If Tennessee chooses state law over NIL pledge, it risks being kicked out of SEC

[SmokinBob]

Yes, No, and No.

So, how will making students employees and utilizing collective bargaining have one iota of impact on NIL (sponsorships/marketing contracts between athletes and outside interests) ?

I think the NIL ”market” will self-correct.

My thinking is the unlimited portal is where our true problem lies. Somehow, the powers that be need to get a handle on that……and let the “market” self-correct with NIL. That’s just my opinion - and that and a dollar probably wouldn’t buy a cup of coffee!

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I see your point, but perfectly legal and sham are not mutually exclusive. It is in the spirit of NIL for a player to sell his NIL rights to the collective, and get fair market value for that transaction. But, the collectives don't expect to recoup their investment from selling the player's NIL. They are merely a conduit for boosters to pay a player "legally". Thus, the collective is a sham for boosters/fans to buy players, not really a NIL deal.

This occurs because the value of the player to the team is more than the value of the scholarship and other associated perks of attending that school.

The schools CANNOT compensate the players fair market value so the collective provides the rest of the money to attract the player to come to that team.

This is basic economics. The players market their skills and the employer pays them for those skills. Expecting that college football will not follow the laws of economics while being a billion dollar business would be crazy.

It has and it does. This is not unique. The only unique thing is the NCAA and schools attempting to still say college isn't a huge business, it's just some college students out on a Saturday playing sports for their school pride.

If you're looking for shams, look at the NCAA and schools for trying to pass off college athletics at the elite level as some Mickey Rooney old college movie about "Rah, rah for Old State U."

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

True, NCAA can’t control those groups but they can ban member institutions from coordinating, consulting with or associating with booster collectives.

Not legally, they can:t. That horse has left the barn and the barn door is closed and locked.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

It would be legit for the NCAA to ban booster collectives. Players would still be free to make as much as they can from their NIL, they would just have to find them on their own.

No, they can't. Not legally.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

So, how will making students employees and utilizing collective bargaining have one iota of impact on NIL (sponsorships/marketing contracts between athletes and outside interests) ?

I think the NIL ”market” will self-correct.

My thinking is the unlimited portal is where our true problem lies. Somehow, the powers that be need to get a handle on that……and let the “market” self-correct with NIL. That’s just my opinion - and that and a dollar probably wouldn’t buy a cup of coffee!

If they are employees, they won't have to be students.
If employees and an antitrust exemption, they could copy the NFL rule that prohibits the teams using NIL to get around the team salary caps.

I agree that the NIL market will self correct.
The free market always does.

There is no way to limit the portal transfers as long as the athletes are students. The Ohio case already settled that. The NCAA can't legally discriminate against athletes simply for being athletes. Every other student can transfer as they wish.

Unless .

Unless...the students are employees with contracts. That will limit transfers. It will also open the door to a 131 team draft to replace recruiting. It will allow unionization, collective bargaining, and strikes. It will eliminate the 3 military academies from FBS. It will eliminate the 5 year eligibility rule, which will further limit recruiting.

In that case, the cure is infinitely worse than the disease.

 

[SmokinBob]

If they are employees, they won't have to be students.
If employees and an antitrust exemption, they could copy the NFL rule that prohibits the teams using NIL to get around the team salary caps.

I agree that the NIL market will self correct.
The free market always does.

There is no way to limit the portal transfers as long as the athletes are students. The Ohio case already settled that. The NCAA can't legally discriminate against afir a 132 team FBS draft to replace recruiting thletes simply for being athletes. Every other student can transfer as they wish.

Unless .the students are employees with contracts. That will limit transfers. It will also open the door to a 131 team draft to replace recruiting. It will allow unionization, collective bargaining, and strikes. It will eliminate the 3 military academies from FBS. It will eliminate the 5 year eligibility rule, which will further limit recruiting.

In that case, the cure is infinitely worse than the disease.

Sigh

 

[SmokinBob]

If they are employees, they won't have to be students.
If employees and an antitrust exemption, they could copy the NFL rule that prohibits the teams using NIL to get around the team salary caps.

