Iran

#5,526
#5,526
Tin Man said:
Assuming that Iran still has a supply of enriched uranium, even if they lack the ability to create and deliver a nuclear bomb during the present conflict, they could create and deliver a “dirty bomb.” The risks of the continuation of hostilities are very high. In response to the US bombing of their nuclear enrichment facilities, Iran has dismissed the US as a broker for ending hostilities with Israel. Who now can act to keep hostilities from escalating and expanding into other countries?
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Lots can go wrong. The goal now is for Iran, Israel and Saudi to get the Orange man to get his pew pew boots on the ground. I think they'll need more bait, maybe something in the U.S. or similar.
 
#5,530
#5,530
Orangeslice13 said:
You go ahead and drink your poison and handle your snakes.
Don’t let it bother you that no copy of mark contains those verses before 650 ce. And the 23 things that Hebrews gets wrong including the type of priesthood Yeshua represents, that should not bother you either.
If you didn’t recognize what Torah is then you’re probably not the kinda guy to have this conversation.
I’m a Messianic Jew which means I recognize Yeshua as the messiah in spite of the errors in the gospels and writings, not because of them.

Btw there was never anyone named Jesus. Till the 1600s the English speaking people called him Lesus. There was never anyone by that name either. It’s interesting that there are others in “the Bible” who had the same name as messiah but they are all translated “Joshua “. I wonder what that’s about?

(Rhetorical, I know what that’s about. I wrote a paper on it at the glorious university of Tennessee)
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LOL...I think I'll trust the people who have been studying the thousands of transcripts for decades over some random dude that gets some information off of some website.
 
#5,534
#5,534
n_huffhines said:
View attachment 750529
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If America was the only country of the 5 who signed off on the agreement holding Iran to the agreement and our exit caused Iran to go back to enriching, how effective was the agreement?

We talk out of the both sides of our mouth, here. We want America to be more isolationist...less meddlesome in the affairs of other countries, AND we want to blame America and its stupid leaders when they extract us from world police.

We're damned if we do and if we don't. It's our fault regardless.
 
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#5,536
#5,536
NashVol11 said:
I didn't deflect anything. You claimed Israelis are morally superior and given that there's a report of Israelis espousing genocidal views every few days, I am deeply skeptical they are morally superior to anyone.

And they're the ones in power! If damn near half the population is STILL saying "kill all 5 million people including women and children" then imagine what the percentage would be if they faced actual oppression
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That’s because you refuse to look at the people who attacked a music festival and parade nude dead women bleeding from her ass as a war trophy, with a critical eye. The one you use to accuse the Israelis .

If you want innocent people not to die then condemn those who started this war on 10/7 (quit making excuses for that action) and who hide behind their women and children.
Maybe they should also stop murdering their own people for protesting and trying to get food. (Ya, they tried to blame it on Israel too. The truth comes out and the accusations just move on to the next Bs accusation. )

Israel isn’t perfect and I’d do a lot of things differently but there’s no doubt who has handled this situation better.
 
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#5,538
#5,538
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
@Orangeslice13
@NashVol11

Looking for "who is more moral" is fruitless in world politics. We don't align with countries based on morality but based upon our interests.

The Saudis, for example, have a human rights record that would rival the Mongols. Absolutely brutal regime from every angle of human rights.

The Israelis have an abortion law which is among the most liberal in the world, including 3rd trimester abortion being legal and most abortions state funded. Basically, the most defenseless are worthless including the Orthodox view of not even requiring a funeral for a child less than 1 month old.

They are our close allies not because we embrace their culture or morality but because they align with our version of safety for the region and for the world.

Leave morality out of it. Humans are inherently savage, tribal beasts.
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Yup. Especially in a time of war. Morality goes out the window in favor of survival
 
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#5,539
#5,539
NashVol11 said:
For the most part I agree. Most of the "moral superiority" and "good guys" claims come from the Israel side, because they need that framing to justify questionable actions (and our conversation is about Gaza as much as anything else)
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Lol
If you stop posting nonsense about it then nobody will point out the hypocrisy of it
 
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#5,540
#5,540
Orangeslice13 said:
Yup. Especially in a time of war. Morality goes out the window in favor of survival
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Morality ALWAYS goes out the door to survival and we're always at war with the people of the next village. Always. It may be a dull war, a cold war, a silent war but it's always us vs them.

This is why today's domestic politics has proven so successful for the right. The appeal to the primal survival of the Republic, etc touches deeply in the psyche of humans. It works to obtain and maintain a strong base.
 
