Gun control debate (merged)

[hndog609]

Good article. Actually I think I've linked it previously but given this latest line of thought in the thread it's worth putting it up again.

Any Study Of 'Gun Violence' Should Include How Guns Save Lives

Then there's this from, of all places, a CDC study.
“Studies that directly assessed the effect of actual defensive uses of guns (i.e., incidents in which a gun was ‘used’ by the crime victim in the sense of attacking or threatening an offender) have found consistently lower injury rates among gun-using crime victims compared with victims who used other self-protective strategies,"

Recent examples.
Employee shot man who tried to rob Cleveland cellphone store at gunpoint, police say
Police: Man shot while trying to break into apartment
Deputies: Garland County man shoots alleged burglar, 3 other suspects arrested
Homeowner returns fire on burglary suspects killing 1, critically injuring the other in Hampton County
Gas station clerk shoots suspected armed robber in Mt. Clemens

Couple observations. By "recent" I mean I think the oldest of these is still under a week. Also, there's no way in hell this is anywhere remotely close to all the examples of civilian self-defense firearm uses out there. It's happening all the time literally every day. MOST don't get much, if indeed any, press because since their mere presence prevented something from happening then nothing happened to report.

 

[NurseGoodVol]

I must have missed the word ALL
ALL is the critical word here. No one is attempting to take ALL, nor to you have the constitutional right to ALL.

Bear arms already encompasses all...armS see the S it's pleural. Adding all is only important to you, for anyone else, we can see its already complete. Something out of nothing.

 

[NurseGoodVol]

She would not know the difference between a semi auto and a revolver if it bit her on the tits.

She would shoot herself in the foot... I'd lay money on it.

 

[82_VOL_83]

You can show, for example, that having access to a gun is correlated with a greater risk of suicide, especially suicide by gunshot (https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/magazine/guns-and-suicide/). So yes, we do know that gun owners (or people living in gun owning households) are at greater risk for suicide, especially suicide by gunshot.

I don't know how we'd measure whether something less severe than gun use would repel an attack, but we know it happens all the time because many non-gun owners use various means to repel an attack or protect themselves. For example, the San Diego shooter retreated when someone charged at him.

BS. That is a reach. You know it, the gun grabbers at Harvard know it. Wait, maybe you don't know it.......

Edit: The fact that you want all guns because some stupid SOB wants to kill himself? Let them go. There is medication for mental disorders. Take your meds. Committing suicide is one of the most selfish acts know to modern society. It is done solely as an attention grab and only hurts those left behind.

 

[82_VOL_83]

Bear arms already encompasses all...armS see the S it's pleural. Adding all is only important to you, for anyone else, we can see its already complete. Something out of nothing.

I'm going more with the "shall not be infringed" part as meaning ALL.

 

[LouderVol]

I'm going more with the "shall not be infringed" part as meaning ALL.

McDad said it best. The Constitution was meant to protect controversy. It was meant to keep us from being a group think safe space. It keeps us free, warts with freedom is better than less freedom and less warts.

 

[NorthDallas40]

I'm going more with the "shall not be infringed" part as meaning ALL.

And that’s looths schtick he and the other gun grabbers are trying to sell. “We’re not infringing on your gun rights. You can have muskets”.

Turns out we’re better off to just ignore them all and not even engage on the “gun type” narrative. If they were to ever move the focus to the individual and away from the implement ok let’s talk. As long as it’s focused on the implement nah I just hear blah blah blah.

There’s no reason to engage in a discussion to be talked into giving up your right. That’s stupid. Remember...

IF YOU LIKE YOUR AR-15 YOU CAN KEEP YOUR AR-15!

 

[0nelilreb]

Understand your concepts, EL. But the apples to apples comparison is unnecessary. We have a constitutional right to firearms. End of story. Let me know when you want a apples to apples comparison of other constitutional rights...free speech, free press, freedom of religion...I suspect we can easily find instances where to "bad" outweighs the "good" related to those freedoms.

This is a good example of the “ if you roll around in the mud with a pig “ adage . Don’t let the pig tempt you into the mud . We already have the right to bear arms , they have to find away to take it from us . Also good to have you back .

