History tells us to stick with Fulmer.

#126
#126
dimera23 said:
IF (and that's a big if) it were true that Coach Fulmer has "lost" the team, the that would justify his removal in my opinion. If I were Mike Hamilton in that situation, I would offer him the opportunity to retire before firing him though.

Coach Fulmer's strength as a head coach is his ability to recruit great student athletes, earn their trust and initiate them into the UT Football way of life.

I haven't heard anything to indicate (other than this post) that Coach Fulmer has "lost" the team.
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Have you been listening? Do you have connections with anyone that would know?

I have heard that there is a rift between upperclassmen and underclassmen over playing time being depicted on seniority.

It was obvious to me he lost his team last week when his team quit halfway through the 3rd quarter.
 
#129
#129
cd12 said:
Nice post 24....I will add that even St David's offense had trouble adjusting. We were terrible in the 2nd half of most games.
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100% correct on David...and I'm not that big a fan of Cut either. However he is a much better X's and O's guy that Phil. David without a doubt cost us some games with his get a lead and sit on it routine...but then again that's what this program has become...playing not to lose.

Far cry from when Fulmer took over and let the flood gates open...truly one of the most exciting times ever to have been a Vol fan. And it wasn't just Shuler or Manning...those teams were fun because they wanted to outscore you in every way they possibly could.

I don't feel bad for Phil...he's got to live his dream. He's been paid very well in the process. Most of us will never get that chance. But he's not more important that TN football as a whole...dimera seems to have forgotten that.
 
#131
#131
dimera23 said:
You act like winning the SEC is easy.
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Hamilton is on record as saying his expectations at Tennessee are to win at least two SEC championships during a 10-year period and get to the SEC title game every three or four years, as well as play in BCS bowls with some regularity.

How does his job performance over the past 10 years stack up against the expectations of his job as stated in the above paragraph?
 
#132
#132
Vercingetorix said:
The flaw with this argument is that it assumes that all other things outside the program have remained the same. They haven't. That's why you can draw such a clean line of demarcation between the two halves of Fulmer's career. It's not a coincidence that the "down" part of our ups and downs began at the same time that Georgia, Auburn, LSU, etc., dramatically upgraded their programs.

SEC football is pretty close to a zero-sum game. If other programs are getting better, it has to be at somebody else's expense. Fulmer has been unable to prevent it from being at ours.
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Excellent points...and I might further add in response to replacing parts and fixing whats broken...sometimes you gotta replace the whole thing as well.

That's where we are...the car can't be fixed, it's done. The motors gone, the transmission is gone...everything has already been fixed and refixed but now it's just time to get a new car. It's either that or be towed around the next few years.
 
#133
#133
dimera23 said:
There is no denying that Coach Fulmer's first nine years at UT were better than his last seven. I personally don't think a 63-27 record with four #1 finishes in the SEC East and three bowl wins is all that bad, but they're definately worse than his 84-17 record with a National Title, two SEC titles and five bowl wins.

However, this is no time to panic and, in my opinion, no time for a coaching change. Set emotion aside and look at numbers. They don't lie. Coach Fulmer's career is following trends established by some of the greatest coaches in College Football history.

For example:

From 1998-2004, Joe Paterno was 40-39 with no conference titles and two bowl wins. In 2005, he roared back to an 11-1 record and a Big 10 Championship. Since, then he's 29-9 and possibly playing for a national title this year.

From 1979-1985, Bo Schembechler was 60-23 with one Big 10 Title. He went on to lead the Wolverines to a 38-10 record with three Conference Titles over the last four years of his career at Michigan.

After winning four national titles, the great Bear Bryant posted a 28-20 record with three straight bowl losses from 1967-1970. He went on to win three more national titles and nine SEC titles from 1971-1982.

We're going through a little bit of a rough patch right now, but we've got the right staff in place to see us through it. If we're not careful, we'll learn a lesson Michigan is learning now the hard way. Stability is very important in college football.
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Way too reasonable for most of this crowd. I see your point, and I'm very torn on what I think we should do. This is not as simple as some want to beleive. Whatever happens, I just want the Vols to win.
 
#134
#134
dimera23 said:
IF (and that's a big if) it were true that Coach Fulmer has "lost" the team, the that would justify his removal in my opinion. If I were Mike Hamilton in that situation, I would offer him the opportunity to retire before firing him though.

Coach Fulmer's strength as a head coach is his ability to recruit great student athletes, earn their trust and initiate them into the UT Football way of life.

I haven't heard anything to indicate (other than this post) that Coach Fulmer has "lost" the team.
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I don't care if Fulmer and the team have the strongest mutual admiration in college football, it's the performance on the field that counts in my book. I don't care whether he has lost the team or not. It has become obvious that he sure the heck can't get anything done with them when facing top-tier competition.
 
