I just don't understand (Barnett vs Garrett)

#51
#51
WildTurkey said:
Haha no that's not it. Please stop. It doesn't make anyone less of a Vol fan to acknowledge that Myles Garrett is a better athlete than Barnett. He is. Period.

It doesn't mean Garrett is a better player. It doesn't mean he'll have a better career or make more money. It doesn't mean he has a prettier girlfriend or a nicer apartment. He's just a better athlete.

And to whoever said the Clowney hit only happened because he was unblocked, so what? It was devastating physically and competitively - changed the outcome of the game. Highlight for the ages. Doesn't make Barnett's sack any less appreciated to say so. That sack probably isn't even Barnett's best play to be honest.
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Is he a better athlete? Probably. But he is not the better football player. Those are two different things. DB is the better football player. Great athletes don't always translate into great football players.
 
#52
#52
I don't know if he's a better athlete. However DB has been injured (not sure about how nicked up Garrett has been). DB has done well against the run and has played inside the tackle on several occasions.
 
#53
#53
titansvolsfaninga said:
so you are in awe because the players helmet came off? They both were good hits. The RB said the hit looked worse than it was. Vincent Smith of Michigan Wolverines talks about hit by Jadeveon Clowney of South Carolina Gamecocks

however the NW QB was actually hurt. If CBJ had not taken a timeout, the QB was coming out of the game.
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Bravo Butch, another good use of a timeout to help the other team. If Shoop is in charge of timeouts this year for the D we might actually win 10 games
 
#54
#54
Grand Vol said:
You don't think Barnett is capable of the same ferocity as that hit? He ended up taking the Northwestern QB off his feet for over a yard. And that's after getting blocked.

Imagine that scary man coming at you full speed...

Call me a homer, but I wasn't as impressed with Clowney after that season. I know he was plagued by injuries, but his stats didn't reflect what he could and should have been. Between the two? I'd take DB all day long.
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I don't necessarily disagree. I was just making the distinction between player and athlete. I'm sure Barnett is plenty capable of a lot of stuff.
 
#55
#55
titansvolsfaninga said:
Is he a better athlete? Probably. But he is not the better football player. Those are two different things. DB is the better football player. Great athletes don't always translate into great football players.
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Again you may be 100% right. Scouts aren't always correct and measurables don't always tell the whole story. My comparison was purely meant to explain why Garrett receives so much more hype - he is a freak athlete and he has had a few of those highlight plays that go viral like the Clowney play.

That said, I wouldn't trade Barnett for anyone. He's an instate guy who stayed home. I think he can break Reggie's record if our DTs play well.
 
#56
#56
titansvolsfaninga said:
so you are in awe because the players helmet came off? They both were good hits. The RB said the hit looked worse than it was. Vincent Smith of Michigan Wolverines talks about hit by Jadeveon Clowney of South Carolina Gamecocks

however the NW QB was actually hurt. If CBJ had not taken a timeout, the QB was coming out of the game.
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Uh I'm impressed because at a pivotal point in the game he took control - knifed inside, met the tailback as he took the handoff, laid him out, and had the wherewithal to pick up the football like I pick up a potato. Don't act like it wasn't an impressive play.

And what would you expect Smith to say? "Oh yeah Clowney hit me so hard my dog limps?" He downplayed it because he was on the wrong end of a play that will live on highlight reels forever.
 
#57
#57
WildTurkey said:
Uh I'm impressed because at a pivotal point in the game he took control - knifed inside, met the tailback as he took the handoff, laid him out, and had the wherewithal to pick up the football like I pick up a potato. Don't act like it wasn't an impressive play.

And what would you expect Smith to say? "Oh yeah Clowney hit me so hard my dog limps?" He downplayed it because he was on the wrong end of a play that will live on highlight reels forever.
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he still had his witts about him. He tried to pick up the ball. I've been hit hard, and there is a moment when you are dazed. Smith did not act dazed.
 
#59
#59
08Vol said:
Bravo Butch, another good use of a timeout to help the other team. If Shoop is in charge of timeouts this year for the D we might actually win 10 games
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lol You literally have the video right in front of you and you can't figure out why a timeout was called there?

Here, I'll give you a couple of hints.

Look at:

The quarter

The time left

The score

and try to figure out why someone would take a timeout in that situation. I have faith that you can manage that.
 
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#60
#60
VKAman said:
They weren't a triple option offense when he was there. He played for Chan Gailey, now an NFL OC, and then they switched coaches after he left.
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Good call. disregard my previous statement.

Johnson's numbers were actually pretty good at GT. Reggie Ball was a great athlete and pretty good QB, but I think Johnson made him look better than he was.
 
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#61
#61
WildTurkey said:
Haha no that's not it. Please stop. It doesn't make anyone less of a Vol fan to acknowledge that Myles Garrett is a better athlete than Barnett. He is. Period.

It doesn't mean Garrett is a better player. It doesn't mean he'll have a better career or make more money. It doesn't mean he has a prettier girlfriend or a nicer apartment. He's just a better athlete.

