Game Thread Lady Vols vs Presbyterian

lvocd

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You're alone...No KK, no Meme...Why be like that. Meme bounced back from a moment of passion and played a very good 2nd half and KK is playing physical in the post. We need em all. Hopefully Harris will make a jump into this level with some PT.
Good grief. I didn't say that I don't think that the players outside that 7 weren't valuable to the team. It was a comment based on how good I think our freshmen are. All of our freshmen would be starters on the vast majority of DI teams. Do you disagree?

As for MeMe, I have to say that if I weren't close to the program and didn't already know she is a senior who is supposedly a veteran player and team leader, I'd have never guessed that if all I had to judge her by was the first two games with the volume off.

There is nothing about the way she carries herself on the floor that indicates she has a more mature,thoughtful approach to the game than the inexperienced freshmen have. I hope that changes.
 

VA_VOLFAN

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Good grief. I didn't say that I don't think that the players outside that 7 weren't valuable to the team. It was a comment based on how good I think our freshmen are. All of our freshmen would be starters on the vast majority of DI teams. Do you disagree?

As for MeMe, I have to say that if I weren't close to the program and didn't already know she is a senior who is supposedly a veteran player and team leader, I'd have never guessed that if all I had to judge her by was the first two games with the volume off.

There is nothing about the way she carries herself on the floor that indicates she has a more mature,thoughtful approach to the game than the inexperienced freshmen have. I hope that changes.
You talked about Meme that’s his trigger.

However meme had a fairly decent game and I think she understood she better raise her level of intensity to those surrounding her. Competition breeds competitiveness and if we have coaches that will sit people on the bench then we will see great gains!
 

lvocd

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To be clear, I love ALL of Tennessee's players and want all of them to kick butt in every game they play. I just think MeMe's extra experience as a Lady Vol isn't as obvious to the casual observer as it should be -- at least not through two games. Hopefully it will!
 
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That's my #1 concern, and has been my main concern for many years.

So far -- and I know that we've only seen two games -- I am not getting the feeling that the half-court offense has been tweaked or improved in any significant way, so it hurts to imagine that another "Groundhog Day"-type season may be ahead.

Drastic changes needed to be made. Were they? Still too soon to tell for sure, but I'm nervous.
I feel the same about everything you mentioned. Now that Holly has been the HC for seven years, will the same cycle continue with a different set of players?

We shall see.
 

lvocd

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I feel the same about everything you mentioned. Now that Holly has been the HC for seven years, will the same cycle continue with a different set of players?

We shall see.
For the past six or seven years the majority of Tennessee's freshmen have been impressive to start each season, only to get progressively less and less confident and/or capable as the season goes on.

And I'm not talking about the type of drop-off that's often the result of players "hitting the freshman wall." I'm taliking about freshmen coming in confident, capable, scrappy, exciting and impressive only to devolve into tentative, frustrated, bewildered, resigned and gloomy-looking shells of their former selves in just a few months' time.

It has been incredibly frustrating as a longtime fan who has seen many a freshman come through Tennessee starting out strong and then getting STRONGER every month and every season until they finally graduate, only to see very few instancesof that in this new era.

So, if we see that happening again with THIS particularly stellar group of freshmen and sophomores, then, I'm afraid, the reason for it will be obvious. Hopefully the necessary changes were made and the cycle will be broken.
 
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For the past six or seven years the majority of Tennessee's freshmen have been impressive to start each season, only to get progressively less and less confident and/or capable as the season goes on.

And I'm not talking about the type of drop-off that's often the result of players "hitting the freshman wall." I'm taliking about freshmen coming in confident, capable, scrappy, exciting and impressive only to devolve into tentative, frustrated, bewildered, resigned and gloomy-looking shells of their former selves in just a few months' time.

It has been incredibly frustrating as a longtime fan who has seen many a freshman come through Tennessee starting out strong and then getting STRONGER every month and every season until they finally graduate, only to see very few instancesof that in this new era.

So, if we see that happening again with THIS particularly stellar group of freshmen and sophomores, then, I'm afraid, the reason for it will be obvious. Hopefully the necessary changes were made and the cycle will be broken.
I could not have said it any better. And will player development happen to such a degree that top recruits out of high school end up being All-American's in college? We have yet to see that in this era, and we've gotten the same amount of talent that other programs who've made the FF have had as well.
 

Pat4life

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Please do not harp on the past. There are many reasons as to why players don't develop. Player development. The first word is player!

The last two classes are motivated by getting better and are always in the gym, that is a good start, now we hearing the past three classes were never in the gym.

Sometimes with recruits, you win some: players they reach their potential and sometimes that potential materialize later in their careers (post college) or sometimes it never happens. And this is the same at every program.

