I don't understand the "True fans are the ones that back Cuonzo"

#51
#51
VolsSportsFan said:
Actually it's not even close to similar, but given your debate style, I'm not shocked you can't comprehend that.
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Says the guy who does nothing but spend his time criticiting every thread created or post made, in a smart a$$ way.

Comical, as Philly would say.
 
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#52
#52
VolArmy74 said:
Another thing is people have invested a whole lot in defending Martin at all costs and some of them never ever ever like to admit to being wrong.

Me, I hope we make the final 4 and Martin comes out next year and goes 40-0. I'd love to be wrong.
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It works both ways.

You've got those saying no matter what Martin does they won't support him, seemingly because they don't want to admit being wrong.

I want to win, I don't really care who the coach is, right now we're in the dance with Zo. GBO!
 
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#54
#54
lostsheep said:
Says the guy who does nothing but spend his time criticiting every thread created or post made, in a smart a$$ way.

Comical, as Philly would say.
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As opposed to being the guy who keep throwing out accusations yet can't even give one example.
 
#55
#55
VolArmy74 said:
They are here and you know it. That is why these threads exist. People aren't just making it up.

I was told earlier today I was using facts to be negative towards him and to worship Pearl, even though I never mentioned Pearl in any context. Not using lies, not even opinions, I was using "facts" to do it.

To me there should be two camps. Those who think Martin is going to get it done and those who don't. If you really think he's not the man for the job, it's okay to admit it. Don't defend him and call others out who don't support him, but then claim you don't really think he's the man that's going to get it done. Lots have also shifted to that tactic on here lately.

I will call out some people in the anti-Zo camp too, you shouldn't hope UT loses, ever. Not to Iowa, not to Auburn.

Best case, we win out, Zo improves, next year is good. Long term is bright and Zo is here in 20 years.

Worst case, we lose tomorrow, Zo gets a raise/extension, recruiting stays subpar and we flirt with the NIT or worse next season but can't fire him due to the new buyout.

Sadly I think closer to the second scenario is most likely in the future. I'm not Nostrodomus or anything, just someone who's watched a lot of basketball and has saw this story play out on the hill before.
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This story has not played out this way since I have been watching, and I am in my mid-30's. No UT coach has made the NCAAT, been this polarizing, and questioned whether or not he should get an extension. Green was close, but his results were fine, and he had to be bought out after a silly comment. I don't know that Houston and Peterson were ever extended (probably a year) and never made the NCAAT. O'Neil left on his own, and we all know Pearl's situation. This is truly a scenario that has not been set up at our university.
 
#56
#56
VolsSportsFan said:
You have no business telling anyone to stop anything after the gems you've posted today.
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You mean I should be living in your little fantasy world instead of living in reality and not having high expectations for next year? Gotcha.
 
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#57
#57
VolArmy74 said:
They are here and you know it. That is why these threads exist. People aren't just making it up.

I was told earlier today I was using facts to be negative towards him and to worship Pearl, even though I never mentioned Pearl in any context. Not using lies, not even opinions, I was using "facts" to do it.

To me there should be two camps. Those who think Martin is going to get it done and those who don't. If you really think he's not the man for the job, it's okay to admit it. Don't defend him and call others out who don't support him, but then claim you don't really think he's the man that's going to get it done. Lots have also shifted to that tactic on here lately.

I will call out some people in the anti-Zo camp too, you shouldn't hope UT loses, ever. Not to Iowa, not to Auburn.

Best case, we win out, Zo improves, next year is good. Long term is bright and Zo is here in 20 years.

Worst case, we lose tomorrow, Zo gets a raise/extension, recruiting stays subpar and we flirt with the NIT or worse next season but can't fire him due to the new buyout.

Sadly I think closer to the second scenario is most likely in the future. I'm not Nostrodomus or anything, just someone who's watched a lot of basketball and has saw this story play out on the hill before.
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I constantly see people labeled Martin lovers for not agreeing 100% that he sucks and that he should go. I see it in response to rational points made that happen to be in favor of Martin, and in response to anyone who was not 100% BBB. This includes arguing that Martin WON'T be fired, and yet this almost always gets interpreted as SHOULD NOT BE. There's a world of difference.

I've yet to see anyone that is even a fraction rabid for Martin like those who were adamant for BBB and anti-Martin.
 
#59
#59
VolFreakJosh said:
You mean I should be living in your little fantasy world instead of living in reality and not having high expectations for next year? Gotcha.
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Please show me where I said anything about how great we are going to be next year?

