed talking points to Dem Congressional members to hammer issues with conservative not-for-profits.

Whatever happened to her hard drive; those working on it wouldn't need to be in on some effort to end up not being able to retrieve them. Since she won't talk we don't know if she sought to get them off the servers after the crash. If she didn't ask or told people not to bother then again they don't have to be in on anything.

I'm not saying any of this happened. Just showing why it doesn't have to be some grand plot involving hundreds or thousands to have been political targeting via the IRS and thus a major scandal.
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Maybe 6? If it included the department head and the chief of staff of her direct boss?

Lawmakers: IRS lost more emails in tea party probe - The Washington Post
 
#1,493
#1,493
lawgator1 said:
I'm just saying, the broader and wider the GOP suggests, the more likely it would seem that there is some evidence to substantiate the claim that it was politically motivated and directed or at least coordinated. That there has been no such evidence is interesting.
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Where should they get this evidence? Is the White House going to turn over all emails, correspondences, visitor logs, minutes from meetings? Will the FBI and congressmen in question do the same?

Answer heck NO! This is why a special prosecutor needs to be appointed, they would have the power to make individuals comply or be jailed. You would think the administration would want one for transparency purposes at the very least.
 
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#1,494
#1,494
volinbham said:
I don't see this. Only takes a handful in the WH and a handful at IRS. Others may have played a role but not known why they were being asked to do certain things.

Someone at the WH could have worked it out with Lerner and she took it from there. WH could have easily directed talking points to Dem Congressional members to hammer issues with conservative not-for-profits.

Whatever happened to her hard drive; those working on it wouldn't need to be in on some effort to end up not being able to retrieve them. Since she won't talk we don't know if she sought to get them off the servers after the crash. If she didn't ask or told people not to bother then again they don't have to be in on anything.

I'm not saying any of this happened. Just showing why it doesn't have to be some grand plot involving hundreds or thousands to have been political targeting via the IRS and thus a major scandal.
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Fantasy-Island.jpeg
 
#1,498
#1,498
volinbham said:
Last night Koskinen said something like it was too expensive or not worth the trouble etc. He doesn't really have an answer for it. Clearly it wasn't deemed a priority to preserve them for whatever reason.
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Which still makes no sense. An FBI forensics team isn't expensive and doesn't show how serious they took it? Whole thing stinks to anyone thinking rationally
 
#1,500
#1,500
Rush Limbaugh said today that Obama should be impeached for using the IRS to damage his political opponents.


Did I miss something?
 
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