For those blaming Cheney

#27
#27
sjt18 said:
If Chaney is fired and chooses to coach again... he will have no problem finding an OC job. If Pruitt is fired... there's a good chance he will never get a HC shot again or at least not at this level.
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Well if that’s the case UT did a great favor to the world of college football by showing the world how crappy CJP is.
 
#28
#28
VOL-TIL-I-DIE said:
Well if that’s the case UT did a great favor to the world of college football by showing the world how crappy CJP is.
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The "world of college football" operates under no such delusions. Chaney has been a successful OC. Pruitt has never been a successful HC. In fact, there were more than a few muffled voices questioning the Pruitt hire from the very start.
 
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#29
#29
NATHAN05 said:
Yeah, I get what you're saying I still just dont get the hires in the sense that even after Kiffin left, we were easily one of, if not THE #1 vacancy that year. There should have been proven head coaches at other schools (possibly even SEC schools, lower tier) clamoring to be here. Why we went with Dooley outside of his dad's namesake I just.......I dont know....dont get it I guess. Even Pruitt admitted in his presser that he is too hard on the guys sometimes which indicates to me that even he realizes the guys arent responding to it and he's lost/losing them. I think there is dissension in the locker room, he's handcuffing Chaney and unfortunately unless you have a hire like a Freeze, Meyer, etc we're just spinning our wheels in the mud for another year.
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Dooley was a risk but there were reasons to hire him. He was having success building La Tech. He had the Saban connection. He had roots in GA for recruiting. Saban and others actually said he was a great talent evaluator.

I think the job was simply too big for him. I think the stress had beaten him by the end of year 2. His decision to try to convert to the 3-4 with Sunseri in year 3 without having the right players... was an incredible blunder. If he had taken over a program in better shape then maybe he doesn't become a disaster. He didn't. I think Pruitt looks similar except that he's doggedly sticking with a philosophy of play that even Saban abandoned. IMHO, if you bring a guy like Chaney in at his salary... you say, "here's the keys, score as many points as you can by any means you can.... I'm going to work with the D." He could still have the ultimate say... but my impression is that he wanted an O that protected his D rather than ringing up points... and got neither.

Others have disagreed but I tend to think there's division in the lockerroom too. I would say JG continuing to start created heartburn for some of the younger guys and especially the ones on D since they felt they were being put in a hole by his ineffectiveness. But there is seldom just one thing... and far less forgiveness when you're losing. Guys generally nitpick when things aren't going well. Then you have guys like Henry T on the roster who have never lost a lot of games... and other guys who are "used to it" either from playing at UT or bad HS programs.

IMHO, Jones was headed to where he finished regardless of what shape the program was in when he arrived. Remember his worst year was year 5... when supposedly he'd had the opportunity to recruit and develop his "own guys". The guy literally thought he was going to reinvent football in the SEC. His "development" of the OL was by design. And it would not be a stretch at all to say that Dobbs alone made the guy look more credible than he ever was. Even with a mountain of talent... you take Dobbs out then he may not have produced anything better than 6 wins in his entire tenure.
 
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#30
#30
sjt18 said:
Dooley was a risk but there were reasons to hire him. He was having success building La Tech. He had the Saban connection. He had roots in GA for recruiting. Saban and others actually said he was a great talent evaluator.

I think the job was simply too big for him. I think the stress had beaten him by the end of year 2. His decision to try to convert to the 3-4 with Sunseri in year 3 without having the right players... was an incredible blunder. If he had taken over a program in better shape then maybe he doesn't become a disaster. He didn't. I think Pruitt looks similar except that he's doggedly sticking with a philosophy of play that even Saban abandoned. IMHO, if you bring a guy like Chaney in at his salary... you say, "here's the keys, score as many points as you can by any means you can.... I'm going to work with the D." He could still have the ultimate say... but my impression is that he wanted an O that protected his D rather than ringing up points... and got neither.

