Gun control debate (merged)

[hog88]

Just watched a couple of his YouTube videos. Not only is he an idiot for walking through an airport with a loaded AR, he's being a straight up douchebag when cops take an interest in him.

I'm sure his daughter was proud.

 

[hog88]

Yep. I'm totally fine with cops checking out someone with a gun out in public. They are not out of line for doing that. The police in this situation handled themselves very professionally.

They did and I give them props.

 

[Grand Vol]

I'm sure his daughter was proud.

You could tell from one of his videos she was real uncomfortable with the situation.

 

[hndog609]

I have to wonder how many pro-2A people have come up to him and dropped a cordial "Look man, I'm all about your RIGHT to do this but c'mon dude...there's just no upside to this kind of publicity."?

 

[DEFENDTHISHOUSE]

Just watched a couple of his YouTube videos. Not only is he an idiot for walking through an airport with a loaded AR, he's being a straight up douchebag when cops take an interest in him.

The beta mag was just a touch much IMO.

 

[Grand Vol]

The beta mag was just a touch much IMO.

Never saw the need for more than 30 myself. Never needed more

 

[DEFENDTHISHOUSE]

Never saw the need for more than 30 myself. Never needed more

I got a good bit of the old colt 20 round mags. I like them pretty well. Of course I have a ton of pmags, probably the best ones out there, if I had to choose.

About the chap with the rifle, I have 0 problem with what he did. I don't open carry myself, but, I see nothing wrong with people doing so, if they so choose. Besides, shouldn't it be up to the airport to decide, it's their property. Or, did they give up that right to the Feds?

I don't like it when people say "I believe in freedom, but...." It's just silly, and quite hypocritical.

 

[Grand Vol]

I got a good bit of the old colt 20 round mags. I like them pretty well. Of course I have a ton of pmags, probably the best ones out there, if I had to choose.

About the chap with the rifle, I have 0 problem with what he did. I don't open carry myself, but, I see nothing wrong with people doing so, if they so choose. Besides, shouldn't it be up to the airport to decide, it's their property. Or, did they give up that right to the Feds?

I don't like it when people say "I believe in freedom, but...." It's just silly, and quite hypocritical.

I do have a problem with what he did. Not from a "can he do this" but rather from a "should he do this" standpoint. It does nothing to further the 2A cause and probably does more to damage it than anything. If you have to exercise your rights by causing a scene and drawing major attention to yourself not only from the police (which were very professional BTW) but from probably a lot of people in the airport, you're doing something wrong.

You know me and how I feel about the Second Amendment. But there are times when you must ask yourself if you're going to cause more harm than good by proving to the world what an ass you can be.

ETA: So yes, there is a "but" in the conversation and a very valid one at that. There is a time and a place for everything. That's not hypocritical, but rather reality.

 

[DEFENDTHISHOUSE]

I do have a problem with what he did. Not from a "can he do this" but rather from a "should he do this" standpoint. It does nothing to further the 2A cause and probably does more to damage it than anything. If you have to exercise your rights by causing a scene and drawing major attention to yourself not only from the police (which were very professional BTW) but from probably a lot of people in the airport, you're doing something wrong.

You know me and how I feel about the Second Amendment. But there are times when you must ask yourself if you're going to cause more harm than good by proving to the world what an ass you can be.

I'd rather have the public seeing firearms out in public in the hands of ordinary people more. Every time we see a guy with a gun on tv, it almost always has a negative connotation. People are basically being brainwashed into thinking only the so called "authorities" should have guns. Maybe if they're seen more, the less dangerous they'll seem to the public.

Notice people are totally fine with the cop who had the sbr AR.

It's still hypocritical lol

 

[Carl Pickens]

Yep, me too. While I support his right to do it, it's still dumb.

Just like flipping off a cop

 

[Carl Pickens]

I'd rather have the public seeing firearms out in public in the hands of ordinary people more. Every time we see a guy with a gun on tv, it almost always has a negative connotation. People are basically being brainwashed into thinking only the so called "authorities" should have guns. Maybe if they're seen more, the less dangerous they'll seem to the public.

Notice people are totally fine with the cop who had the sbr AR.

It's still hypocritical lol

I agree with this....... Totally. I'd like to see a statistical breakdown of gun related crimes commited by legal permit holders versus non permitted.