#135
#135
triton1 said:
Way too reasonable for most of this crowd. I see your point, and I'm very torn on what I think we should do. This is not as simple as some want to beleive. Whatever happens, I just want the Vols to win.
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How is it difficult or complicated?

If we need pointers, about 5 decent programs per year go through this process.
 
#137
#137
Business said:
That and act as if a SEC East Title is anywhere near the same level as a SEC title. Even though a SEC East title is an invention of a marketing brain.
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Yeah i don't remember hearing "SEC East title" until the 3 way tie in 2003.
 
#138
#138
g8terh8ter_eric said:
BAAAAAAADD Sheep....

sheep.jpg
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:lolabove::lolabove::eek:lol:
 
#139
#139
cd12 said:
Where to start or should I start?

Lets tackle the OC debate first. CPF has had 3 chances to get it right! 1. Cut leaves automatically gives it to Randy. 2. Randy failed him.... automatically bring back Cut knowing he wanted an HC spot and had no one waiting in the wings. 3. National search and the 2 top guys Clawson and the guy who got canned at Clemson.

Lets move on to the record....well thats been beat to death! All that I will add is that before the season even starts you have 7/8 should wins and the rest are toss ups. CPF is dropping a few should wins and getting hammered in the toss up category!
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The points you make about the OC are why a lot of people are scepticle of a coaching change. We would PROBABLY go through similar situations with a new head coach. I also fear that whoever they get would only please a portion of the fans and desention would still exist. After all, we haven't been very patient with Clawson, and most knew before the season started that we were in transition.
 
#140
#140
VolDad said:
We are on a 9 year drought, going on 10, of 0 Championships, 0 BCS bowls, .678 winning percentage (much worse against our biggest rivals).

Who are all of the "big time college football programs" who have gone through that under a single coach?
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Four 10 win seasons in the last 7, that's not as bad as some make it out to be.
 
#143
#143
While I still think that CPF's time is over and at this point it's pretty much a given a change will be made I've made a remarkable discovery about myself. I honestly didn't expect to feel sorry for him. I mean on the outer surface this guy makes more in a year than I'll make in a lifetime of labor at my pay grade and I think thats crap, I'm that human. On the other hand I find it sad the guy is a victim of his own personality and his shortcomings, I relate. I didn't see it coming that I'd feel bad for him once what I'd been hollering for has for all intent and purpose is about to happen. I guess I expected him to leave cussin and pointin fingers not in a meek manner.
 
#144
#144
BigPapaVol said:
How is it difficult or complicated?

If we need pointers, about 5 decent programs per year go through this process.
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And 99% of the time, they get worse instead of better, then 3 or 4 coaches later, they finally get better. Most here think we can Phil, hire whomever we choose and start dominating everyone on the schedule. That's likely not the way it will go.
 
#145
#145
GoodoleRockyTop3 said:
Don't ever get rid of a legend until you can get a superstud coach or we will end up like Alabama pre-Saban!!

Another video of my son to get it started!!

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Z2GrvyNCbnU&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Z2GrvyNCbnU&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
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What legend are you referring to?
 
#146
#146
triton1 said:
And 99% of the time, they get worse instead of better, then 3 or 4 coaches later, they finally get better. Most here think we can Phil, hire whomever we choose and start dominating everyone on the schedule. That's likely not the way it will go.
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I'm thinking 99% might be just a tad off.
 
#147
#147
VolDad said:
Sorry, I did not read where his bosses expectations were reduced from what I posted to Four 10 win season in 10 years.
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Your reading skills are lacking, we've had 4-10 win seasons in 7. Anytime you win 10 or more games in a season, it's hard to call it a failure.
 
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#148
#148
dan4vols said:
While I still think that CPF's time is over and at this point it's pretty much a given a change will be made I've made a remarkable discovery about myself. I honestly didn't expect to feel sorry for him. I mean on the outer surface this guy makes more in a year than I'll make in a lifetime of labor at my pay grade and I think thats crap, I'm that human. On the other hand I find it sad the guy is a victim of his own personality and his shortcomings, I relate. I didn't see it coming that I'd feel bad for him once what I'd been hollering for has for all intent and purpose is about to happen. I guess I expected him to leave cussin and pointin fingers not in a meek manner.
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Don't get all salty eyed about it yet. Afterall phil is still coaching us right now.
 
#149
#149
triton1 said:
Your readig skills are lacking, we've had 4-10 win seasons in 7. Anytime you win 10 or more games in a season, it's hard to call it a failure.
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It's not hard to call it a failure when 6-8 of the games are against patsies and every big game saw your ass handed to you.
 
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