Others have disagreed but I tend to think there's division in the lockerroom too. I would say JG continuing to start created heartburn for some of the younger guys and especially the ones on D since they felt they were being put in a hole by his ineffectiveness. But there is seldom just one thing... and far less forgiveness when you're losing. Guys generally nitpick when things aren't going well. Then you have guys like Henry T on the roster who have never lost a lot of games... and other guys who are "used to it" either from playing at UT or bad HS programs.

IMHO, Jones was headed to where he finished regardless of what shape the program was in when he arrived. Remember his worst year was year 5... when supposedly he'd had the opportunity to recruit and develop his "own guys". The guy literally thought he was going to reinvent football in the SEC. His "development" of the OL was by design. And it would not be a stretch at all to say that Dobbs alone made the guy look more credible than he ever was. Even with a mountain of talent... you take Dobbs out then he may not have produced anything better than 6 wins in his entire tenure.
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Agreed..........and definitely think Pruitt should let Chaney run loose and I agree with your assessment of the Dooley hire. Just wish we wouldnt have made a risky hire at that time. We had at that point, a opprotunity to be picky. Now we have fallen so far that our choices are going to be limited outside of backing a Brinks AND a Wells Fargo truck up to someones front door.
 
#31
#31
I'm just trying to figure out why we've been playing our 3rd/4th string QB as a starter all year. I blame whoever called that one.
 
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#32
#32
sjt18 said:
If Chaney is fired and chooses to coach again... he will have no problem finding an OC job. If Pruitt is fired... there's a good chance he will never get a HC shot again or at least not at this level.
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He may not want to be a head coach after getting fired here...........
 
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#33
#33
NATHAN05 said:
Agreed..........and definitely think Pruitt should let Chaney run loose and I agree with your assessment of the Dooley hire. Just wish we wouldnt have made a risky hire at that time. We had at that point, a opprotunity to be picky. Now we have fallen so far that our choices are going to be limited outside of backing a Brinks AND a Wells Fargo truck up to someones front door.
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I remember that time differently. Dooley was left virtually nothing on the LOS. There were no returning QB's on the roster. He only had one returning RB that had proven any ability at all- Poole.

I don't see a single player who registered a tackle for the 2010 team who went on to play in the NFL. The top 5 tacklers were Reviez, Lathers, Janzen Jackson, LaMarcus Thompson, and Prentiss Waggner (a safety with blinding speed... for a DT).

The roster was incredibly thin with very little upper class talent. On top of that... Kiffin left the NCAA sniffing around.

The roster Dooley had that first year is probably the worst of this 15 year ordeal.
 
#34
#34
malibuvol said:
He may not want to be a head coach after getting fired here...........
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That would demonstrate a great deal of self-awareness IMO. Some guys simply aren't cut out for the HC job... and some great coordinators realize it.
 
#35
#35
sjt18 said:
The "world of college football" operates under no such delusions. Chaney has been a successful OC. Pruitt has never been a successful HC. In fact, there were more than a few muffled voices questioning the Pruitt hire from the very start.
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Exactly what I was saying, Pruitt is the disaster we hired and he showed the world why he doesn’t need to be a head coach. Wasn’t knocking JC by any means. Meaning we did the world a favor by showing why he’s not head coach material and to avoid him at all cost....
 
#36
#36
DonDiego said:
How do you know all of these things? I read another 'insider' who said JG is actually Chaney's man--Chaney has been the one supporting him all along and Pruitt was just going along with it because Chaney's the OC. So many presumptions and guesswork. All a bunch of speculation.
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I was told by someone really close to the situation a similar thing about Pruitt and JGs relationship and it surprised me at the time. Regardless, I think we've moved on to Bailey regardless of what Chaney thinks about it.
 
#37
#37
Chaney calling out the locker room.
No dragons.
Fair well speech.
He gone.
 
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#38
#38
NATHAN05 said:
Who's Cheney?.........may be part of the problem as I thought Chaney was our OC this whole time. Not sure if we got duped kinda like when you have the little Chinese lady come up to you in New York or the like and offer you a Prada purse for the wife and you think you've scored a great deal thats going to make her happy and its actually a Prata purse?
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It’s the French spelling of his name. We have a few Parisians around.
 