 

[Grand Vol]

I'd rather have the public seeing firearms out in public in the hands of ordinary people more. Every time we see a guy with a gun on tv, it almost always has a negative connotation. People are basically being brainwashed into thinking only the so called "authorities" should have guns. Maybe if they're seen more, the less dangerous they'll seem to the public.

Notice people are totally fine with the cop who had the sbr AR.

It's still hypocritical lol

We'll just have to disagree (imagine that lol) and I'll say there is a time and a place for such things. And an airport is way, way, way down that list IMO. That's not hypocritical as I support his right to do so. But as I said before, should he do so in such an area.

 

[DEFENDTHISHOUSE]

We'll just have to disagree (imagine that lol) and I'll say there is a time and a place for such things. And an airport is way, way, way down that list IMO. That's not hypocritical as I support his right to do so. But as I said before, should he do so in such an area.

So you support his right to do so, if he does it in a place you find acceptable. Hmm

 

[Grand Vol]

So you support his right to do so, if he does it in a place you find acceptable. Hmm

You know, we can have a reasonable conversation about this if you wouldn't ignore the question I posed. Which you are and also are being a dick about it. Let me guess, next you're going to call me a statist and say I was brainwashed as a cop.

Let's toss this hypothetical at you. Say you're sitting in your favorite Chipotle when Snow Boots McGee and Neckbeard Johnson come walking in with their rifles slung to the front. This would not cause you some alarm or do you automatically jump to pride and say "man, I'm glad they are exercising their Rights!" Or you're sitting in an airport, knowing full well what's going on in the world and see some idiot walk in with an AR loaded out and think "boy, I'm glad he's around! I feel much safer now!"

If you answered that you felt safer seeing total strangers (other than the cops you don't trust) bearing long guns in public places instead of being slightly alarmed as to their motives, I question your ability to distinguish potential threats.

Perhaps some time to reflect on the question of "should" versus "can" might do you some good.

 

[DEFENDTHISHOUSE]

You know, we can have a reasonable conversation about this if you wouldn't ignore the question I posed. Which you are and also are being a dick about it. Let me guess, next you're going to call me a statist and say I was brainwashed as a cop.

Let's toss this hypothetical at you. Say you're sitting in your favorite Chipotle when Snow Boots McGee and Neckbeard Johnson come walking in with their rifles slung to the front. This would not cause you some alarm or do you automatically jump to pride and say "man, I'm glad they are exercising their Rights!" Or you're sitting in an airport, knowing full well what's going on in the world and see some idiot walk in with an AR loaded out and think "boy, I'm glad he's around! I feel much safer now!"

If you answered that you felt safer seeing total strangers (other than the cops you don't trust) bearing long guns in public places instead of being slightly alarmed as to their motives, I question your ability to distinguish potential threats.

Perhaps some time to reflect on the question of "should" versus "can" might do you some good.

What does should and could have to do with someone's rights? Even the state said it was legal for the guy to carry a rifle through the airport. Was it smart, of course not. But we don't have rights so we don't hurt other people's feelings, we have them, because we sometimes do things that seem controversial.

As for your scenario of me being in a restaurant and some guy coming in with a rifle, I wouldn't care. I would keep him in my vision at all times, and leave if something went down, or if I was forced to, I'd defend myself. I'm not gonna rail someone for exercising his/her rights.

I'm not going to call you a statist, or say you were brain washed as a cop. I don't particularly care. It's a forum where people discuss things, lighten up.

 

[Grand Vol]

What does should and could have to do with someone's rights? Even the state said it was legal for the guy to carry a rifle through the airport. Was it smart, of course not. But we don't have rights so we don't hurt other people's feelings, we have them, because we sometimes do things that seem controversial.

As for your scenario of me being in a restaurant and some guy coming in with a rifle, I wouldn't care. I would keep him in my vision at all times, and leave if something went down, or if I was forced to, I'd defend myself. I'm not gonna rail someone for exercising his/her rights.

I'm not going to call you a statist, or say you were brain washed as a cop. I don't particularly care. It's a forum where people discuss things, lighten up.

I bolded the part that we have been discussing. Nobody says it is illegal or can't do it. But everyone except you and CP thinks it's a real bad idea to go parading around in a place like an airport just because he can. This isn't about hurting anyone's feelings. Bu it sure can be a setback to legitimate 2A issues in the future since the liberals can and will (not might) use this sort of thing as a scare tactic.

