Homelessness Causes and Solutions

Is it more humane to force homeless people into mental health facilities?

  • Yes for those incapable of caring for themselves

    Votes: 10 71.4%
  • In favor of status quo: only use force if they’re a threat to themselves or others

    Votes: 4 28.6%
  • No, it’s never acceptable

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    14
People "not" in the upper middle class.

Right. Meaning “the middle class”. Because “the middle class” is not the “upper middle class”. So you’re falsely claiming middle class Americans do not have friends and family with secure housing. That’s obviously an absurd claim.

I have no idea the rates, but I'm sure homelessness only increases them. Providing housing would help control both mental illness and addiction.


The rates are easy to find. The vast majority of homeless people are homeless because they’re mentally ill or addicts.

They’re not addicts or mentally ill because they housing. Adding a home to the equation doesn’t fix the problem.
 
the problem with homelessness is that we've incentivized it and people are condemned for challenging peoples "autonomy" if they want to pee in the middles of the street, it's their body, they can do what they want. i believe many people can work, they don't want to.
 
the problem with homelessness is that we've incentivized it and people are condemned for challenging peoples "autonomy" if they want to pee in the middles of the street, it's their body, they can do what they want. i believe many people can work, they don't want to.

You've somehow managed a take that almost no one can fundamentally agree with. Impressive.
 
As far as buildings regs go, less govt would probably be more - that's a local issue not federal, but I dont think that will help housing prices in the current moment. Houses are selling well above materials and labor costs currently.

People have a right to healthcare and that's starts at the government level. Public funds to private companies would work fine as far as the execution goes, though.

People do not have a right to healthcare. To believe that they do you also must believe that people have the right to force others into uncompensated labor.
 
I am an architect, its not the local building codes that are the issue. the EPA, which has no knowledge about buildings, have inserted themselves multiple times recently, but they aren't the only fed to get involved.

-Obama's Clean Water Act, both reduced the amount of buildable land, by arbitrarily changing what counts as a water way. but also drastically increased the "protections" for water ways. some made sense and were needed, but most have just been tossed out there to say they changing something.
-the EPAs treatment to anything natural gas related, not just bans, but additional standards and components. again some make sense but then others don't.
-the change in the refrigerant used. they banned the old stuff, and the new one is considered flammable. yeah they are requiring flammable refrigerant. the industry reached out to them about how unsafe it was, and the EPA just straight up ignored us. it was better for homes to burn down than for there to be a .5 difference in GWP available. for about 2 years there was only 1 way to safely handle that new refrigerant. build a fire rated chase for each refrigerant line. hecking expensive and labor intensive, plus the added danger of working with a flammable liquid. thankfully the industry eventually figured out ways to handle the flammable liquid without a chase, but its essentially doubling the cost of each AC system. *also there is a good bit of corruption when it came to the selection of that flammable refrigerant but I will leave that to a different rant*
-most of the red tape increasing cost have been on the manufacturer side, while doing little to nothing to make a better end product.
-another energy saving one has been the requirement for a digital disconnect switch on building transformers over a certain size. disconnects aren't bad, in fact there is already a physical disconnect required for the same amperage. but the government thinks it will save energy to add a digital disconnect after the physical one. when just added a component, that can fail, requires maintenance, adds another point for the system to get hacked, and its completely pointless. the physical switch creates a literal physical break in the electrical connections so that electricity can't flow. this new digital switch is just a little chip telling the electricity if it can flow or not via some regulating piece that doesn't actually create a physical disconnect. it doesn't take an electrical engineering degree to figure out what is wrong there.

typically the building code changes that cost the most money are driven by the fed government. yeah an independent agency creates the building codes, but they are responding to requirements set by non-elected bureaucrats.

Trump and Co should have rescinded the new refrigerant rules on day one. The new units are outrageously expensive.
 
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Trump and Co should have rescinded the new refrigerant rules on day one. The new units are outrageously expensive.
willing to bet the reason he hasn't is similar or related to the corrupt way it got enacted.

someone got rich, that someone has donated to both sides in the past.
 