Also please show me proof that you know 100% what is going to happen next year.
 
#60
#60
VolGee4 said:
This story has not played out this way since I have been watching, and I am in my mid-30's. No UT coach has made the NCAAT, been this polarizing, and questioned whether or not he should get an extension. Green was close, but his results were fine, and he had to be bought out after a silly comment. I don't know that Houston and Peterson were ever extended (probably a year) and never made the NCAAT. O'Neil left on his own, and we all know Pearl's situation. This is truly a scenario that has not been set up at our university.
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What? Green was hated on the same level that we usually reserve for rival coaches like Calapari, James Franklin or Saban.

There was a series of blunders on his part that led to him sailing out of town on his boat.
 
#61
#61
bleedingTNorange said:
That's funny coming from someone who was campaigning for Pearl's return.
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I never said he was going to return. I wanted him to come back to Tennessee as bad as anyone but I knew it was going to be a long shot. I didn't think Hart would have had the guts to hire him back in the first place.
 
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#62
#62
BOBeLITE said:
I just don't get it.. Don't get me wrong I'm a die hard TN fan through and through. Always have been and always will be. But I don't understand why I'm not a true fan if I don't like Cuonzo. I cheer for this team and these players but it kills me to see all this talent get beat and out coached.. I think people like me who were disappointed with Pearl going to Auburn were more upset with the fact that they got a great coach that has proven he can win. I'm a fan that is worried about the future of this program. It's crazy because it's like "we made the play in game in a tournament of 68, so let's forget we were prob gonna fire this coach if he didn't make the tournament.." I think we know what we got with Cuonzo, that's fine he's a good coach.. Not great, but good. Of all these people who back him now, will you still if we lose to Iowa?
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Did you sign the petition for Pearl? If so how do you feel now that Pearl is at Auburn? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but I just think that the petition was one of the most bone headed actions in Vol sports history. Even more so than the fans crying & burning mattress when you know who left for USC. Look how that situation turned out for the Trojans. Fans wanting the Vols to lose so Martin would get fired so Pearl would get hired back. Please, the first second Pearl got a offer he accepted. I don't blame him that is what he does. At least Auburn is getting 35,000 new fans! No, I just don't get it!
 
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#64
#64
VolArmy74 said:
What? Green was hated on the same level that we usually reserve for rival coaches like Calapari, James Franklin or Saban.

There was a series of blunders on his part that led to him sailing out of town on his boat.
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Which I believe he named "Four Twenties", IIRC
 
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#65
#65
bleedingTNorange said:
I want to win, I don't really care who the coach is, right now we're in the dance with Zo. GBO!
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It's that right there... You don't care who the coach is? Having a good coach makes you win more... I think a lot of people on here care who the coach is because they want to see us win more!

And the second part.. Everyone seems to be blinded by the "we're in the dance!" That's fine! Call it what you want but we barely made the round of 68... We are in a play-in game.. While yes anything can happen and I hope I'm wrong about this team and coach.. I however am concerned about after we lose and it's over... Then what? Give Cuonzo an extension? Cut our losses? Bruce was a slim shot but he's def off the table now... Him going to aub is loss for tn... Let's just face it.. It hurts.. But ignoring it by saying shut up "we're goin dancing" isnt going to fix mediocracy....
 
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#66
#66
GAVol said:
I've asked this of several people who have made this assertion . . . Who are these people supposedly lifting Martin above all criticism and defending him at all costs? I can't recall anybody doing that. Even the truest of the true believers were going negative on Martin by the second loss to A&M.
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Maybe those that didn't sign the petition?

I like Martin but he has yet to prove he deserves the job going forward. I'm also not gonna lose any sleep over Pearl losing his job and being hired by Auburn when they had an opening.

I guess I'm one of those that doesn't have a dog/coach in the hunt.
 
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#67
#67
BeecherVol said:
Maybe those that didn't sign the petition?

I like Martin but he has yet to prove he deserves the job going forward. I'm also not gonna lose any sleep over Pearl losing his job and being hired by Auburn when they had an opening.

I guess I'm one of those that doesn't have a dog/coach in the hunt.
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How doe not signing the petition mean you defend Martin at all costs?
 
