IRS admits to targeting Conservative groups

#76
#76
lawgator1 said:
They weren't subject to closer scrutiny because of their views. The fact is, there had been a huge increase in applications from groups claiming to be the tea party. They were sending out flyers and such to raise money. So groups doing that became a cause for concern.
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Can you read?

The damn IRS is saying their process was wrong and is apologizing for it. You honestly think they'd do that of they weren't targeting based on political views?
 
#77
#77
rockytop9808 said:
Can you read?

The damn IRS is saying their process was wrong and is apologizing for it. You honestly think they'd do that of they weren't targeting based on political views?
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First, they aren't supposed to use the names to identify 501(c)(4) applicants for the questionnaire. They apologized for it.

Second, their explanation as to the reason WHY it was done makes perfect sense in the context of what was going on.

So, my conclusion is that the low level employees doing it need to be retrained, and the next level supervisors who allowed it disciplined. But absent some solid reason to think it was motivated by politics, then that's the end of it.
 
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#78
#78
utvolpj said:
why are you still arguing this?

IRS apologizes for targeting tea party groups
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Because the right wing feigned outrage machine is trying to make it seem like the TPers were singled out based on animosity towards the TP.

I have said I agree that, if that were the case, that would be very wrong and the people involved fired for it. But that is not what the record shows.
 
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#79
#79
lawgator1 said:
They weren't subject to closer scrutiny because of their views. The fact is, there had been a huge increase in applications from groups claiming to be the tea party. They were sending out flyers and such to raise money. So groups doing that became a cause for concern.
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Your argument is invalid without showing any other large or small percentage of other groups applying in the same time period.

For example, do you even know how many liberal or OWA applications were submitted for the same time period?

Were over half of all the other applications that were not placed under further scrutiny unaffiliated with a political party?
 
#80
#80
lawgator1 said:
Because the right wing feigned outrage machine is trying to make it seem like the TPers were singled out based on animosity towards the TP.

I have said I agree that, if that were the case, that would be very wrong and the people involved fired for it. But that is not what the record shows.
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you're right, I'm not sure how anyone could think they were singled out

Organizations were singled out because they included the words "tea party" or "patriot" in their applications for tax-exempt status, said Lois Lerner, who heads the IRS division that oversees tax-exempt groups.
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#81
#81
utvolpj said:
you're right, I'm not sure how anyone could think they were singled out
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Because they included the words. Read the article. There had been an increase in organizations using those words and they were raising all sorts of money and no one knew where it was going. So, there was an effort to ensure that they were legit. And its 75 applicants out of 3,400 -- that's hardly damning.

As I originally said, I'd be much more concerned if there was some indication that their 501(c)(4) applications were being denied at a disproportionate rate. But no one seems to be claiming that, even the TP groups.

If that comes out, or if there is evidence that it was animosity towards the TPers that was behind it, then heads in the division in Cincinnati should definitely roll.
 
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#85
#85
lawgator1 said:
Because they included the words. Read the article. There had been an increase in organizations using those words and they were raising all sorts of money and no one knew where it was going. So, there was an effort to ensure that they were legit. And its 75 applicants out of 3,400 -- that's hardly damning.
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Lerner said that about 300 groups were singled out for additional review, with about one-quarter scrutinized because they had "tea party" or "patriot" somewhere in their applications.
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Read more: Republicans slam IRS targeting of Tea Party as 'chilling,' a form of intimidation | Fox News

Quit making stuff up.
 
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#86
#86
lawgator1 said:
Because the right wing feigned outrage machine is trying to make it seem like the TPers were singled out based on animosity towards the TP.

I have said I agree that, if that were the case, that would be very wrong and the people involved fired for it. But that is not what the record shows.
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There's a CNN article that has two members of the ACLU feigning that very same outrage. Wish somebody would post it...I'm at work right now.
 
#87
#87
lawgator1 said:
If that comes out, or if there is evidence that it was animosity towards the TPers that was behind it, then heads in the division in Cincinnati should definitely roll.
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If you think low level staffers, managers ext made the decision ON THEIR OWN to target these groups you are living in lala land.

I'm not saying this goes to the POTUS, not saying it doesn't either, but someone with pull had to authorize this. Someone had to put out the word that they wanted this done for a gov't employee to knowingly break the law and risk their employment.

I would venture to say most involved are CPAs, so by doing this not only would they be risking their job, they would be risking their CPA license, in essence their future livelihood. No way that happens unless they were sure they had top cover.

You going to risk your law license for something like this?
 
#91
#91
The irony is that if it came to light that there were a few outfits pretending to be Tea Party groups, and they bilked TPers out of a bunch of dough, you'd be crying about how ineffective the IRS was at stopping the fraud.
 
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#93
#93
lawgator1 said:
The irony is that if it came to light that there were a few outfits pretending to be Tea Party groups, and they bilked TPers out of a bunch of dough, you'd be crying about how ineffective the IRS was at stopping the fraud.
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is anyone arguing they are effective?

The IRS estimates that 21 to 25 percent of EITC payments were issued improperly in Fiscal Year 2012. The dollar value of these improper payments was estimated to be between $11.6 billion and $13.6 billion.
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#94
#94
There's going to be an investigation. I sincerely hope they get to the bottom of this and if there was actual bias or anti-conservative motivation, then that needs to be dealt with by firing the people who did it.
 
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#95
#95
lawgator1 said:
There's going to be an investigation. I sincerely hope they get to the bottom of this and if there was actual bias or anti-conservative motivation, then that needs to be dealt with by firing the people who did it.
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Wow, feigned outrage. I could almost see you crossing your fingers as you typed.
 
#96
#96
lawgator1 said:
there's going to be an investigation. I sincerely hope they get to the bottom of this and if there was actual bias or anti-conservative motivation, then that needs to be dealt with by firingand prosecuting the people who authorized/ordered it.
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fyp
 
#98
#98
lawgator1 said:
There's going to be an investigation. I sincerely hope they get to the bottom of this and if there was actual bias or anti-conservative motivation, then that needs to be dealt with by firing the people who did it.
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We actually had a top level IRS official apologize for this situation. I mean, do you understand what evidence there must be that prompted said apology? Yet, you're still trying to act like there's no real evidence. The apology from the IRS itself is evidence in and of itself.

I think you're seriously just trolling at this point or at least I hope that you are.
 
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#99
#99
hog88 said:
fyp
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Careful with that. This is the same problem that leads to easily indicting the Benghazi thing because, at some point, trying to go as high up the food chain as you can makes those doing the investigating look a little too focused on their own political targeting and inadequately focused on what ought to really matter..
 
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#100
#100
lawgator1 said:
Huh?

Obviously, political bias should play no role in the process whatsoever.
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:lol: The same political bias that was apologized for and literally everyone has acknowledged except for you. Seriously, are you just being stupid and refusing to see it or do you just think you're right and everyone else is wrong?
 
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