For all you screaming our program is gone for good........

#26
#26
Takes time to build a championship team. In a few years Alabama or Florida will be in a low spot and their fans will be going through the same trials we are right now. These cycles happens, it's the wheel of sports. Sometimes we are pushed into the mud, sometimes we are raised to the sky, we've just got to wait it out
 
#27
#27
marevul mafia said:
Who said the program was gone for good? I haven't seen that on VN, yet.
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I searched on VN for the thread that got me started on my rant but never could find it. Don't know if it's gone or what. I read the opening sentence and pretty much stopped. It started by saying we needed to face the fact that TN football would never be a force again. We had a good run years ago and now it is over. I have also read other people on here over the last couple years stating that we will never be able to get the 5 star players like we once did because we have teams like USC, FL, VT (very close and better than us these days), etc........... that are more attractive to kids. Then after hiring Coach D I hear some saying he is a young Fulmer and boring which is not attractive to prospective HS players. Not saying it is a large group of people that think like this. We are TN and TN's football program is historic. A historic program doesn't die easily either. Just wished some of these people could use common sense and see what we are going through is not that rare. We have been here before and built back up. There was a time I didn't think we could ever beat Bama then we ripped off a decade of dominance. There was a time I didn't worry about playing FL and then they dominate us for many years. There was a time when we got beat by Arkansas and SC and said it was horrible. Now those 2 teams should beat us. Sports are unpredictable to say the least.
 
#28
#28
nickknx865 said:
I agree with the point, but using wins and losses from the 1900's?

And actually, the 1900's were the first time Tennessee ever appeared in a poll. They were ranked 19th in the 1903 final poll by the New York Sun.

Sorry for the random fact. Just thought it'd be a good time to use it.
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maybe UT can claim a natoinl title like bama does anytime they finish that high!!!!!!!!!!!:)
 
#30
#30
The program isn't gone for good. It's return to prominence has merely been sidetracked by an AD incapable of hiring a proven coach.

It will begin its return when a proven coach is paid enough to make that happen.

Fewer toilets, more wins. That has to be the new UT moto for the AD hiring process that should ensue.
 
#32
#32
we can put up and pull out all of the stats in the world and none of them will make me feel better about sucking.
 
#33
#33
Pooods said:
Please realize that every program has ups and downs. We are down right now but it's nothing new. Some of you are positive that TN football will never rise again. You are wrong!!!! Here's some numbers:

1900-1911: only won .425% of our games
That's 12 long years of losing!

1958-1964: only won .457% of our games
That's 7 long years of losing!

1973-1982: only won .542% of our games
That's 10 long years of losing! I was here to witness it and it sucked!

On the flip side......

1926-1934: winning .864% of the games
That's 9 years of whipping ass!!

1938-1946: winning .787% of the games
That's 9 years of doing it again!!

1993-1999: winning .835% of the games
Most of us here at VN were blessed with this streak to enjoy!!!

Lately.............

2002-2009: won .621% of the time which is not nearly as bad as the first steaks I posted
2005-2009: only won .563% of the time
This is the start of a horrible stretch that is not over yet. If history means anything it will last a few more years. We have been through worse stretches than this in the past.

See a trend?? Up and down we go. We were on top looking down just a little over a decade ago. Now we look up from the basement. The end is not here!!!!!!! We will dominate again, and when we do please don't take it for granted like many of us did in the 90's!! We griped about losing 2 games per year back then and only being in the top 10 instead of the top 5 most of the time! How stupid that looks now from this point of view!!!!!

GO VOLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Right and wrong. There is no natural "winning cycle." Bad choices and management lead to downfalls. Once your program gets down, it takes even better effort, leadership, and decision-making to rise again. The idea that history repeats itself naturally is a fallacy that has been around since the ancient Greeks. Things happen for logical reasons with logical causes and effects.

I wonder if Tulane, Minnesota, Syracuse, UCLA, Kentucky, Ole Miss, SMU, Baylor, Rice, Army, and Navy would agree with your assessment. All of these programs were--at one time or another-- at or near the top of the College Football world. That being said, we have the will, the resources, and the fan-base to be a top ten program. So I do believe we will rise again--but not automatically, just because we have been a big-time program in the past, by any means
 
#34
#34
WesternKyVol said:
Right and wrong. There is no natural "winning cycle." Bad choices and management lead to downfalls. Once your program gets down, it takes even better effort, leadership, and decision-making to rise again. The idea that history repeats itself naturally is a fallacy that has been around since the ancient Greeks. Things happen for logical reasons with logical causes and effects.

