For everyone who just loves to only blame coaches for everything

#52
#52
BigOrangeTrain said:
Sorry hogg but Sharpe's comment>yours. You are not a HOF NFL player. You dont have multiple SB rings. SS knows more about football then everyone on this board combined. He realizes its the ultimate team game. You dont. Hence why his facts trump your opinion.
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This isn’t a one size fits all issue, not every scenario is the same. Also, maintaining that Sharpe is 100% correct because of his experience in the NFL doesn’t seem like a winning argument. Otherwise every former NFL player is right whenever they talk about football. And you can’t disagree.
 
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#53
#53
Rockytoptalker said:
This isn’t a one size fits all issue, not every scenario is the same. Also, maintaining that Sharpe is 100% correct because of his experience in the NFL doesn’t seem like a winning argument. Otherwise every former NFL player is right whenever they talk about football. And you can’t disagree.
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Maybe but SS isnt just some football player. He is a HOFer that has spent the better part of almost 30 years in football. You could consider him an expert. And on this issue he is right. There are things in football that just cannot be coached. Regardless of how good a coach is, he cannot make someone play up to their potential. A player has to want to. Tyler Bray is a perfect example. The guy had superior arm talent. He went to the Chiefs under Andy Reid. A man that is one of the most talented offensive minds the NFL has ever seen. Bray couldnt get it together. Now was that Reids fault? He shares some blame but most of us know that Bray didnt have the right attitude. Thats on him personally.

Personal accountability is real. We have seen players under Bill Belicheck not cut it. He is one of the GOATS of coaching. But even he cannot force a player to play up to his potential. At some point a person has to have the want, desire and drive to succeed. Hence, placing all the blame on coaching is weak.
 
#54
#54
Being a head coach at the college level is like running a business. When a business fails, throwing the blame at the feet of a summer intern isn't going to solve the problem. Problems of that magnitude start at the top.

Note: I'm not advocating for Pruitt's firing because I don't think it's even a worthy discussion this season due to the pandemic. He does, however, need to make a couple of staff changes on the offensive side of the ball in addition to going different direction at QB. Only he can do those two things.
 
#55
#55
BigOrangeTrain said:
Maybe but SS isnt just some football player. He is a HOFer that has spent the better part of almost 30 years in football. You could consider him an expert. And on this issue he is right. There are things in football that just cannot be coached. Regardless of how good a coach is, he cannot make someone play up to their potential. A player has to want to. Tyler Bray is a perfect example. The guy had superior arm talent. He went to the Chiefs under Andy Reid. A man that is one of the most talented offensive minds the NFL has ever seen. Bray couldnt get it together. Now was that Reids fault? He shares some blame but most of us know that Bray didnt have the right attitude. Thats on him personally.

Personal accountability is real. We have seen players under Bill Belicheck not cut it. He is one of the GOATS of coaching. But even he cannot force a player to play up to his potential. At some point a person has to have the want, desire and drive to succeed. Hence, placing all the blame on coaching is weak.
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I understand all of that and they are very valid points. The issue, at least in my opinion, is that CJP is unwilling to change. JG did well in some instances last year coming off the bench, but the writing is on the wall. Like most fans, I don’t understand why Pruitt isn’t willing to at least attempt to work through his biggest hinderance. This is the closest thing we’ll ever have to a throwaway season, it seems reasonable to use it to get the QB of the future (Whether it be HB or someone else) actual game experience.

We’re just fans looking in from the outside as you and others have pointed out, but Pruitt’s failure to address our team’s most glaring issue is what many of us don’t understand.
 
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#56
#56
BigOrangeTrain said:
Maybe but SS isnt just some football player. He is a HOFer that has spent the better part of almost 30 years in football. You could consider him an expert. And on this issue he is right. There are things in football that just cannot be coached. Regardless of how good a coach is, he cannot make someone play up to their potential. A player has to want to. Tyler Bray is a perfect example. The guy had superior arm talent. He went to the Chiefs under Andy Reid. A man that is one of the most talented offensive minds the NFL has ever seen. Bray couldnt get it together. Now was that Reids fault? He shares some blame but most of us know that Bray didnt have the right attitude. Thats on him personally.