 

[luthervol]

Understand your concepts, EL. But the apples to apples comparison is unnecessary. We have a constitutional right to firearms. End of story. Let me know when you want a apples to apples comparison of other constitutional rights...free speech, free press, freedom of religion...I suspect we can easily find instances where to "bad" outweighs the "good" related to those freedoms.

All of those have limits and restrictions.

 

[0nelilreb]

All of those have limits and restrictions.

So do guns , can you walk into a store , pick one out , hand them the money and leave with it ?
Edit : have you ever bought a gun ?

 

[luthervol]

So do guns , can you walk into a store , pick one out , hand them the money and leave with it ?
Edit : have you ever bought a gun ?

That's just proving my point.
Guaranteed constitutional rights have rational and reasonable legal limitations and regulations.
Always have, always will.

Never bought a gun. But I did get 1st in my college trap and skeet shooting class. Aim is one of my super powers.

 

[hog88]

All of those have limits and restrictions.

No they don’t. There are consequences when those rights are misused and cause harm but there are no limits.

 

[0nelilreb]

That's just proving my point.
Guaranteed constitutional rights have rational and reasonable legal imitations and regulations.
Always have, always will.

Never bought a gun. But I did get 1st in my college trap and skeet shooting class. Aim is one of my super powers.

I’m not making the argument for restrictions , I’m making the argument that there are already restrictions on our rights . When you have rights and you keep adding restrictions on to each right until it gets to the point that they are worthless , it’s the same as taking them from us , you are just coming in the house through the window instead of the front door .

 

[luthervol]

I’m not making the argument for restrictions , I’m making the argument that there are already restrictions on our rights . When you have rights and you keep adding restrictions on to each right until it gets to the point that they are worthless , it’s the same as taking them from us , you are just coming in the house through the window instead of the front door .

That's the same argument used by the purveyors of child porn.

 

[luthervol]

No they don’t. There are consequences when those rights are misused and cause harm but there are no limits.

Sure there are. You cannot legally purchase or sell child porn.

 

[LouderVol]

That's the same argument used by the purveyors of child porn.

We have/had a right to child porn?

You can have child porn without harming a child?

No one is saying owning a gun is consequence free.

 

[82_VOL_83]

That's the same argument used by the purveyors of child porn.

Just when I thought you couldn't get more disgusting.

 

[0nelilreb]

That's the same argument used by the purveyors of child porn.

I don’t believe porn of any kind is a right . Child porn is in fact illegal . Owning a firearm is a right laid out in the constitution . That’s probably the worst argument I’ve every seen you make and you’ve had some bad ones . Lol

 

[82_VOL_83]

I don’t believe porn of any kind is a right . Child porn is in fact illegal . Owning a firearm is a right laid out in the constitution . That’s probably the worst argument I’ve every seen you make and you’ve had some bad ones . Lol

He gave up on asbestos when that analogy fell through.

 

[0nelilreb]

He gave up on asbestos when that analogy fell through.

When the liberals go from asbestos to child porn when debating gun rights , it’s safe to assume they are all out of ideas and are just one more NRA membership away from dropping on the floor kicking and screaming .

 

[NorthDallas40]

No they don’t. There are consequences when those rights are misused and cause harm but there are no limits.

Ding ding ding!

 

[NorthDallas40]

Why the hell would the libs pivot to child porn talking points they’re distributing apparently? That’s some sick bastages.

 

[CABVOL]

Why the hell would the libs pivot to child porn talking points they’re distributing apparently? That’s some sick bastages.

In my 48 years, I have come to find that many really 'intelligent' people are usually dumb as f*** when it comes to real life.

 

[luthervol]

I don’t believe porn of any kind is a right . Child porn is in fact illegal . Owning a firearm is a right laid out in the constitution . That’s probably the worst argument I’ve every seen you make and you’ve had some bad ones . Lol

That's why there are limits placed on freedom of speech and the press.

 

[0nelilreb]

That's why there are limits placed on freedom of speech and the press.

Because of child porn ? You know your going to take a beating over this right ? I’d offer you a bigger shovel for that hole your in but I don’t think it would help at this point .