I wonder if Tulane, Minnesota, Syracuse, UCLA, Kentucky, Ole Miss, SMU, Baylor, Rice, Army, and Navy would agree with your assessment. All of these programs were--at one time or another-- at or near the top of the College Football world. That being said, we have the will, the resources, and the fan-base to be a top ten program. So I do believe we will rise again--but not automatically, just because we have been a big-time program in the past, by any means
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Did I ever say it was natural? No I didn't. I also understand logic very well. I realize there were reasons for all those streaks including the winning ones. I'm just saying TN football has always been up and down like any other sports team (for some reason or another LOL). We are down right now and some people are getting the rope attached to hang themselves! No need to panic people!!!! We rebuilt every other time this happened and we will do it again.:good!:
 
#37
#37
program is not gone for good, just for a decade or so. well atleast my bears are 2-0 and my reds are heading to the playoffs.
 
#38
#38
WesternKyVol said:
Right and wrong. There is no natural "winning cycle." Bad choices and management lead to downfalls. Once your program gets down, it takes even better effort, leadership, and decision-making to rise again. The idea that history repeats itself naturally is a fallacy that has been around since the ancient Greeks. Things happen for logical reasons with logical causes and effects.

I wonder if Tulane, Minnesota, Syracuse, UCLA, Kentucky, Ole Miss, SMU, Baylor, Rice, Army, and Navy would agree with your assessment. All of these programs were--at one time or another-- at or near the top of the College Football world. That being said, we have the will, the resources, and the fan-base to be a top ten program. So I do believe we will rise again--but not automatically, just because we have been a big-time program in the past, by any means
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That's true, but the college football environment is much more stable in this day and age. UCLA and SMU were the only ones to remain powerful after the 1950s. UCLA didn't last much longer and SMU's demise was something different altogether, though they were a flash in the pan to begin with (like Colorado and Kansas State in the 1990s).

The key is resources. The programs that have the most have the biggest advantage. Doesn't Tennessee have the biggest football budget in the country?
 
#40
#40
Nerwen Aldarion said:
Takes time to build a championship team. In a few years Alabama or Florida will be in a low spot and their fans will be going through the same trials we are right now. These cycles happens, it's the wheel of sports. Sometimes we are pushed into the mud, sometimes we are raised to the sky, we've just got to wait it out
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Good Lord, Phil got his recorder out again.
 
#41
#41
WesternKyVol said:
Right and wrong. There is no natural "winning cycle." Bad choices and management lead to downfalls. Once your program gets down, it takes even better effort, leadership, and decision-making to rise again. The idea that history repeats itself naturally is a fallacy that has been around since the ancient Greeks. Things happen for logical reasons with logical causes and effects.

I wonder if Tulane, Minnesota, Syracuse, UCLA, Kentucky, Ole Miss, SMU, Baylor, Rice, Army, and Navy would agree with your assessment. All of these programs were--at one time or another-- at or near the top of the College Football world. That being said, we have the will, the resources, and the fan-base to be a top ten program. So I do believe we will rise again--but not automatically, just because we have been a big-time program in the past, by any means
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The flaw in your analysis is that "resources and fan-base" dictate whether a program is a consistent top-10 program. Access to local talent and having the best collegiate football brand in that area are the two-fold keys to consistent top-10 status, not fans and resources.
As is, we don't have much of an edge in fan-base or resources anymore, anyway.
 
#42
#42
VegasVol said:
The flaw in your analysis is that "resources and fan-base" dictate whether a program is a consistent top-10 program. Access to local talent and having the best collegiate football brand in that area are the two-fold keys to consistent top-10 status, not fans and resources.
As is, we don't have much of an edge in fan-base or resources anymore, anyway.
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Oh goodness. We have to try a little harder to bring elite talent to Knoxville. Let's just give up and hire a jolly nice guy who bleeds orange.
 
