Fulmer's downfall

Reason for Fulmer's downfall

  • Complacency

    Votes: 156 38.0%

  • Cutcliffe Leaving

    Votes: 100 24.4%

  • Dave Clawson

    Votes: 35 8.5%

  • Kelly Washington

    Votes: 5 1.2%

  • Mike Hamilton

    Votes: 69 16.8%

  • Two losing seasons in four years

    Votes: 45 11.0%
  • Total voters
    410
  • Poll closed .
#126
#126
alltimevol2331 said:
Fulmer never developed a program?????! What in the world are you talking about. He developed one of the best four years any programs have ever had. Remember the 45-5 stretch.
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This, a program coming off of being only one year removed from back to back SEC championships. Nah, he walked into it!
 
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#128
#128
The difference being though is that he didn't get his first head coach job at a school that needed serious work.

It's one thing to take over a program that's loaded ( as Tennessee was). He's definitely shares responsibility for that as he was on staff, but that was Majors' program as head coach. His staff.

It's very different if one takes over at a school that's average at best , on a prolonged down period, or in the dumps.

Fulmer just couldn't keep up once other SEC schools upgraded their coaching. He had a great run in the 90's when the SEC had coaches like Gerry Dinardo, Brad Scott, Ray Goff, Jim Donnan, Woody Widenhofer, Bill Curry, Danny Ford, Mike Dubose.
 
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#129
#129
OffTackleVol said:
What an idiotic post. I guess as an offensive line coach, OC, and lead recruiter he had nothing to do with those back to back SECCs? And the 45-5 run was 95-98, five years later.
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Ok, so, let me understand your thinking here. He was the reason for the success leading up to and through the back to back SEC championships of '89 and '90 but, it was not him as he had nothing to do with the program being run into the ground by the end of his tenure (firing during the 2008 season for, among other things, two losing seasons in four years).

Now, how many coaching jobs has he had since his firing? What about offers? I mean, I'm just an idiot I guess but it seems to me that if others just know, such as yourself, that he was such a great coach, then why did he not recreate his success somewhere else? Why was he not even considered any where else.

In before he didn't want to!
 
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#131
#131
source.gif

What if you could go back through time for a do-over...

Imagine if you will that the UT Administration had the vision to "promote" Fulmer from Head Football Coach to Director of Men's Athletics when Dickey stepped aside. No Hamilton, no horrifying hires & fires, no fiscal melt down. Phabulous Phil might have given the HC gig to Cutcliffe, who might have taken the job.

Yeah, I know what you're thinking - Give Fulmer the AD job after the 2002 season?!?! Yes. Imagine the poobahs of UT having the chutzpah to do just that.
 
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#132
#132
XknoxvolsX said:
Ok, so, let me understand your thinking here. He was the reason for the success leading up to and through the back to back SEC championships of '89 and '90 but, it was not him as he had nothing to do with the program being run into the ground by the end of his tenure (firing during the 2008 season for, among other things, two losing seasons in four years).

Now, how many coaching jobs has he had since his firing? What about offers? I mean, I'm just an idiot I guess but it seems to me that if others just know, such as yourself, that he was such a great coach, then why did he not recreate his success somewhere else? Why was he not even considered any where else.

In before he didn't want to!
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You have issues with reading comp. First, I didn't call you an idiot. And, where did I say "he was the reason for the success.......?" He was part of a team. An important part, no less. I don't I think mentioned anything about "it was not him as he had nothing to do with the program being run into the ground......" So, don't know where you got that.

And from what I understand, he had several opportunities to continual as a head coach. But hey, don't let facts stop you from disparaging the guy that, outside of Neyland, helped give us the greatest decade of Tennessee football.
 
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#133
#133
2001 - 2008 Fulmer was 68-34, 42-34 in the SEC, played in the SECCG three times. If you go back and look at any set of 8 years, the only ones you'll find better are the previous 8 years and Neyland. Even though we may have dropped off some he was still better his last half of his career than almost every coach we've had, Neyland excluded.
 
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#134
#134
BDP! said:
2001 - 2008 Fulmer was 68-34, 42-34 in the SEC, played in the SECCG three times. If you go back and look at any set of 8 years, the only ones you'll find better are the previous 8 years and Neyland. Even though we may have dropped off some he was still better his last half of his career than almost every coach we've had, Neyland excluded.
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Great information. Basically averages out to a 9-4 record each season. Certainly not as good as his first 8 years, but what UT coach not named Neyland did better? I wouldn't call his last 8 years "running the program into the ground" either.
 
#135
#135
Malivol said:
Fulmer always had far more talent than anyone with the exception being Florida. The SEC was weak during his tenure. When Richt arrived at Georgia and cut off his pipeline to Georgia talent that was the beginning of the end. From there, he wasn't in the ballpark with the new coaches arriving in the SEC. He got outcoached repeatedly by the newcomers and was never going to beat them. They were smarter, better prepared, and just outright better coaches. His time had passed him by long before he was let go. I remember in a press conference he said something along the lines of we didn't forget how to coach over night. No he didn't forget how to coach, but he did fail to adjust to the times and up his coaching to a competitive level. Cutcliffe carried him even when he had more talent than all the other schools. When Cutcliffe left a second time, it just made Phil's situation that much worse. One of the biggest mistakes TN made was when Kiffin left and Cutcliffe wanted the job. TN wouldn't allow him to bring his full staff with him, so he turned them down. If TN doesn't make that mistake, we aren't in the position we have been in for 10+ years.
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Yeah, but stats from the 90s...
 