And to whoever said the Clowney hit only happened because he was unblocked, so what? It was devastating physically and competitively - changed the outcome of the game. Highlight for the ages. Doesn't make Barnett's sack any less appreciated to say so. That sack probably isn't even Barnett's best play to be honest.
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I have a sneaking suspicion you just have a man crush on Garrett more than you do Barnett. Their stats are similar, they both hit solid, and I really wish Butch had gotten both. But if someone were sculpting statues of the two, yeah you might sell a few more of Garrett. I am not sure, I have not browsed the internet to see if they have posted pictures of themselves body building poses online. Not my thing. (Don't feel bad though. Using the same eye test, I figured Dewayne Hendrix would be the better of the two when they were being recruited.)

But watching them both, I would not take Garrett over Barnett at all. I have seen Barnett fight through the double team, but not Garnett. If those silly refs would flag Barnett's opponents for holding every once in awhile, I doubt you would even try to argue this.
 
#62
#62
titansvolsfaninga said:
so you are in awe because the players helmet came off? They both were good hits. The RB said the hit looked worse than it was. Vincent Smith of Michigan Wolverines talks about hit by Jadeveon Clowney of South Carolina Gamecocks

however the NW QB was actually hurt. If CBJ had not taken a timeout, the QB was coming out of the game.
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I was gonna mention this. The Michigan RB was still trying to grab the ball after the hit. All Thorson could do was lay there face-down with his hands on his facemask. Not too mention Thorson was a really big, stout QB. I think the size of the Michigan RB had a lot to do with how violent the Clowney hit looked.
 
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#63
#63
Titans4Vols said:
lol You literally have the video right in front of you and you can't figure out why a timeout was called there?

Here, I'll give you a couple of hints.

Look at:

The quarter

The time left

The score

and try to figure out why someone would take a timeout in that situation. I have faith that you can manage that.
Click to expand...

Not to mention that it could have very easily been a fumble, any coach would have called a timeout here to: 1. Preserve time for one last possession b4 the half and 2. Review the play to see if it was a fumble. 3. Peel Thorson off of the turf:birgits_giggle:
 
#64
#64
TNnative said:
I have a sneaking suspicion you just have a man crush on Garrett more than you do Barnett. Their stats are similar, they both hit solid, and I really wish Butch had gotten both. But if someone were sculpting statues of the two, yeah you might sell a few more of Garrett. I am not sure, I have not browsed the internet to see if they have posted pictures of themselves body building poses online. Not my thing. (Don't feel bad though. Using the same eye test, I figured Dewayne Hendrix would be the better of the two when they were being recruited.)

But watching them both, I would not take Garrett over Barnett at all. I have seen Barnett fight through the double team, but not Garnett. If those silly refs would flag Barnett's opponents for holding every once in awhile, I doubt you would even try to argue this.
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There are some serious reading comprehension problems in this thread. At no point in this thread or in others have I claimed to prefer Garrett over Barnett. At no point have I claimed Garrett was a better player.

I have said Garrett is a better athlete (and he is). I have said Garrett has more highlight reel plays due to that athleticism (and he does).

That's it. Now feel free to argue about those opinions, but don't put words in my mouth.
 
#65
#65
This isn't really anything that others haven't echoed, but the way I see it is like this:

Garrett has the size and speed combination that clearly give him a higher upside. He basically has the ideal build for an NFL DE and has great athleticism to boot. So naturally he'll get the nod draft and evaluation wise as long as his production is on par with a guy like Barnett. That being said, I think Barnett might actually be better at playing the game of football. But he's never going to be a guy who can win based purely on size, speed, or strength.

JMO
 
#66
#66
WildTurkey said:
There are some serious reading comprehension problems in this thread. At no point in this thread or in others have I claimed to prefer Garrett over Barnett. At no point have I claimed Garrett was a better player.

I have said Garrett is a better athlete (and he is). I have said Garrett has more highlight reel plays due to that athleticism (and he does).

That's it. Now feel free to argue about those opinions, but don't put words in my mouth.
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OK you believe that. You have a right to a simple opinion. Just bustin your chops, man, don't take it personal.

I still think you have a man crush on Garrett, and down deep, he might appreciate it.
 
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#67
#67
Darth_Shiveman said:
This isn't really anything that others haven't echoed, but the way I see it is like this:

Garrett has the size and speed combination that clearly give him a higher upside. He basically has the ideal build for an NFL DE and has great athleticism to boot. So naturally he'll get the nod draft and evaluation wise as long as his production is on par with a guy like Barnett. That being said, I think Barnett might actually be better at playing the game of football. But he's never going to be a guy who can win based purely on size, speed, or strength.

JMO
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I don't know. Much of that depends on the draft order, and each team's needs, evaluation and the interview. One thing you left out was drive and game IQ. And they may both be fairly equal.

If they both play long careers in the league, we might rehash it later on. Who knows? we may do it this season. Both are still developing to a certain degree. Be interesting to watch them both.
 
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