Personal accountability is real. We have seen players under Bill Belicheck not cut it. He is one of the GOATS of coaching. But even he cannot force a player to play up to his potential. At some point a person has to have the want, desire and drive to succeed. Hence, placing all the blame on coaching is weak.
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Bill Belicheck addresses the problems, though. If a player or assistant coach isn't cutting it, that player / coach doesn't continue to see the field. He doesn't keep doing the same thing over and over expecting that the result will eventually improve. One could argue that JP isn't recognizing and correcting the flaws.
 
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#57
#57
m1al said:
Well duh, obviously. That doesn't mean the managing of a major college football program is easy or everyone would be doing it...

Ridiculous analogy, by the way...
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Your comment was ridiculous also, Jeremy. That’s why I made the statement. Maybe you should start by taking basic hiring and interview skills 101. How in the hell do you hire someone and “realize immediately it was a bad hire”?
 
#58
#58
calban said:
Peterman ran into some bad luck but had a record setting career at Pitt. Getting a second chance in the NFL with Gruden after his Bills debacle. Had a couple of others who transferred out and did well because of Dobbs the rubber man 's durabiity.
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Peterman sucked when he was here. Using him as an example has a better chance of disproving your point and showing jones sucked at QB development. As far as the "couple of others", again they never saw the field here to prove your point.
 
#60
#60
wmcovol said:
Your comment was ridiculous also, Jeremy. That’s why I made the statement. Maybe you should start by taking basic hiring and interview skills 101. How in the hell do you hire someone and “realize immediately it was a bad hire”?
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Forgive me, but WTF are you even talking about here Forrest?.... Exactly what part(s) of my two very brief comments was/were inaccurate?
 
#61
#61
photovol said:
Telling the truth in the coaching game can get you in trouble in a hurry
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Players not executing the coach’s brilliant game plan still falls on the responsibility of the coach. That’s part of coaching, getting the players to execute when the lights come on.
 
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#62
#62
m1al said:
Forgive me, but WTF are you even talking about here Forrest?.... Exactly what part(s) of my two very brief comments was/were inaccurate?
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You took the brain surgery comment way too serious. Just like a coach tries to talk down to people with their “21 Formation” and “Star” positions BS. Motivating people, being accountable and hiring good people happen every day in numerous businesses in Tennessee. It’s a rarity in the UTAD. That’s the problem. We have Forrest as head coach.
 
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#63
#63
The Original Fade said:
Players not executing the coach’s brilliant game plan still falls on the responsibility of the coach. That’s part of coaching, getting the players to execute when the lights come on.
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As an old athlete..... it’s on the players.......
Just ask them....... I’ve never see a good player that blamed the coach for his performance on the field
 
#64
#64
Video wouldn't play. But you're right, coaches aren't blocking on the OL, RB aren't falling forward and QB isn't converting on 3rd down. As coaches you take it for a game or few, maybe across a season or two. I get it. When it's year damn 3, and you still cant get past the 50 on your big rivals......time to step up. At that point you're becoming the most common denominator. Time to evolve.

Not the same, but I've been in a similar situation in the past. That is the standard approach yielded mediocre results. Wiped the slate clean, rethought all aspects, discounted past practices ...... got outside the box so to speak. Not everything worked but in the end I worked half as much and got twice as much done. Half the stress too. I know it worked as I had two former bosses as me, years later, how I did it. I evolved. Granted I had the environment I was allowed to do it in, but there is enough you should be able to control to make change. If not, don't take the job.
 
#65
#65
BigOrangeTrain said:
Sorry hogg but Sharpe's comment>yours. You are not a HOF NFL player. You dont have multiple SB rings. SS knows more about football then everyone on this board combined. He realizes its the ultimate team game. You dont. Hence why his facts trump your opinion.
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The old “they are and expert, so you shut up” mindset. Thats like someone getting a bullsh*t degree and acting like he’s superior to “non educated” people. The funny part about it is most of the time the “educated” person in this example is usually way further behind the guy with real world experience. The knowledge, thats essentially mimicking the professors that never worked in the real world as well, usually doesn’t hold up. But who am I, I mean shutting up and listening to people who are superior to others hasn’t failed before.
 
#66
#66
wmcovol said:
You took the brain surgery comment way too serious. Just like a coach tries to talk down to people with their “21 Formation” and “Star” positions BS. Motivating people, being accountable and hiring good people happen every day in numerous businesses in Tennessee. It’s a rarity in the UTAD. That’s the problem. We have Forrest as head coach.
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I agree for the most part and I'm definitely not happy with the product but I'm going to cut Pruitt a tiny bit of slack this year. Can't blame everything on this covid BS, but I think it threw a big wrench in the works for UT football..
 