You've somehow managed a take that almost no one can fundamentally agree with. Impressive.

Homeless by choice is for sure a thing. One of my favorite people is a “traveler” (I just call him a bum). He panhandles, busks, sleeps in a tent near underpasses, drinks cheap wine outside of gas stations, and hops trains. When he’s home he works in a local restaurant and lives with his mother. But he likes the freedom of “traveling”
 
Homeless by choice is for sure a thing. One of my favorite people is a “traveler” (I just call him a bum). He panhandles, busks, sleeps in a tent near underpasses, drinks cheap wine outside of gas stations, and hops trains. When he’s home he works in a local restaurant and lives with his mother. But he likes the freedom of “traveling”

How is that in any way relevant to what I said or what I responded to?
 
His response was about people’s freedom to not work and live in the streets. I’m telling you there’s an entire culture of young people who do this.

But did society/the government incentivize that? Your friend's mom seems to have given him the latitude to contribute minimally to society, noting that he does still occasionally work to gain some money, but I'm not sure of any city incentivizing pure homelessness and shelters/whatever accommodations the most vagrant-friendly cities have aren't exactly The Peninsula.

People can be incentivized to avoid working (to a degree) through welfare programs and government benefits, but that's different than promoting living beneath the freeway.
 
But did society/the government incentivize that? Your friend's mom seems to have given him the latitude to contribute minimally to society, noting that he does still occasionally work to gain some money, but I'm not sure of any city incentivizing pure homelessness and shelters/whatever accommodations the most vagrant-friendly cities have aren't exactly The Peninsula.

People can be incentivized to avoid working (to a degree) through welfare programs and government benefits, but that's different than promoting living beneath the freeway.

Allowed in ways is a better term than incentivized. There are incentives he takes advantage of like shelters and soup kitchens but more so I would say there’s an issue with allowing “urban camping” and panhandling.
 
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I literally just shared a study stating 67% of people “unhoused” people have mental illness or drug addiction.
That doesn't fall under the category of people being unshackled tumbleweeds like Dalton was describing, and what I responded to, and what you inserted yourself into.
 
That doesn't fall under the category of people being unshackled tumbleweeds like Dalton was describing, and what I responded to, and what you inserted yourself into.

Right. You stated

If you think it makes up even a mentionable chunk of the homeless population

And I pointed that I’m clearly stating the vast majority of homeless are drug addicts. But the idea of people who just don’t want to work are for sure an element. I can’t say how much, but it’s a thing
 
Right. You stated



And I pointed that I’m clearly stating the vast majority of homeless are drug addicts. But the idea of people who just don’t want to work are for sure an element. I can’t say how much, but it’s a thing

How do you know that is their prime driving factor? Freedom? Traveling? Lack of materialism?

I could easily assume that much, as easily as you assume a lack of desire to make money.
 
How do you know that is their prime driving factor? Freedom? Traveling? Lack of materialism?

I could easily assume that much, as easily as you assume a lack of desire to make money.

I already told you idk what specific percent that makes up. And no one is proclaiming they’re only driven by one specific factor. Likely all of the above.

You’re getting your blood pressure up for no apparent reason here. But you do you!
 
I already told you idk what specific percent that makes up. And no one is proclaiming they’re only driven by one specific factor. Likely all of the above.

You’re getting your blood pressure up for no apparent reason here. But you do you!

No blood pressure spike here. I know you love to argue, so questioning why you are arguing can likely get your goat.

Just seems like you were looking for an excuse to repeat the same point you keep wanting to make ITT.

I'll save you the trouble. We get it.
 
No blood pressure spike here. I know you love to argue, so questioning why you are arguing can likely get your goat.

Just seems like you were looking for an excuse to repeat the same point you keep wanting to make ITT.

I'll save you the trouble. We get it.

Weird to complain that I just like to argue given your constant argumentative tone with me.
 

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