#68
#68
BOBeLITE said:
I just don't get it.. Don't get me wrong I'm a die hard TN fan through and through. Always have been and always will be. But I don't understand why I'm not a true fan if I don't like Cuonzo. I cheer for this team and these players but it kills me to see all this talent get beat and out coached.. I think people like me who were disappointed with Pearl going to Auburn were more upset with the fact that they got a great coach that has proven he can win. I'm a fan that is worried about the future of this program. It's crazy because it's like "we made the play in game in a tournament of 68, so let's forget we were prob gonna fire this coach if he didn't make the tournament.." I think we know what we got with Cuonzo, that's fine he's a good coach.. Not great, but good. Of all these people who back him now, will you still if we lose to Iowa?
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You don't have to back Cuonzo, but you do have to back the team. There were posters on here hoping we would lose games so Martin would be fired in the delusional belief we would then rehire Bruce Pearl. That's ludicrous. You don't hope for your team to lose. Dislike CCM as much as you want, but don't root for the Vols to fail because you dislike him.Admittedly, he's not proven to be the greatest coach IMO, but no "true fan" should ever hope to fail to satisfy the agenda of getting a new coach. Some see keeping him as a step back, but winning is never a step back. If anything, it's an attraction to possible future coaches. What's not an attraction is firing a coach in a year he's taken you to the tournament, unless there's just cause.
 
#69
#69
Weezer said:
You don't have to back Cuonzo, but you do have to back the team. There were posters on here hoping we would lose games so Martin would be fired in the delusional belief we would then rehire Bruce Pearl. That's ludicrous. You don't hope for your team to lose. Dislike CCM as much as you want, but don't root for the Vols to fail because you dislike him.Admittedly, he's not proven to be the greatest coach IMO, but no "true fan" should ever hope to fail to satisfy the agenda of getting a new coach. Some see keeping him as a step back, but winning is never a step back. If anything, it's an attraction to possible future coaches. What's not an attraction is firing a coach in a year he's taken you to the tournament, unless there's just cause.
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Would not recruiting at a high enough level to compete for SEC championships be "just cause?"

Like your signature, btw..."darkness is coming"...the motto of next years b-ball season.
 
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#70
#70
VolArmy74 said:
What? Green was hated on the same level that we usually reserve for rival coaches like Calapari, James Franklin or Saban.

There was a series of blunders on his part that led to him sailing out of town on his boat.
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I was at UT. He was liked until his last year, and although his last team collapsed at the end of the year, he probably would have survived without the silly comments. Plus, UT fired him, which is the opposite of "I have seen this on the Hill before." If history repeats, then Martin may not get extended. This situation is truly not something that is the norm at UT. We either have coaches that really suck and can't make the NCAAT and get fired. Or, we have a coach who makes a silly comment about fans or a coach who is beloved and gets hammered by the NCAA. Never have we had a nice, above average coach who has made the NCAAT, yet the fan base and AD are divided about giving him an extension.
 
#71
#71
BeecherVol said:
Maybe those that didn't sign the petition?

I like Martin but he has yet to prove he deserves the job going forward. I'm also not gonna lose any sleep over Pearl losing his job and being hired by Auburn when they had an opening.

I guess I'm one of those that doesn't have a dog/coach in the hunt.
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Uhh, no. I loved Bruce, but I don't sign petitions, especially in the middle of a season. That logic is flawed.

Edit: I see your comment below. Sorry.
 
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#72
#72
VolsSportsFan said:
I constantly see people labeled Martin lovers for not agreeing 100% that he sucks and that he should go. I see it in response to rational points made that happen to be in favor of Martin, and in response to anyone who was not 100% BBB. This includes arguing that Martin WON'T be fired, and yet this almost always gets interpreted as SHOULD NOT BE. There's a world of difference.

I've yet to see anyone that is even a fraction rabid for Martin like those who were adamant for BBB and anti-Martin.
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IMO, the posters getting attacked as Martin lovers are simply those defending the team. I'm not going to root for the Vols to lose just to see Martin fired. Does that mean I think CCM is a great coach? No, it doesn't, but he's winning. People can say what they want about the play-in game, but we're in the tournament with a chance to advance. We're part of March Madness, not bystanders. That's not a bad thing, yet many on here seem to think it is.
 
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#73
#73
lostsheep said:
Would not recruiting at a high enough level to compete for SEC championships be "just cause?"

Like your signature, btw..."darkness is coming"...the motto of next years b-ball season.
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I'm not Nostradamus so unlike you I can't see the future. I'll just wait for it to unfold before making judgement calls.

I will say I've seen great teams win championships by beating teams that had great players.
 
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