Highschool Player Development

#51
#51
Volunteeer said:
just go to one of the recruiting services and compare how many athletes Florida has that run sub 4.5 40s and look at tennessee.
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Umm, Florida has 3 times as many people. Statistically they should have 3 times as many sub 4.5ers
 
#52
#52
dshad said:
The top ten states listed here are extremely close to the top ten states in total population. With a few exceptions, the entire list fairly well matches up. But it is pretty apparent that it is a numbers game based on population.
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Mississippi, S Carolina, Alabama, and Louisiana have smaller population than Tennessee and they all have as many or more BCS schollies.
 
#53
#53
matrosscbc said:
The answer is much simpler. In the days of Johnny Majors most of the talent was going to 10 schools. Now with the rise of so many other programs and scholarship reductions there is much more parody in college football. The reason TN, as a state, lags behind in D1 talent is simply because of the amount of African Americans in our state. East Tn is probably the whitest part of the entire world. The states that produce the most talent also have a much broader pool of athletes to pull from....its a simple as that.:hi:
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okay, so screw knoxville then, lets just push UT over here to west tn. there's plenty of afro-americans over here, especially in the jackson and memphis areas. i played with marsalis teague at henry co., and i can tell you from first hand experience that those memphis boys have serious speed, and if the quality of coaching picked up in the jackson area, it wouldn't be far behind at all. Jk about the whole screw Knoxville thing lol.
 
#54
#54
In HS, sometimes the best and most talented fastest kids are out skate boarding, working jobs, surfing, or playing beach volleyball. It's the hard work of dedicated professional coaches at the high school level that identifies the talent and finds a way to get those kids on the footbal field who should be there but are off doing something else. There's way to many hs coaches, not just in Tennessee but everywhere, that are there to draw their coaching allowance first and foremost. Posting a notice online or on the gym wall that hs team signups start on day x, and just dealing with whatever shows up is to often the norm. Hs coaches out there identifying kids who can really play and finding a way to get them to play overcoming the obstacles all kids have tend to do well and produce better players for the next level. It's sad but on more than one occasion I've heard it said the best player for X high school is working Friday nights at McKeyDs and the coach for that area grumbles about no talent, private schools recrutiing, and nobody shows up to play.
 
#55
#55
Okay, i hate to fuel the fire, but why is there a thread on this topic once a freakin week?
 
#58
#58
KYSkipper said:
I can see burning them out being a problem and I can also see them learning bad habits.

That said, them sitting inside playing video games is just as bad.

One thing Johnny Majors did a lot of was recruit track athletes and teach them to catch a football or run down a receiver and tackle him.

Maybe if we aren't promoting football itself, it should be track or something like that.

The point is, Tennessee is lacking recruits in state. There's got to be things other states are doing that Tennessee isn't. Tennessee is a larger state population wise than Alabama and Mississippi put together yet both have more athletes available.

I'm not buying into the race theory. There's an even enough mix throughout Tennessee and good players come in all colors.
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Look in the NFL, what is the black/white ratio? I would say 75-80% black easy. How about the NBA? The total population of the US would show a ratio that is the exact opposite of that. More like 75-80% white. The numbers don't lie. African Americans are (generally speaking) better athletes. Also you can compare the demographics of these states with the number of NFL players produced. Example. Mississippi produces more NFL players than just about anyone per capita. They also have (just about) the highest minority population per capita in the US. They also have a very low population.
 
#59
#59
jed said:
Look in the NFL, what is the black/white ratio? I would say 75-80% black easy. How about the NBA? The total population of the US would show a ratio that is the exact opposite of that. More like 75-80% white. The numbers don't lie. African Americans are (generally speaking) better athletes. Also you can compare the demographics of these states with the number of NFL players produced. Example. Mississippi produces more NFL players than just about anyone per capita. They also have (just about) the highest minority population per capita in the US. They also have a very low population.
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exactly, and you'll notice that the vast majority of D-1 prospects come from one of two places, either the high profile schools with top level coaching and development, i.e. MBA, Brentwood Academy, etc. Or the other, the overwhelming favorite, memphis. which is approx. 77% afro-american.
 
#60
#60
nbakerld said:
I posted this before, but Tennessee has 1.05 million blacks. Alabama has 1.1 million blacks. The state of Tennessee has produced 16 4-star players in 3 years. Alabama has produced 38. I don't think it's about physical talent, I think it's about the HS sports scene.
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According to the 2000 census TN had 932,809, Al had 1,155,930, Florida had 2,335,505, MS had 1,033,809, and GA had 2,349,542.
 
#61
#61
I'm not trying to say that TN is where it needs to be with its feeder programs and HS football programs. I can assure you it is atrocious. Heck, half of these kids are being coached by people who have no idea what there talking about. I would like to see what Maryville's feeder programs and HS coaches/facilities could do with Memphis talent.
 