Nobody on here says he doesn't have the right. However, most of us are questioning the motive behind doing in. As we discussed about flipping a cop off, just because you can doesn't mean you should as it will draw negative attention towards you. And in this case, not only the attention of the cops but of Joe Q. Public that we need on the side of popular opinion. And prancing through an airport with an AR is not going to win hearts and minds in the public opinion.

 

[TNsnyper20]

What does should and could have to do with someone's rights? Even the state said it was legal for the guy to carry a rifle through the airport. Was it smart, of course not. But we don't have rights so we don't hurt other people's feelings, we have them, because we sometimes do things that seem controversial.

As for your scenario of me being in a restaurant and some guy coming in with a rifle, I wouldn't care. I would keep him in my vision at all times, and leave if something went down, or if I was forced to, I'd defend myself. I'm not gonna rail someone for exercising his/her rights.

I'm not going to call you a statist, or say you were brain washed as a cop. I don't particularly care. It's a forum where people discuss things, lighten up.

I call bs in your second part. No way would you or anyone else be "OK" with a guy waking into a restaurant with a rifle pointed down. "I'll just keep him in my vision" bs as well.

 

[DEFENDTHISHOUSE]

I bolded the part that we have been discussing. Nobody says it is illegal or can't do it. But everyone except you and CP thinks it's a real bad idea to go parading around in a place like an airport just because he can. This isn't about hurting anyone's feelings. Bu it sure can be a setback to legitimate 2A issues in the future since the liberals can and will (not might) use this sort of thing as a scare tactic.

Nobody on here says he doesn't have the right. However, most of us are questioning the motive behind doing in. As we discussed about flipping a cop off, just because you can doesn't mean you should as it will draw negative attention towards you. And in this case, not only the attention of the cops but of Joe Q. Public that we need on the side of popular opinion. And prancing through an airport with an AR is not going to win hearts and minds in the public opinion.

Let's be honest here, most of the public hasn't the slightest idea of what is going on around them at any given second of any given day. I don't particularly care about their feelings, they don't effect my rights in the slightest way.
What I do care about is gun owners wanting to restrict where these weapons can be taken.(because its not proper) As you will know, that's entirely up to the property owner to decide if they'd like someone with arms on their property.

Just for the record, we don't get our rights from a magical amendment scribbled on a magical piece of parchment. We get them because we're alive and own ourselves.

This whole perception of, we have to appease a certain group of people because we might have our rights taken away and popular opinion matters blah blah blah. That's just bs man.

If someone can vote away your rights, they were never rights to begin with, they were privileges.

 

[DEFENDTHISHOUSE]

I call bs in your second part. No way would you or anyone else be "OK" with a guy waking into a restaurant with a rifle pointed down. "I'll just keep him in my vision" bs as well.

It's a situation you're in, how you respond determines a lot. If the guy isn't a threat, what does it matter what he's doing? If he suddenly starts shooting up the place, that's another story entirely. The fight or flight instinct would kick you in the nads pretty hard at that point. Choose.

I'm not gonna look to limit the rights of others, because there are some crazy people in the world who do crazy things.

 

[Grand Vol]

Let's be honest here, most of the public hasn't the slightest idea of what is going on around them at any given second of any given day. I don't particularly care about their feelings, they don't effect my rights in the slightest way.
What I do care about is gun owners wanting to restrict where these weapons can be taken.(because its not proper) As you will know, that's entirely up to the property owner to decide if they'd like someone with arms on their property.

Just for the record, we don't get our rights from a magical amendment scribbled on a magical piece of parchment. We get them because we're alive and own ourselves.

This whole perception of, we have to appease a certain group of people because we might have our rights taken away and popular opinion matters blah blah blah. That's just bs man.

If someone can vote away your rights, they were never rights to begin with, they were privileges.

Good grief dude, nobody has said they want to restrict it. All we are doing is questioning the intelligence and motives behind it. Because it can and will cause problems. You and I both know it.

It's great Georgia passed the OC law. It's great people are aware of it. What's not great is when someone goes into a place like an airport to exercise it. You even said yourself it wasn't smart. And yes, popular opinion does matter a great deal since laws like this were passed in the first place. You have seen a reversal of a good many stupid anti-2A laws in recent memory. But that can come to a screeching halt with one ill timed event.