And personally, I haven't seen the Lady Vols play that hard on the defensive side of the ball since her first three season, let's rewind to her first four seasons.


Go Lady Vols!
 
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LadyVol1908

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Please do not harp on the past. There are many reasons as to why players don't develop. Player development. The first word is player!

The last two classes are motivated by getting better and are always in the gym, that is a good start, now we hearing the past three classes were never in the gym.

Sometimes with recruits, you win some: players they reach their potential and sometimes that potential materialize later in their careers (post college) or sometimes it never happens. And this is the same at every program.

And personally, I haven't seen the Lady Vols play that hard on the defensive side of the ball since her first three season, let's rewind to her first four seasons.


Go Lady Vols!
+10000000000000

I don’t know about this new member just yet. Looks as if they’re ready to pounce on Holly after 2 games. Inconspicuously.
 

Volfan2012

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We have to remember that half of this team are freshmen and one or two returnees did not play much last season. The only players we have that have a lot of playing time under their belt are Westbrooks, Jackson, Davis, and C. Green. This team should get a lot better with everygame. The biggest concern I have is team being over practiced and freshmen hitting a wall later this season. I don't know if we have the depth to keep up this 40 minutes of pressure for an entire season. I think these players hardest season is their freshman year. The total of longer practices, high intensity game play, and academics is quite a load for freshmen not used to this type of grind. It was evident that some of the freshmen last season got fatigued by the end of the season we'll have to watch what happens this season. For game one we really played well and turned it up to high gear in the second half of the game. I love the team know were gonna lose a few games but the future is bright.
 

Rickster

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I agree. The first year is tough then add highly competitive sports to the mix..... Most posters don't think about the human aspect...just wins and losses.
 

Smallvol#1

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this will be my last game thread,so somebody needs to pick up the slack :)
Just opened this page. What can I say? Love you and prayers. Let me know if I can do anything. You know how to reach meπŸ§‘πŸ§‘πŸ§‘πŸ§‘πŸ§‘πŸ§‘πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™.
 

Smallvol#1

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Gmule,I always have looked forward to your game threads. I remember that you were the first to have a conversation with this novice poster a few years ago. May GOD bless you and your family and turn this recurrence into remission. Please keep us informed.
Hi! Been praying for you and your wife too. Hope she is doing well. And, yes, I know this is a game thread, but you and mule are more important than any protocol. πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™
 
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+10000000000000

I don’t know about this new member just yet. Looks as if they’re ready to pounce on Holly after 2 games. Inconspicuously.
That's fine. And I wouldn't say I'm pouncing on or bashing Holly. I'm just articulating what I've seen over the past seven years, and you, along with almost EVERYONE else, are doing the exact same. It's not bad that we're not all seeing the same thing. We all (well, mostly everyone) wants the best for our program), so anything I say will be said with that motivation.
 

Benionsopinion

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Hi! Been praying for you and your wife too. Hope she is doing well. And, yes, I know this is a game thread, but you and mule are more important than any protocol. πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™πŸ™
Thank you,Smaiivol, for your thoughts and prayers. I always enjoy your posts and your point of view. We still take a day at a time.
 

FrozenLVFan

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So far -- and I know that we've only seen two games -- I am not getting the feeling that the half-court offense has been tweaked or improved in any significant way, so it hurts to imagine that another "Groundhog Day"-type season may be ahead.

Drastic changes needed to be made. Were they? Still too soon to tell for sure, but I'm nervous.
This team's success will be based on a running game and not half-court sets. The presence of Russell, who could not run, required us to play a half-court game, which was never successful. Different personnel this year will allow us to run, as well as provide some outside shooting which was lacking before.
 

VA_VOLFAN

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This team's success will be based on a running game and not half-court sets.
There was better ball movement than in the past. I saw for the first time in a long time someone penetrate, suck the defense in, and kick it open to a wide open shooter. To many times our 3 point shots have been last min desperation shots and they have even come in transition (which is ok sometimes). To see Zaay green penetrate and dish to Meme was a thing of beauty! Something that she can do, Rennia, Evina, Jazmine, and Rae can all do with shooters ready to shoot.
 

lvocd

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That's fine. And I wouldn't say I'm pouncing on or bashing Holly. I'm just articulating what I've seen over the past seven years, and you, along with almost EVERYONE else, are doing the exact same. It's not bad that we're not all seeing the same thing. We all (well, mostly everyone) wants the best for our program), so anything I say will be said with that motivation.
Neither ttharpe or myself are "pouncing on" anyone. Rather, I think we are agreeing on a very simple way to gauge whether any systemic changes were made in this past offseason: If the freshmen begin to appear to inexplicably lose all the abilities they are displaying now, that'll be a strong indicator that we are watching Lady Vol Groundhog Day.