#62
#62
jed said:
I'm not trying to say that TN is where it needs to be with its feeder programs and HS football programs. I can assure you it is atrocious. Heck, half of these kids are being coached by people who have no idea what there talking about. I would like to see what Maryville's feeder programs and HS coaches/facilities could do with Memphis talent.
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My answer would be top 5 in the nation.
 
#63
#63
That's very true! I'm a West Tennessean , and the programs we have here could be very good, IF, they wouldn't always hire the good ole boys that have played at the HS or live within the county. I think a lot of schools are afraid to go out and hire a good coaching staff. There really isn't a football powerhouse in west tennessee. We have great athletes, and I think if the schools around here wanted to become a place that would produce SEC talent, they could. We need to take a page out of the state of Texas's book, and make our sports programs more important to the kids, and the community.
 
#64
#64
jed said:
I'm not trying to say that TN is where it needs to be with its feeder programs and HS football programs. I can assure you it is atrocious. Heck, half of these kids are being coached by people who have no idea what there talking about. I would like to see what Maryville's feeder programs and HS coaches/facilities could do with Memphis talent.
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Big difference in the mindset of the average kid in Maryville and the average kid in Memphis. BIG difference.
 
#65
#65
jed said:
My answer would be top 5 in the nation.
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would probably be a carbon copy of what you see at Duncan Byrnes, SC and North Miami, FL. I'm telling you, if memphis would get some better coaching and player development programs for its public schools, memphis would play second fiddle to noone in the south as far as producing talent. I've played against them, and one things for sure, they're fast, every one of the memphis schools is tremendously fast. unfortunately, thats about where it ends. and it will stay that way unless something changes. But still, it also wouldn't hurt if UT could simply learn how to recruit in memphis regardless. There's no telling how many memphians have slipped through the cracks. and it's not just to ole miss like everyone thinks it is simply because of the closer proximity, it's the florida's, the georgia's, the georgia tech's, and the bama's. Ut's gotta get ahold of that region somehow, nobody else seems to have trouble doing it.
 
#66
#66
orangepridenation said:
would probably be a carbon copy of what you see at Duncan Byrnes, SC and North Miami, FL. I'm telling you, if memphis would get some better coaching and player development programs for its public schools, memphis would play second fiddle to noone in the south as far as producing talent. I've played against them, and one things for sure, they're fast, every one of the memphis schools is tremendously fast. unfortunately, thats about where it ends. and it will stay that way unless something changes. But still, it also wouldn't hurt if UT could simply learn how to recruit in memphis regardless. There's no telling how many memphians have slipped through the cracks. and it's not just to ole miss like everyone thinks it is simply because of the closer proximity, it's the florida's, the georgia's, the georgia tech's, and the bama's. Ut's gotta get ahold of that region somehow, nobody else seems to have trouble doing it.
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Graig Cooper
 
#68
#68
926 said:
Big difference in the mindset of the average kid in Maryville and the average kid in Memphis. BIG difference.
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that really doesn't have anything to do with it though. the only two football differences between the football players in memphis and the football players in maryville is the level of coaching and skin color(for the most part). Oh yeah, and a third difference, and no offense to the folks of maryville, but raw talent.
 
#69
#69
I just looked at the recruiting page. Tennessee only has one commitment from the state of Tennessee. That is just friggin ridiculous! There is no way that someone can convince me that there is only one kid in the entire state that wants to and is capable of playing for UT! I don't want to get racial, but it's sad that the coaches at the elite college level are so locked in to the belief that only a black kid can play football or basketball. They give the black kids the scholarships, then have the audacity to ask the white kids to come to the school and walk on. They routinely burn scholarships on high-risk kids who struggle in class and are known thugs, but had rather have their back hair waxed than offer a scholarship to a kid that's a good student and fantastic athlete who runs a tenth of a second slower in the 40 than the thugs.

They feel like the thug is an acceptable risk, but the kid that's a half-step slower is not. Never mind that he might just possibly make up for the marginal difference in talent by using his head and his heart. Just look at the basketball program. Skylar McBee was not recruited by UT but he is already a significant contributor as a walk-on freshman.
 
#70
#70
^^ And before somebody freaks out, I am not saying that every black kid is a thug. I am just saying that college coaches at elite programs have no problem "taking a chance" on a kid with suspect decision making skills, but hate "taking a chance" on a kid that has done nothing but excel in sports and school, but doesn't check the correct box on the application, so to speak.
 
#71
#71
Gp_rocky top said:
That's very true! I'm a West Tennessean , and the programs we have here could be very good, IF, they wouldn't always hire the good ole boys that have played at the HS or live within the county. I think a lot of schools are afraid to go out and hire a good coaching staff. There really isn't a football powerhouse in west tennessee. We have great athletes, and I think if the schools around here wanted to become a place that would produce SEC talent, they could. We need to take a page out of the state of Texas's book, and make our sports programs more important to the kids, and the community.
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Yep, you're right on the money with west tennessee. there are schools that consistently field good teams and some phenominal atheletes, i.e. melrose, liberty tech, milan, henry county, memphis mitchell, among others. but the only one of those schools that i've seen go out and make a hire to improve the development and overrall coaching of the players was my former team henry county, when they went out and got joe gaddis who had no ties to the school, but had coached a team to a state championship and was well respected around the state, and what were the results? well, two former henry countians who played under gaddis are playing in the SEC this year. And had another a few years back (calvin mcnairl) turn down an offer from georgia to play closer to home at TSU. Just raise the coaching level and you'll see player development and the number of prospects skyrocket on this side of the state. ESPECIALLY IN MEMPHIS.
 
