How to id a great recruiter

#1
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I40flyer

keeping it real
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#1
How do you know if a coach is a "Great Recruiter"? A lot of people base it on how a player did in HS. Others would say it is how they played in college. If a coach recruits a large number of five star players, and they don't play well in college, were they good recruits? At the same time if a coach recruits a large number of three star players and they play well (many going pro), does that make the coach a great recruiter-in this case I'd say, "Hell Yes".

All the noise regarding how great a recruiter cbj was, is now followed up with," but he wasn't a good coach, blah, blah, blah.....". Based on what? How do we, at UT, determine if a given coach was a great recruiter but a bad coach, or was bad recruiter AND a bad coach? What would be the difference in outcomes, one that- anyone looking at it would be able to say, "Great Recruiter" but bad coach, or "Bad Recruiter and Bad Coach".

How a young HS player played, is worth a noting, but is NOT how he is going to play in the SEC, competition is a little bit different at this level.:hi:
 
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#7
#7
I’m not a huge proponent of the star system in evaluating high school talent. But, there’s enough information out there that I do think they’re in the ball park. I can believe easily that hype, the school they attend, etc, can take a player from four to five stars. It’s probably not taking him from a two to a four.

I also know that there are busts every year. As hard as they try to evaluate, some players just don’t pan out like most thought they would.

Jones was reasonably good at getting guys that were well rated. Unless he just was really unlucky and signed a greatly disproportionate number of players who were overrated and/or busts, you would have to say he was a good recruiter. He brought highly rated players into the program.

In my mind, this makes him a bad coach. You HAVE to develop players. There are very few players that fall out of bed and play at the D1A level. The top, elite programs recruit the best high school players and build them into the best college players. They don’t become that on their own.
 
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#8
#8
I personally think he was a very good recruiter. He may not have chosen players that fit his system, but he recruited a lot of good players. For at least the last 2 years, he did not develop the talent that he had available.

I think we will see Jones' players doing a lot better in 2018. All of a sudden, they will be living up to their rankings. At least, I hope so.

Edit: Why does each new OP have to be treated so bad? Is it not OK to start a new thread with an interesting topic? And, if you do not think it is interesting, can you not just move on?
 
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#9
#9
:thud:
I40flyer said:
How do you know if a coach is a "Great Recruiter"? A lot of people base it on how a player did in HS. Others would say it is how they played in college. If a coach recruits a large number of five star players, and they don't play well in college, were they good recruits? At the same time if a coach recruits a large number of three star players and they play well (many going pro), does that make the coach a great recruiter-in this case I'd say, "Hell Yes".

All the noise regarding how great a recruiter cbj was, is now followed up with," but he wasn't a good coach, blah, blah, blah.....". Based on what? How do we, at UT, determine if a given coach was a great recruiter but a bad coach, or was bad recruiter AND a bad coach? What would be the difference in outcomes, one that- anyone looking at it would be able to say, "Great Recruiter" but bad coach, or "Bad Recruiter and Bad Coach".

How a young HS player played, is worth a noting, but is NOT how he is going to play in the SEC, competition is a little bit different at this level.:hi:
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:) :lolabove::eek:lol::crazy::blink::eek:k::cray::birgits_giggle::mf_surrender::banghead2::whistling::snoring::furious3::moon2::thud::) Ohhhhhhh meeeeee!!
 
#10
#10
k9gXCUs.gif
 
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#11
#11
hexnut said:
He just recruited with out regard to what he needed.
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I think this explains a lot of the discrepancy between the recruiting rankings and the failure to live up to those expectations. Add p!ss-poor coaching, lousy game management and weak S&C and you end up with 2017.
 
#13
#13
Not to go down a rabbit hole but Last year I was getting gas in Lenoir City and this guy pulls up to the pump next to me. I look in his car and he has what seems to be hundreds of cell phones draped around the passenger seat. I asked him if he worked for Verizon or something and he said he was a recruiter for UT.