And please don't reply with, "But of COURSE they're going to look great against the cupcakes we're playing now! We can't expect them to play that well against stronger competition!" My response to that mistake would be to point out that there have been plenty of highly lauded freshmen for Tennessee (and numerous other programs) over the decades who have somehow managed to avoid playing out the type of shocking decline in even the most basic of fundamental skills that they came to campus with in their first year -- but that has, unfortunately, happened to a number of freshmen who've come to Tennessee in recent years.

That Russell and Nared left here without making any all-American teams is nothing short of stunning -- and I remember reading stories about how hard both of them had worked in their off-seasons. How can that be explained?
 

djtee

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There was better ball movement than in the past. I saw for the first time in a long time someone penetrate, suck the defense in, and kick it open to a wide open shooter. To many times our 3 point shots have been last min desperation shots and they have even come in transition (which is ok sometimes). To see Zaay green penetrate and dish to Meme was a thing of beauty! Something that she can do, Rennia, Evina, Jazmine, and Rae can all do with shooters ready to shoot.
Rae has big time talent & game and i think Holly knows it, Rae looks taller then Collins when they stood next to each other on the court Rae look taller. They have her listed as 6-2 ?
 

governmentmule

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I just watched the game and for some reason I'm a bit disappointed in the win,all the missed lay ups and bunnys is a concern and the rebounding definitely needs to get better,and damn somebody get into good position and block out under the hoop

still a lot of work to do for this young team,with all the Freshmen I guess it is to be expected
 

Pat4life

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Let's be fair, the Lady Vols, Lady Vols haven't had that transcendent player since Parker. The the last SEC Player of the 2013.

2012 Senior Glory Johnson earned both Capital One Academic and WBCA All-America honors while rookie Ariel Massengale was named to the USBWA All-Freshman Team.

2013 Warlick was chosen Spalding Maggie Dixon National Rookie Coach of the Year and SEC Coach of the Year. Meighan Simmons was named an AP third-team All-American and SEC Co-Player of the Year,

2014: Meighan Simmons was AP All-America honorable mention, NCAA Louisville All-Regional, AP SEC Player of the Year and All-SEC First Team by AP and the coaches. Isabelle Harrison was AP All-American honorable mention, AP and coaches All-SEC First Team and SEC Tournament MVP.

2015: Isabelle Harrison and Cierra Burdick were Associated Press Honorable Mention All-Americans and All-SEC First Team selections, Harrison was a WBCA Honorable Mention choice

2016: Senior Bashaara Graves was voted AP All-America Honorable Mention, while she and redshirt sophomore Diamond DeShields garnered AP All-SEC Second Team accolades.

2017: Diamond DeShields and Mercedes Russell were WBCA H.M. All-Americans

2018: WBCA Honorable Mention All-America seniors Jaime Nared and Mercedes Russell leading the attack

Meighan and Izzy not being highly ranked coming out of High School. The players have to put in the work.

Go Lady Vols! If one of these players from the last two classes and going forward become a first team or 2nd team All American, or playing like one of the best player in the country (cos usually the best players are on the best teams in WCBB) then the future does looks bright for the Lady Vols, but that remains to be seen. So we watch! lol

History: Lady Vols Basketball Year-by-Year Archive
 
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madtownvol

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For the past six or seven years the majority of Tennessee's freshmen have been impressive to start each season, only to get progressively less and less confident and/or capable as the season goes on.

And I'm not talking about the type of drop-off that's often the result of players "hitting the freshman wall." I'm taliking about freshmen coming in confident, capable, scrappy, exciting and impressive only to devolve into tentative, frustrated, bewildered, resigned and gloomy-looking shells of their former selves in just a few months' time.

It has been incredibly frustrating as a longtime fan who has seen many a freshman come through Tennessee starting out strong and then getting STRONGER every month and every season until they finally graduate, only to see very few instancesof that in this new era.

So, if we see that happening again with THIS particularly stellar group of freshmen and sophomores, then, I'm afraid, the reason for it will be obvious. Hopefully the necessary changes were made and the cycle will be broken.
Really? Last season Davis got better and better as the season went on. So did Hayes. Westbrook did slump off but injuries played a big role in that performance decline.

You can go back to Jamie who again got better as the season went on though she did seem to hit the freshman wall at tournament time.

I could list other counter examples but your description--"frustrated, bewildered, resigned and gloomy-looking shells of their former selves"--is probably a better portrayal of the fan base than the players.
 

Coach Jumper

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I dont think this team will have any problems beating teams they should beat this year. The defensive effort is refreshing to see !

Good call.
That is the most revealing aspect of a true contender, "Do you beat who you are supposed to beat?"

The mark of a "new" team is inconsistency in effort and outcome
The mark of a "matured" team is consistency in effort and outcome.
 

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