I agree that the NIL market will self correct.
The free market always does.

There is no way to limit the portal transfers as long as the athletes are students. The Ohio case already settled that. The NCAA can't legally discriminate against afir a 132 team FBS draft to replace recruiting thletes simply for being athletes. Every other student can transfer as they wish.

Unless .the students are employees with contracts. That will limit transfers. It will also open the door to a 131 team draft to replace recruiting. It will allow unionization, collective bargaining, and strikes. It will eliminate the 3 military academies from FBS. It will eliminate the 5 year eligibility rule, which will further limit recruiting.

In that case, the cure is infinitely worse than the disease.

Oh they can transfer, just like any other student…but they can’t play their sport for a year...

 

[Godfatha]

Get rid of unlimited transfers and make players sit out a year for a transfer (maybe give them one free transfer), and the problem would solve itself. The transfer portal is the problem, much moreso than NIL. What problems NIL has is magnified by the stupid transfer portal policies.

 

[SubVet676]

One portal window per year. Opens the Monday after the national championship game and stays open for two weeks. That’s it. One free transfer per student. If you transfer again, you sit out a year. If your coach leaves, you get an additional free transfer. Five years to play four. You can have one and only one medical exemption year. That doesn’t fix NIL, but it does fix the portal mess.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Oh they can transfer, just like any other student…but they can’t play their sport for a year...

That violates federal law. Again, that did ruminates against student athletes simply because they are athletes. See the ruling in the Ohio vs NCAA case that affirmed that.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

One portal window per year. Opens the Monday after the national championship game and stays open for two weeks. That’s it. One free transfer per student. If you transfer again, you sit out a year. If your coach leaves, you get an additional free transfer. Five years to play four. You can have one and only one medical exemption year. That doesn’t fix NIL, but it does fix the portal mess.

That is illegal and unworkable.

The semester ends in December. Students can enroll in another school before Christmas. No sit outs after transfers. That is illegal. No limits on transfers - again, illegal. No penalty for getting hurt. That is discriminatory.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Oh they can transfer, just like any other student…but they can’t play their sport for a year...

Why are you and so many others advocating for violating federal law and court case decisions? UT folks are supposed to be smarter than that!

Worse, why are there so many control freaks on this board.

And...if you've ever changed jobs, you are nauseatingly hypocritical.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

One portal window per year. Opens the Monday after the national championship game and stays open for two weeks. That’s it. One free transfer per student. If you transfer again, you sit out a year. If your coach leaves, you get an additional free transfer. Five years to play four. You can have one and only one medical exemption year. That doesn’t fix NIL, but it does fix the portal mess.

Perhaps you're not familiar with Ohio v NCAA which the NCAA essentially lost? Preventing a player from playing after multiple transfers is anticompetitive and a violation of Antitrust Law.

The NCAA changed their rules after the Federal Court essentially told them to allow multiple transfers.

Other than being in violation of Federal Antitrust Law, you have a great plan. While you may not care about Federal Laws, most people do.

Antitrust—Labor Market Violations: NCAA Agrees to Stop Restricting College Athlete Transfers

The National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) will stop enforcing rules restricting Division I athletes from transferring from one institution to another under a consent judgment filed in an antitrust lawsuit brought by the U.S. Department of Justice (DOJ), ten states, and the District of...

natlawreview.com

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

I still cannot believe how many of you really care about this whole Nike/Adidas thing.

 

[OrangeBeachVol]

Get rid of unlimited transfers and make players sit out a year for a transfer (maybe give them one free transfer), and the problem would solve itself. The transfer portal is the problem, much moreso than NIL. What problems NIL has is magnified by the stupid transfer portal policies.

Yes to this. The NIL needs some corrections for sure but the unlimited transfer portal just compounds the NIL issues. Fixing the portal would be a big step towards correcting the wild wild west of college sports now.

 

[woodpusher]

Tennessee isn't going to lease the rights when they are making money hand over fist. Why let a 3rd party milk your cash cow?