#69
#69
BigOrangeTrain said:
He absolutely deserves blame. But blame has to go to the other QBs for not looking deep inside themselves and pushing themselves to separate and supplant JG.
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So if he was a backetball coach and chose to play a midget against shaq in the post, while not allowing the 7 footer on the bench to practice...its the player fault????

Problem is JG isnt able to perform at a high level, has shown so for 3 years. Even a blind squirril finds a nut every now and then.....he has proven inconsistent, weak,will and lacking leadership....but instead of investing time while that shitshow was happening in another QB. He devoted all his time into JG...that is on the coach...its JG fault he cant processed plays quickly, throw on time, or play at an SEC level...its the coaches fault for putting him in the position to fail.....
 
#70
#70
VFL-82-JP said:
I've been in situations, leadership situations, where there was no winning formula. All I could do was minimize the negative. Fighting for a neutral result. The absolute best possible outcome. If I'd served 26 years in the Hollywood version of the military, there would have been some magical formula each time things got desperate, some one-in-a-thousand miracle finish. But I didn't work for Hollywood, didn't have their scriptwriters.

I only mention this because some folks with no experience in a particular field, whether the military or professional / college sports, may be forgiven for thinking there's "always a way if you are good enough and work hard enough." That's their education via the movie theater. And that's a bad education. Sometimes there's just no good option.

And yes, bad or neutral outcomes are always on the leader. Buck stops here. Command responsibility. Lonely at the top. All true.

And yet, if you really want to understand what happened, you're going to have to push beyond that simplistic view, and see which specific parts failed, and in what ways.

I assure you, on a team of 100 lads with 11 coaches, when something fails, it will be because there are multiple specific points of failure. One bad piece, even if it's the key piece (head coach, QB, whatever you pick as the key) even the key piece can not alone cause a meltdown of the sort we saw in 2nd half of the UGa game or throughout the Kentucky match. That kind of outcome is invariably the result of multiple points of failure.

I personally believe it started--both weeks, both games--in three or four places: quarterback, offensive line (including TEs and RBs when given blocking/protection roles), and offensive coordinator. Perhaps receivers as well. Could be four places. Which came first? Or did they all fail more or less simultaneously? Impossible for us outsiders to know. But almost for sure, all three or four of those elements broke down at roughly the same time, both weeks. And then, like a house of cards, the rest came apart, ultimately even the defense (which is the strongest part of the team). Even the defense failed toward the end. Lads were giving up. Even on the defense.

So is all that on the head coach? Maybe. Certainly, he has command responsibility, but maybe it is actually something he directly did or failed to do. Then again, maybe not. We outsiders can't know for sure.

Absolutely, the responsibility for fixing whatever failed (every part of whatever failed, however many parts there are) that responsibility rests with the head coach. He drives the leadership team, the other coaches, to get fixes going. He has to have the vision to show them a new and better destination.

But it might be true that, at the point of failure, Jeremy Pruitt simply didn't have any winning hand to play. He may have been stuck, at that point.

*shrug* We are outsiders, looking in. Yes, we're all Volunteers, loyal fans, but we're still outside the day-to-day of the team. We have no idea what happens 164 of the 168 hours in each week. We don't know hardly anything. Almost nothing. We can only see outcomes, on the field, for a few hours. And then it goes dark again on us.

So I"m gonna hope Jeremy's the right head coach to figure this out and find a good path forward, toward the kind of football he and we want Tennessee to play. I'm gonna hope he has assistant coaches who are able to be part of forging that path. I'm gonna hope he has mostly the right players to take that path.

There's nothing else I can do. Just gotta hope for the best. And give them support as they try.

Go Vols!
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You’re wrong and anyone that’s been on the battlefield with a weak leader will tell you you’re wrong. The leader can screw the pooch for the entire squad. In combat an idiot for a leader can get nearly the entire squad killed. In Vietnam there were plenty of young, hardheaded, and arrogant LT’s that didn’t make it back to base camp because their ignorance and ego nearly got the entire squad killed. When I served this great nation many moons ago the one thing I hated most was a young, hardheaded, and arrogant LT. They have no experience in what they’ve put in charge of but they were already know it alls.
 
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