 

[DEFENDTHISHOUSE]

Good grief dude, nobody has said they want to restrict it. All we are doing is questioning the intelligence and motives behind it. Because it can and will cause problems. You and I both know it.

It's great Georgia passed the OC law. It's great people are aware of it. What's not great is when someone goes into a place like an airport to exercise it. You even said yourself it wasn't smart. And yes, popular opinion does matter a great deal since laws like this were passed in the first place. You have seen a reversal of a good many stupid anti-2A laws in recent memory. But that can come to a screeching halt with one ill timed event.

What kind of problems will it cause? Will DC make a law? Probably. How does that affect what we're doing? I'm still gonna have my guns, regardless of what the law says.

Is open carry smart, no it's not, as we've said. You make yourself a target and are at a complete tactical disadvantage. But, how the general public feels about it is completely irrelevant.

I think my main problem is with the demonization of guns in our culture, as I stated earlier, more times than not when you see a guy with a gun on TV, it usually has a negative connotation. I feel like the public would be well served seeing these guns more, perhaps they won't be so scared of them. Let's be honest, most kids don't grow up around guns any more. There is a fear factor there that you can draw a straight line to Hollywood and their false projections of the "evils" of guns. Sad as it is, Hollywood drives our culture. Maybe more guns wouldn't be a bad thing.

 

[davethevol]

It's a situation you're in, how you respond determines a lot. If the guy isn't a threat, what does it matter what he's doing? If he suddenly starts shooting up the place, that's another story entirely. The fight or flight instinct would kick you in the nads pretty hard at that point. Choose.

I'm not gonna look to limit the rights of others, because there are some crazy people in the world who do crazy things.

I was in a food place in NC one time sitting down and eating my lunch when a guy walked in with a handgun tucked in the front of his pants. He was white and looked like a thug, and I really thought he came in to rob the place. It turned out that he worked at a gun store next door. Still, what he did was pretty stupid and he's lucky that someone didn't engage him because of how he was carrying and his appearance. If not in an official uniform, people should carried concealed just to keep from causing a situation.

 

[82_VOL_83]

You know, we can have a reasonable conversation about this if you wouldn't ignore the question I posed. Which you are and also are being a dick about it. Let me guess, next you're going to call me a statist and say I was brainwashed as a cop.

Let's toss this hypothetical at you. Say you're sitting in your favorite Chipotle when Snow Boots McGee and Neckbeard Johnson come walking in with their rifles slung to the front. This would not cause you some alarm or do you automatically jump to pride and say "man, I'm glad they are exercising their Rights!" Or you're sitting in an airport, knowing full well what's going on in the world and see some idiot walk in with an AR loaded out and think "boy, I'm glad he's around! I feel much safer now!"

If you answered that you felt safer seeing total strangers (other than the cops you don't trust) bearing long guns in public places instead of being slightly alarmed as to their motives, I question your ability to distinguish potential threats.

Perhaps some time to reflect on the question of "should" versus "can" might do you some good.

Can't be both ways GV. In for a penny, in for a pound. If you support the right, then you support the action. That fact that he decides to exercise his right that you support really doesn't enter into the conversation.

 

[Grand Vol]

Can't be both ways GV. In for a penny, in for a pound. If you support the right, then you support the action. That fact that he decides to exercise his right that you support really doesn't enter into the conversation.

No, that's an absolute and the complete wrong way of thinking about it. Using your logic is the way liberals think when creating these idiotic weapons bans. One person shoots up a school in New Hampshire, ergo nobody should have an AR15.

I don't deal in absolutes. I can support the right while saying the action is completely stupid.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Good grief dude, nobody has said they want to restrict it. All we are doing is questioning the intelligence and motives behind it. Because it can and will cause problems. You and I both know it.

It's great Georgia passed the OC law. It's great people are aware of it. What's not great is when someone goes into a place like an airport to exercise it. You even said yourself it wasn't smart. And yes, popular opinion does matter a great deal since laws like this were passed in the first place. You have seen a reversal of a good many stupid anti-2A laws in recent memory. But that can come to a screeching halt with one ill timed event.

What is different about an airport? He won't get passed security. Well, with the late TSA findings he might....