It might stave off lawsuits from the women....temporarily anyway.Surely they collect a pretty penny when they license merchandise.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Yes to this. The NIL needs some corrections for sure but the unlimited transfer portal just compounds the NIL issues. Fixing the portal would be a big step towards correcting the wild wild west of college sports now.

The portal IS fixed. The courts fixed it.

 

[UT97Vol]

That violates federal law. Again, that did ruminates against student athletes simply because they are athletes. See the ruling in the Ohio vs NCAA case that affirmed that.

It could be a criteria/rule however if agreed to when collective bargaining eventually comes to the table.

 

[UT97Vol]

So, how will making students employees and utilizing collective bargaining have one iota of impact on NIL (sponsorships/marketing contracts between athletes and outside interests) ?

I think the NIL ”market” will self-correct.

My thinking is the unlimited portal is where our true problem lies. Somehow, the powers that be need to get a handle on that……and let the “market” self-correct with NIL. That’s just my opinion - and that and a dollar probably wouldn’t buy a cup of coffee!

It’s a fair question but NIL can also be addressed through a CBA. More specifically I would expect that universities, conferences, etc, eliminate collectives and that NIL deals will have to be done by the athlete and the company. No middle men. That’s just a thought of one way but there are others.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

It’s a fair question but NIL can also be addressed through a CBA. More specifically I would expect that universities, conferences, etc, eliminate collectives and that NIL deals will have to be done by the athlete and the company. No middle men. That’s just a thought of one way but there are others.

You just can't legally stop a group of UT boosters from forming a collective for UT players and you won't be able to stop a connection between the school and that collective. It works for the schools in recruiting just like paying players via boosters worked before NIL.

Legally, what makes you think you can stop the collective from existing?

Practically, what makes you think the schools won't use the collectives to pay players?

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

It’s a fair question but NIL can also be addressed through a CBA. More specifically I would expect that universities, conferences, etc, eliminate collectives and that NIL deals will have to be done by the athlete and the company. No middle men. That’s just a thought of one way but there are others.

The schools can't legally interfere with private NIL deals between two third parties. They can't do it individually, as that's an illegal interruption of private commerce. They can't do it collectively because that creates an illegal monopoly and extortion..

 

[UT97Vol]

The schools can't legally interfere with private NIL deals between two third parties. They can't do it individually, as that's an illegal interruption of private commerce. They can't do it collectively because that creates an illegal monopoly and extortion..

It’s not illegal if the union agrees to it. Obviously we’re talking about hypotheticals here since there is no CBA, but a CBA can include and enforce limits on third party contracts though I acknowledge it’s complex and not easy. I don’t think we ever get to resolution on these issues unless something like that is included and agreed to by the parties with respect to NIL. To me this isn’t the biggest issue. It’s the universities athletics operating as a for profit business under the umbrella of their non-profit, tax exempt institutions. Kentucky created an LLC for athletics which looks like a first attempt to address that issue. Whether that’s enough or not I don’t know. Probably not.

Btw, DW basically came right out and said this weekend that a CBA is the only solution to these issues. I agree with that.

 

[HeuperDrive]

Where we going boyz......I say we go independent like Notre Dame, Uconn and Umass

Independence or B1G are the only options in this scenario (which, I personally doubt anything will come of this, but at this point nothing surprises me anymore). Would 1000% prefer independence to the latter, but leaving the SEC for the B1G would be the ultimate middle finger to Sankey and the SEC. Have to admit I’d love to see us be that petty.

 

[UT97Vol]

Independence or B1G are the only options in this scenario (which, I personally doubt anything will come of this, but at this point nothing surprises me anymore). Would 1000% prefer independence to the latter, but leaving the SEC for the B1G would be the ultimate middle finger to Sankey and the SEC. Have to admit I’d love to see us be that petty.

We’re not leaving the SEC nor are we getting kicked out. We hold the cards because the law is in our side.

 

[HeuperDrive]

We’re not leaving the SEC nor are we getting kicked out. We hold the cards because the law is in our side.

luckily, I said I doubt anything will come of this.

It’s right there in the post you quoted.