Fulmer debate extravaganza (merged)

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#4,478
#4,478
PermaVol said:
Dunno if I can agree with this. He is very intelligent, but Fulmer didn't win 152 cause he was lucky.
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He won 152 because most of the time he had considerably more talent that our opponents. He didn't win many of them out-scheming the other guy, that's for sure.

I was speaking in the manner which Dooley broke down the plays he was asked to analyze. It's apparent his overall knowledge of the game is superior than Fulmer or Kiffin. He's been exposed to stuff Fulmer has likely never seen.
 
#4,479
#4,479
VegasVol said:
At most businesses, if the new CEO delivers worse outcomes than the fired CEO prior, you call that firing of the prior CEO a dumb firing.

Put simply, Fulmer defenders predicted we'd be worse off without him; Fulmer critics claimed we'd be an elite team without him. To date, his defenders have proven to be far more correct than his critics; his critics just can't admit they were dead wrong about their forecasts for Tennessee's future success. We look a lot like the same post-integration Tennessee football program we had before Fulmer took over the offense & recruiting in 1989 -- a mediocre, after-thought program, with just blips of success.
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BelAirVol said:
That's true but in this case it's an ignorant analogy
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it's not ignorant at all to expect that your better after a new hire "or two" than before..

bottom line is the fanbase wants the current coach to be as good or betther than fulmer
 
#4,483
#4,483
When was the last season Fulmer coached, '08? So it's been three years since his departure and we're 2-1 with a coach in place that is here to stay for a while. Not an overnight pony show! The current guy has had 2 top-15 classes and had to get rid of most of Lame Kiffie's class due to behavior and grade issues. The last Fulmer class wasn't very talented. Where does that leave us now?

It leaves us with 2 top-15 classes and scraps from the 3 before them, yet there are some expecting to be 3-0 with our best offensive weapon injured. That only tells me one thing: There are a lot of IDIOTS in our fanbase that need to go elsewhere! We are competing with the likes of Nationally ranked teams with scraps and youth. If that doesn't tell you IDIOTS the future looks bright, then I don't know what else will. Most of the guys we're playing against in the SEC have been on campus at least 3 years. Our guys mostly 2. In all honesty, we should be worse off than UK right now! I'm certainly thankful we got a coach that can the most out of his players while continuing to bring in more talent. I'd hate to be UK right now!
 
#4,485
#4,485
vol_in_il said:
it's not ignorant at all to expect that your better after a new hire "or two" than before..

bottom line is the fanbase wants the current coach to be as good or betther than fulmer
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And he can be if he is given time. Fulmer inherited a loaded team. Kiffin and now Dooley can't say the same. Two totally different situations
 
#4,486
#4,486
Carl Pickens said:
You need to look at the differences in the roster that Fulmer inherited vs what both Kiffin and Dooley was left with. They're not even in the same ball park....neighborhood....township...county....state....etc.

GA may have been loaded but they had Ray Goof and we know what happened to him...and then Donnan as well....lots of fluff but no real susbstance. South Carolina was a joke and we all know aboutn KY and Vandy....in the west...Arky was a joke until '98...Bama wasn't all that from '95 through the early 2000's. The SEC was a two team league during Fulmer's best years and the Vols were typically #2 behind FLA.

Fulmer did an amazing job, but to say he had a more difficult task than Kiffin or Dooley is absurd.
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It's not often a class - even at Tennessee - puts seven guys in the NFL.

That's the kind of talent Lane "The Drain" had.

The route to the SECCG through the East has never been easier since the conference realignment.
 
#4,487
#4,487
BelAirVol said:
And he can be if he is given time. Fulmer inherited a loaded team. Kiffin and now Dooley can't say the same. Two totally different situations
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Kiffin had a team which put seven guys in the NFL after he left - six drafted.

What Kiffin did was take a top 10 class (not 15), and convert it into the biggest busted class in the history of college football.

That's where the problem is.

Lane "The Drain" had EVERYTHING, and he still self-destructed and took us down with him.
 
#4,488
#4,488
BelAirVol said:
Dooley was the cosummate professional. His breakdown and analysis were spot on. It's easy to see this guy is clouds above Fulmer in his knowledge of all the elements of the game.
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Fulmer is actually very, very good on TV. Even I think he is surprisingly good.

I didn't see Dooley this weekend. I hope Dooley did it to represent the Uni and not for an audition cuz he sees the writing on the wall.
 
#4,496
#4,496
utgibbs said:
60 - 15 << 152 - 52

Plus, Phil built his championship team. Coker, as we know, inherited his.
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Phil took over a program loaded with talent.
When he was fired, he left a program in very bad shape....that is the facts....
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#4,497
#4,497
utgibbs said:
It's not often a class - even at Tennessee - puts seven guys in the NFL.

That's the kind of talent Lane "The Drain" had.

The route to the SECCG through the East has never been easier since the conference realignment.
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He also had two walk ons starting on the Oline, a less than stellar kicker, a qb working on his 4th OC, not to mention the 3rd offensive system in as many years....and the list of Vols drafted isn't exactly spectacular outside of Berry...Crompton, Jaques Mclendon, Chris Scott....not exactly names that will go down in Vol history.

Now I agree with you that the East is as down now as it has been, but UT is devasted.....so does this make it easier for the current team to win the East? The answer is not only no....but hell no. If the team had the talent of former teams then it would be...

I'm not a Kiffin supporter, but the Vols don't have near the talent pool they've had in the past and while the east is down, the west is way up.
 
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