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#39
#39
Can we just make Chaney the HC? He's a super likeable guy if you've heard him interviewed before. He's a very good offensive mind. We wouldn't have to pay his buyout either. Gets Pruitt's hands off both sides of the ball. Might just work.
 
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#41
#41
sjt18 said:
I remember that time differently. Dooley was left virtually nothing on the LOS. There were no returning QB's on the roster. He only had one returning RB that had proven any ability at all- Poole.

I don't see a single player who registered a tackle for the 2010 team who went on to play in the NFL. The top 5 tacklers were Reviez, Lathers, Janzen Jackson, LaMarcus Thompson, and Prentiss Waggner (a safety with blinding speed... for a DT).

The roster was incredibly thin with very little upper class talent. On top of that... Kiffin left the NCAA sniffing around.

The roster Dooley had that first year is probably the worst of this 15 year ordeal.
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No, I meant I'm irritated that they hired Dooley at all. We were still pretty reputable at the time and coulda had a pretty good pick of coaches to choose from. I agree......roster wasn't that great.
 
#42
#42
I blame the offensive coordinator if the offense is bad. If the head coach asks for a little more clock usage (or whatever) I expect him to be able to handle that. I expect him to fix the oline or the qb if they are underperforming because that’s part of the offense. That might be asking a lot but if he can’t do that then he isn’t earning his 1.whatever million dollars.
 
#43
#43
1vol8 said:
I’ve seen opinions blasted all over VN about the play calling this year. From “He doesn’t know what a slant is” to “ Run, run, pass on third and long”.
I agree the play calling has been terrible but put yourself in his shoes.
. You know said qb is limited and has never been good throwing to the middle of the field or beyond 10 yards. What do you do? Well...... you build your plan around what he does well. You keep most routes within 10 yards and outside the hash’s. You can’t throw many passes that way because you can’t use the middle of the field at any level which eliminates slants, digs, posts or anything “in” breaking. You can’t call outside breaking routes beyond 10 yards which eliminates flag routes and deep outs. On top of all the above you still have that same defensive coordinator micromanaging your every move that absolutely DESPISES turn overs. All the above is a recipe for “run, ,run, pass” and failure.

Now before you go thinking THIS year has been a carbon copy of last and the game has passed him by, take some time and rewatch last years games. You may find that you’re just jaded from what’s fresh in your mind.

In 2019 He tried to open up the playbook vs GAST and JG stunk it up. He tried again vs BYU and JG stunk it up. At that point I think he learned/confirmed what JG is and what he could/couldn’t do which is listed in the first paragraph. But Pruitt, being as stubborn as he is refused to make a change. He went conservative against UF as a result and has stayed that way with JG every since.

However, here’s the proof that CHANEY is not the problem. Once a change was finally made, all of a sudden slants were a huge part of the game plans. Deep routes became a norm and chunk plays became common. Maurer threw slants, outs, seems and gos on a regular basis. He used all three levels as well. Suddenly Chaney’s game plans went from a conservative run based attack to a wide open pass based attack.

I think emotions of what we see this year has interfered with what we know to be true if you only think back or rewatch. Chaney WILL adjust to his qbs strengths. He’s proven it. He’s just limited by what his boss is forcing him to do.
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and how do you know Pruitt is telling him who will play QB--do you know Chaney has a different view but CJP won't let him use the QB of his choice?
 
#44
#44
Who's this Cheney? I know our OC is Chaney, but didn't realize there was a Cheney involved..
 
#47
#47
NATHAN05 said:
No, I meant I'm irritated that they hired Dooley at all. We were still pretty reputable at the time and coulda had a pretty good pick of coaches to choose from. I agree......roster wasn't that great.
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Yeah. I get your point. I'm just don't remember anyone lined up to take over that roster knowing the expectations.

Money always comes into it but the top guys are smart enough to know that even a big contract can hurt them in the long run if they fail to turn things around. They calculate their chances of winning into their decisions. Guys like Dooley are willing to take a shot since they have an opportunity to "jump ahead" of where their careers actually are. You could say the same of Jones.

Pruitt is different. There are some reasonably successful guys who made the jump from coordinator at a top tier program to HC. Jimbo Fisher comes to mind.
 
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