#72
#72
jed said:
Look in the NFL, what is the black/white ratio? I would say 75-80% black easy. How about the NBA? The total population of the US would show a ratio that is the exact opposite of that. More like 75-80% white. The numbers don't lie. African Americans are (generally speaking) better athletes.
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I'm not denying that on average black athletes are faster and can jump higher than white athletes, that said, football isn't basketball. When our highschool beat Austin East we had 3 black guys on the team and Austin East may have had 3 white guys. Austin East has how many students? We had around 900 K through 12 or around 160 in the entire highschool. Off that team we had 2 guys that played for Kentucky, when is the last time Austin East had a player on Tennessee's team?

jed said:
According to the 2000 census TN had 932,809, Al had 1,155,930, Florida had 2,335,505, MS had 1,033,809, and GA had 2,349,542.
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So there are 20% less black guys in Tennessee than Alabama and we have 200% less division 1 prospects.

Turning this into a racial thing is IMO pretty useless and off base.
 
#73
#73
Ya know, it's really disheartening, to see that the school who put the first black QB in the SEC on the field as a starter, Condredge Holloway (one of my all time heroes), to continuously read some of our Volunteer fans unable to view players without the constant prism of race. This discussion simply does not happen in other places and parts of the country. Players are human beings, with two arms and two legs and their racial heritage has not squat to do with their ability on the field. If you, your child, or beloved family member had their lives depending on receiving blood or an organ donation from someone of another race, you'd be able to determine rather quickly how utterly small race is in the human condition.
 
#74
#74
Remy said:
Ya know, it's really disheartening, to see that the school who put the first black QB in the SEC on the field as a starter, Condredge Holloway (one of my all time heroes), to continuously read some of our Volunteer fans unable to view players without the constant prism of race. This discussion simply does not happen in other places and parts of the country. Players are human beings, with two arms and two legs and their racial heritage has not squat to do with their ability on the field. If you, your child, or beloved family member had their lives depending on receiving blood or an organ donation from someone of another race, you'd be able to determine rather quickly how utterly small race is in the human condition.
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My friend, you are living in denial about a lot of stuff. To imply that discussions about race don't exist outside of the South is ludicrous. The descendants of Blacks who migrated to the Western World hundreds of years ago (for whatever reason) are, as a group, SIGNIFICANTLY more athletic than their distant relatives from their native continent...as well as their White counterparts, as a group.

Now, we all know that there are exceptions in both directions for all races. But the facts and the truth are never offensive, when viewed objectively and from an emotionless perspective.

Here's an example. We have no issue with admitting or acknowledging that one breed of dog is different from another. A Border Collie is athletic and smart, but you never see them in a dog race. It's always a Greyhound or a Whippet. The Greyhound and Whippet are just faster breeds of dog. Now, the will the world's fastest Border Collie beat the world's slowest Greyhound in a race. Of course. But, as a breed of dog, the Greyhound is faster. Both breeds are unmistakably dogs. They share the same basic traits and have essentially the same internal anatomical and physiological structures. Is it bigoted or racist to openly admit that the Greyhound has inherent traits and the Border Collie has inherent traits that make them both specialized?

Nothing makes sphincters tighten quicker than honest talks about the differences in races.
 
#75
#75
926 said:
My friend, you are living in denial about a lot of stuff. To imply that discussions about race don't exist outside of the South is ludicrous. The descendants of Blacks who migrated to the Western World hundreds of years ago (for whatever reason) are, as a group, SIGNIFICANTLY more athletic than their distant relatives from their native continent...as well as their White counterparts, as a group.

Now, we all know that there are exceptions in both directions for all races. But the facts and the truth are never offensive, when viewed objectively and from an emotionless perspective.

Here's an example. We have no issue with admitting or acknowledging that one breed of dog is different from another. A Border Collie is athletic and smart, but you never see them in a dog race. It's always a Greyhound or a Whippet. The Greyhound and Whippet are just faster breeds of dog. Now, the will the world's fastest Border Collie beat the world's slowest Greyhound in a race. Of course. But, as a breed of dog, the Greyhound is faster. Both breeds are unmistakably dogs. They share the same basic traits and have essentially the same internal anatomical and physiological structures. Is it bigoted or racist to openly admit that the Greyhound has inherent traits and the Border Collie has inherent traits that make them both specialized?

Nothing makes sphincters tighten quicker than honest talks about the differences in races.
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+1,000,000,000,000,000
That was a very professional, and neutral post.:clapping:
 
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