#136
#136
OffTackleVol said:
Great information. Basically averages out to a 9-4 record each season. Certainly not as good as his first 8 years, but what UT coach not named Neyland did better? I wouldn't call his last 8 years "running the program into the ground" either.
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His last season was loaded with seniors and was worse than any team we’ve fielded outside Butch’s last. Cutcliffe gave him a nice boost for two years, but he was finished. He had a losing record to half the conference coaches. His only two OC hires were awful and the other two guys he was considering other than Clawson also produced disastrous seasons in 2008 that got them fired. He’d have fired Clawson, hired some other stiff, and gotten the dreaded 8-loss season in 2009 if we’d kept him.
 
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#137
#137
West Vol said:
His last season was loaded with seniors and was worse than any team we’ve fielded outside Butch’s last. Cutcliffe gave him a nice boost for two years, but he was finished. He had a losing record to half the conference coaches. His only two OC hires were awful and the other two guys he was considering other than Clawson also produced disastrous seasons in 2008 that got them fired. He’d have fired Clawson, hired some other stiff, and gotten the dreaded 8-loss season in 2009 if we’d kept him.
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Really, how's the stock market going to do next month?
 
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#138
#138
OffTackleVol said:
Really, how's the stock market going to do next month?
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Even with the rate cut from the Feds last month, it is still going to dip. We are headed to another recession. Treasury notes are picking up but still not enough to make people jump to them and bonds.
 
#140
#140
alltimevol2331 said:
Fulmer never developed a program?????! What in the world are you talking about. He developed one of the best four years any programs have ever had. Remember the 45-5 stretch.
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He took over a program that had won 3 SEC Championships in the last 6 years. No, he never developed a program. Without David Cutcliff on staff Fulmer was very average by SEC standards. Cutcliff even remarked he could not believe how the discipline in the program had deteriorated when he came back in 2006. That is all on Fulmer.
 
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#141
#141
BDP! said:
2001 - 2008 Fulmer was 68-34, 42-34 in the SEC, played in the SECCG three times. If you go back and look at any set of 8 years, the only ones you'll find better are the previous 8 years and Neyland. Even though we may have dropped off some he was still better his last half of his career than almost every coach we've had, Neyland excluded.
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The problem with that equation is when you look at his last 4 years he had 2 losing seasons and 2 ten win seasons. The 2 ten win seasons were when David Cutcliff was on his staff. Without Cutcliff, Fulmer was average.
 
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#142
#142
onevol74 said:
The problem with that equation is when you look at his last 4 years he had 2 losing seasons and 2 ten win seasons. The 2 ten win seasons were when David Cutcliff was on his staff. Without Cutcliff, Fulmer was average.
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That only proves that most HCs are only as good as their staff. Fulmer was too loyal to Randy Sanders, and he definitely blundered on hiring Clawson. I certainly wasn't 100% on hiring people, and I doubt that most people are. Unfortunately it's pretty hard to make a mid season correction in college football. I have a feeling that when Pruitt kicked the whiteboard, he had realized that he made a big mistake on the OC choice last year.
 
#147
#147
Tin Man said:
What if you could go back through time for a do-over...

Imagine if you will that the UT Administration had the vision to "promote" Fulmer from Head Football Coach to Director of Men's Athletics when Dickey stepped aside. No Hamilton, no horrifying hires & fires, no fiscal melt down. Phabulous Phil might have given the HC gig to Cutcliffe, who might have taken the job.

Yeah, I know what you're thinking - Give Fulmer the AD job after the 2002 season?!?! Yes. Imagine the poobahs of UT having the chutzpah to do just that.
Click to expand...
Shirley you jest, then we would have spent the last 10 yrs or so bitching about winning only 12 games a year :rolleyes:
 
#148
#148
West Vol said:
His last season was loaded with seniors and was worse than any team we’ve fielded outside Butch’s last. Cutcliffe gave him a nice boost for two years, but he was finished. He had a losing record to half the conference coaches. His only two OC hires were awful and the other two guys he was considering other than Clawson also produced disastrous seasons in 2008 that got them fired. He’d have fired Clawson, hired some other stiff, and gotten the dreaded 8-loss season in 2009 if we’d kept him.
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Nah, he would have bounced back and won 9-10 games '09, no doubt about it.
 
#149
#149
Multitude of factors, but the single biggest was the entry of Mark Richt and Urban Meyer into the SEC East.

Fulmer had his greatest run of success when the SEC was a two-team league, Tennessee and Florida, and Florida still got the best of us. His only consistent success against Florida was after Spurrier left. When Georgia, LSU, etc. hired better coaches, Fulmer was nowhere near as competitive. He had a losing record against Florida, Georgia, and Alabama from 2002 until he was fired - I think that says a lot, and I think he still would have been fired even if he didn't have the losing seasons in 2005 and 2008.

Lotta Vol fans don't like to admit this, but we had the most success when the conference wasn't all that good. When the SEC really started to emerge as CFB's premier conference in the mid 2000s and then especially in the late 2000s, the program faded into oblivion and is still in oblivion. I hate to say this, but it is really hard for us to be good if Florida, Georgia, Alabama, etc. are all up. We kind of need for at least one of them to be down for us to be good. We don't control our destiny as much as they do because of their ability to recruit.
 
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#150
#150
I blame Saban. He took a championship away from us in 2001 and has been a thorn in our side ever since.
 
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