Gun control debate (merged)


A biased article that tries to downplay the legal realities it actually cites. For instance.

"Before Heller, most courts considered 2nd Amendment protections to be limited to the possession of firearms in connection with the need for militia service."

This is not only false on it's face but directly controverted in Heller citing that nevermind individual court cases several state constitutions went so far as to particularly make the outright distinction. From Heller:

That of the nine state constitutional protections for the right to bear arms enacted immediately after 1789 at least seven unequivocally protected an individual citizen’s right to self-defense is strong evidence that that is how the founding generation conceived of the right. And with one possible exception that we discuss in Part II–D–2, 19th-century courts and commentators interpreted these state constitutional provisions to protect an individual right to use arms for self-defense.

Then there is the simultaneous acknowledgement and attempt to diminish the importance of "in common use at the time". The AR platform in particular is not just "common" but full on ubiquitous at this point. So much so that those people that aren't selling an agenda commonly just refer to them as "modern sporting rifles" because they, quite literally, are nothing more than modernized versions of the same theme. And by "modern" I mean been on sale for civilian use since 1963.

The only thing of any worth in that article to me was acknowledging this looming gap between what has already happened in some states that SCOTUS has not yet addressed. I see no way that stays the case for much longer. An outright federal level "ban", as in outright making illegal to possess, seems unlikely to the point there may be some states outright reject enforcement of the decision. Exactly what could be argued short of that could be more legally interesting.
 
So no different than a suppressor, bump stuck, etc. There are required parts and there are options but they all rely on a firearm to be useable

Completely different. There are valid uses for a suppressor as there are for high capacity (whatever that means) magazines. Just tools.

Now that being said the "need" argument is complete bullcrap. I need what I want and can afford.
 
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My post was obviously in jest. I recognize there will always be privately held guns (I won't be one of those), but we can do a lot to tighten ownership requirements and the types of guns we're putting out there.
Based on your posting history, it was not obvious.
 
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So no different than a suppressor, bump stuck, etc. There are required parts and there are options but they all rely on a firearm to be useable
A suppressor is explicitly listed as a title 2 item so no not exactly the same. Not at the moment anyway.
 
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So no different than a suppressor, bump stuck, etc. There are required parts and there are options but they all rely on a firearm to be useable

but the firearm does not require add ons for its operation .
 
With regard to the hubbub behind bumpstocks, this has been posted before on just how easy it is to get around the EO. The EO is evil no doubt, however a bump stock isn’t a magic enabler that a simple rubber band couldn’t also provide.

 
Again, which capacity mag is required? Is my 30 too much? Do I require 100?

Can all add-ons be banned without ever violating the spirit of the 2nd?

Did you have to ask somebody before you bought it ? I don’t know what your personal requirements are I suspect they are different than mine . The simple answer to can add ons be banned is yes but then you aren’t talking about 2a anymore , that’s property rights . They have no protection under the 2a ( in my opinion ) . a scope , bumpstock , 100 round mag. , or laser sights are not protected any more than the 6 inch lift , over sized tires or brush guard on your 4x4 is .
 
Well except that qualification has been thrown around quite often in this thread. I'm simply responding in kind
If I’m reading you right you sound like youre against the bumpstock ban as you believe it is 2a infringement. I agree with hogg it isn’t 2a but it definitely is property seizure and still chickenshit.

Or... you’re just arguing to argue 🤷‍♂️
 
If I’m reading you right you sound like youre against the bumpstock ban as you believe it is 2a infringement. I agree with hogg it isn’t 2a but it definitely is property seizure and still chickenshit.

Or... you’re just arguing to argue 🤷‍♂️
Yes I attribute the ban to a direct assault in gun rights by the potus. He had never been a 2nd fan that I can find
 
Yes I attribute the ban to a direct assault in gun rights by the potus. He had never been a 2nd fan that I can find
I don’t disagree with you that he’s necessarily a 2a supporter. He is a New Yorker after all. While I think the topic definitely fuels gun rights restrictions I don’t believe bumpstocks are explicitly protected by 2a though. But it’s still a 🐓💩 EO
 
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Again, which capacity mag is required? Is my 30 too much? Do I require 100?

Can all add-ons be banned without ever violating the spirit of the 2nd?

What are you doing with it? Guns are nothing but tools so what tool you use depends on what you are planning to do.
 
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I don’t have nor have I ever owned a bump stock , to me ( my opinion only ) they are garbage and an after market add on to my firearm . They in no part are covered under the 2a ( my opinion ) as they don’t stop me from my right to bear arms . What else you got ?

As a 2A advocate, I have to say this is a bad mentality to have. We gun owners need to circle the wagons and resist any new gun-related restrictions, including those applied to gun accessories.
 
As a 2A advocate, I have to say this is a bad mentality to have. We gun owners need to circle the wagons and resist any new gun-related restrictions, including those applied to gun accessories.
We can circle the wagons but there are going to be a whole lot more Indians now.
 
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