#5,541
#5,541
McDad said:
If America was the only country of the 5 who signed off on the agreement holding Iran to the agreement, how effective was the agreement?

We talk out of the both sides of our mouth, here. We want America to be more isolationist...less meddlesome in the affairs of other countries, AND we want to blame America and its stupid leaders when they extract us from world police.

We're damned if we do and if we don't. It's our fault regardless.
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This is an absolutely wild response and a false dichotomy.

You are right that we don't need to be policing Iran in the first place.

But we didn't say, "We don't care about any of this, we are minding our business, we're gonna be more isolationist." and then withdrew from the agreement. Isolationism was never part of the equation and it's astounding to see someone blame that as the issue.

We didn't just withdraw from a deal and mind our business. We put harsh sanctions on them. We treated them like an enemy. We were no longer agreeing to the peaceful terms of our agreement that made them feel like they didn't need to be enriching uranium. The whole reason we pulled out is that Trump said "It wasn't working." But it was, as my post perfectly illustrates. I'm calling out incompetence, and you are doing anything you can to find reasons to defend it. He was wrong. 100% completely wrong, and I called it out 6 years ago. I was right then. I can't believe anybody would still argue that today, but here you are.

We DO want to be the world's police, so we shouldn't withdraw from deals that are working if the result of pulling from the deal is "We gotta bomb them now because we broke the deal."

You are playing defense for the worst admin of all time.
 
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#5,542
#5,542
dalton_vol said:
LOL...I think I'll trust the people who have been studying the thousands of transcripts for decades over some random dude that gets some information off of some website.
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A degree from the university of Tennessee is hardly some website.
But
You will be judged all by yourself. This “some guy” and those people you sought out who agree with your preconceived beliefs won’t matter at all to you on your day of judgement.
The Mathew 7 warnings should be enough for you to do your own research and thinking. Messiah is talking about casting out people who think they are good at the day of judgement and he lists 2 standards. He doesn’t know them and they practice lawlessness.


I’m ok if you want to go out like a sheep following wolf’s. I’m more concerned about what the Messiah and the prophets actually said
 
#5,543
#5,543
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
Morality ALWAYS goes out the door to survival and we're always at war with the people of the next village. Always. It may be a dull war, a cold war, a silent war but it's always us vs them.

This is why today's domestic politics has proven so successful for the right. The appeal to the primal survival of the Republic, etc touches deeply in the psyche of humans. It works to obtain and maintain a strong base.
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I agree in part
I’ve always said the classic liberal sees things as they are. The self proclaimed liberal of today sees things as they should be (according to their non standardized definition)
 
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#5,546
#5,546
SayUWantAreVOLution said:
You may read for yourself. Iran was chaotic, we nudged the process, and actually tried to stop the plan, but Eisenhower definitely signed off on "things."
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I have read, the shah was the shah before the US got involved and his dad was the shah before him. We didn’t install him

The US didn’t want to get involved and I don’t think would have had Mosaddegh not went to the Soviet Union and started getting viewed as a communist
 
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#5,547
#5,547
Orangeslice13 said:
A degree from the university of Tennessee is hardly some website.
But
You will be judged all by yourself. This “some guy” and those people you sought out who agree with your preconceived beliefs won’t matter at all to you on your day of judgement.
The Mathew 7 warnings should be enough for you to do your own research and thinking. Messiah is talking about casting out people who think they are good at the day of judgement and he lists 2 standards. He doesn’t know them and they practice lawlessness.


I’m ok if you want to go out like a sheep following wolf’s. I’m more concerned about what the Messiah and the prophets actually said
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Ok so you wrote a paper. It still doesn't match the centuries of Biblical scholars that studied biblical. l translations I'll stick with them. It's always funny how so many people do their darndest to disprove the Bible especially the Old Testament
 
#5,549
#5,549
LouderVol said:
lol. they were responsible for 9/11 and we have never even blinked at them. they are pulling our strings for sure. the Israelis just lean into that aspect of influence as well.

The Sauds have long been against the Iranians. those are the two most stable/powerful in the area and have a long rivalry due to it.
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So you think the Saudis are controlling Trump.

mmmmmmkay
 
#5,550
#5,550
McDad said:
If America was the only country of the 5 who signed off on the agreement holding Iran to the agreement and our exit caused Iran to go back to enriching, how effective was the agreement?

We talk out of the both sides of our mouth, here. We want America to be more isolationist...less meddlesome in the affairs of other countries, AND we want to blame America and its stupid leaders when they extract us from world police.

We're damned if we do and if we don't. It's our fault regardless.
Click to expand...

They just need a reason to whine
 
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