What were all those phones for? Are they worried someone may not get through when they call?
 
#17
#17
Good recruiters get highly rated players and find the occasional diamond in the rough. That is it.

Coaching up average recruits is being a good developer of talent.
 
#18
#18
He was good recruiter until everyone figured out it was all talk. Thats why we couldn't keep guys in state.
 
#19
#19
Don't confuse recruiting with player evaluation and determining if a player fits your needs.

As others have said, Jones and his staff were good recruiters but he got some players that couldn't play in his system and he didn't adjust to his players or develop them to be able to do what he needed.
 
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#20
#20
I40flyer said:
How do you know if a coach is a "Great Recruiter"? A lot of people base it on how a player did in HS. Others would say it is how they played in college. If a coach recruits a large number of five star players, and they don't play well in college, were they good recruits? At the same time if a coach recruits a large number of three star players and they play well (many going pro), does that make the coach a great recruiter-in this case I'd say, "Hell Yes".

All the noise regarding how great a recruiter cbj was, is now followed up with," but he wasn't a good coach, blah, blah, blah.....". Based on what? How do we, at UT, determine if a given coach was a great recruiter but a bad coach, or was bad recruiter AND a bad coach? What would be the difference in outcomes, one that- anyone looking at it would be able to say, "Great Recruiter" but bad coach, or "Bad Recruiter and Bad Coach".

How a young HS player played, is worth a noting, but is NOT how he is going to play in the SEC, competition is a little bit different at this level.:hi:
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There is so much more that goes into it, a good salesman could convince some good players to go to his school( recruiting), but it takes a good football coach to develop those players to do what is needed for his system( player development), then he has to alter his sytem to accentuate his players talents to get the most out of his team (coaching). The last two is where Butch fell short, without those a program is doomed to failure with spurts of mediocrity.
 
#21
#21
SaintLouisVol said:
I’m not a huge proponent of the star system in evaluating high school talent. But, there’s enough information out there that I do think they’re in the ball park.
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Star ratings are more or less accurate at the class level. Not so much the individual level.

There are all sorts of 5-star recruits who will bust. However, if a school consistently recruits guys rated 4 or 5-stars, that is at least going to be a pretty good program. Some will bust; they aren't all going to bust.
 
#22
#22
There are all sorts of 5-star recruits who will bust.
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Remember Lane Kiffin's #1 class. That is a great example of this. They were all either arrested or kicked off the team within a year. Am I even allowed to say the name Bryce Brown here?
 
#23
#23
Hawkeye4588 said:
Remember Lane Kiffin's #1 class. That is a great example of this. They were all either arrested or kicked off the team within a year. Am I even allowed to say the name Bryce Brown here?
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Wasn’t aware LK had a #1 class but I think we can all agree....THERE ARE SO MANY DIFFERENT VARIABLES ITS IMPOSSIBLE TO KNOW ABOUT A RECRUIT OR COACH....just work the process and wait till it’s over and see where you land...:eek:k::eek:k::eek:k:
 
#24
#24
Hawkeye4588 said:
Not to go down a rabbit hole but Last year I was getting gas in Lenoir City and this guy pulls up to the pump next to me. I look in his car and he has what seems to be hundreds of cell phones draped around the passenger seat. I asked him if he worked for Verizon or something and he said he was a recruiter for UT.

What were all those phones for? Are they worried someone may not get through when they call?
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You ran into a street level pharmaceutical salesman. UT recruiter!! Ha!
 
#25
#25
During cbj's first 3 years as HC, who recruited the majority of the starters? I recall, the never ending BS from the Fan-boys, they started off with how great a recruiter cbj was, during those years, and ended up with either something about a dumpster fire, or how we were moving the right direction. In any case, when we disuss cbj's "Best" years as HC, we need to figure out who recruited those guys, maybe another coach should have the title of "Great recruiter", or every time jones is mentioned, his fan boys won't start singing "Great Recruiter!!!".
 
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