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#43
#43
VegasVol said:
The flaw in your analysis is that "resources and fan-base" dictate whether a program is a consistent top-10 program. Access to local talent and having the best collegiate football brand in that area are the two-fold keys to consistent top-10 status, not fans and resources.
As is, we don't have much of an edge in fan-base or resources anymore, anyway.
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USC was out of the national spotlight for most of the 90s.
Oklahoma was horrendous after the santions were levied in the mid-90s.
Texas wasn't the Texas you know today when the were under the guidance of David McWilliams and John Mackovic.
Notre Dame's been horrid since Lou Holtz roamed the sidelines.
LSU was in the gutter before Saban arrived.
Syracuse once had guys like McNabb and Harrison and Freeney.

Stuff's cyclical. Tennessee will be back.

In-state talent argument is crap used to excuse subpar recruiting efforts.
 
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#44
#44
I've gotten a little less greedy in the past couple of years. Remember those 2 loss years and if one of them was florida, stick a fork init ma, were done. We were living the high times every year a potential NCS. We played collectively well I thought against the gators. given our experience. I really liked that dooley was not OK, just not to be blown out, bumps in the road ahead, but probably will still be a good ride. GBO!
 
#45
#45
fla said:
I've gotten a little less greedy in the past couple of years. Remember those 2 loss years and if one of them was florida, stick a fork init ma, were done. We were living the high times every year a potential NCS. We played collectively well I thought against the gators. given our experience. I really liked that dooley was not OK, just not to be blown out, bumps in the road ahead, but probably will still be a good ride. GBO!
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Yep, the evening after FL beat us each year in the 90's I would be physically sick. Same thing went for Bama. That 1990 TN/AL game that was 9 to 6 destroyed me for days.:banghead2: Since then I have lightened up. Last years AL/TN game hurt me much worse than I thought it would but I made it through it. One good thing about this streak is it got rid of many of the bandwagon riders. I don't see many T's or flags on cars these days. Probably see as many Gator and Bama tags on cars locally as I do T's. Don't care if they win 1 game for the next 10 years, I will wear my orange!!!! We will be back on day. It might take years but I can't wait till I gripe about losing 2 games again or finishing in the top 10 and not the top 5. LOL
 
#46
#46
From an outside view. Anyone that thinks you guys will be down for good is an idiot. You will be back to your rightful place at the top of the East.

College football does run in cycles. True some of it is bad decisions, but also other teams catch on to what you are doing and they make adjustments. I feel as if Fulmer was a good coach, but when others caught up to him he really didn't have a plan B.

You guys are not the only ones who have faced this situation as has been pointed out. Hell you seen how bad we sucked until we got Saban. You guys owned us for several years. And when he leaves we will no doubt go through another down time. Look at Nebraska, Michigan, Notre Dame, Miami, and Penn State. All traditional powerhouses who have had down years and some are starting to make there way back up.

Dooley is the right man for the job. He is bringing discipline back to you when you sorely needed it. I haven't had a chance to see him recruit yet, but if he can hold his own there you will be fine within the next 2-3 years. Just hang in there.
 
#47
#47
UTRavens said:
Alabama

1997: 4-7
1998: 7-5
1999: 10-3
2000: 3-8
2001: 7-5
2002: 10-3
2003: 4-9
2004: 6-6
2005: 10-2
2006: 6-7
2007: 7-6

Auburn

1975: 3-6-2
1976: 3-8
1977: 5-6
1978: 6-4-1
1979: 8-3
1980: 5-6
1981: 5-6

Florida

1986: 6-5
1987: 6-6
1988: 7-5
1989: 7-5

Georgia

1993: 5-6
1994: 6-4-1
1995: 6-6
1996: 5-6

LSU

1989: 4-7
1990: 5-6
1991: 5-6
1992: 2-9
1993: 5-6
1994: 4-7
1995: 7-4-1
1996: 10-2
1997: 9-3
1998: 4-7
1999: 3-8



I just post this when a thread like this comes up.
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Just want to point out that UF was in the middle of a soul-crushing NCAA penalty during that period.

The record list is entirely valid, but it's not apples to apples, as UF was 20 scholarships down during that period. Bama's losing records are from sanction periods as well, but they never had close to the level of sanction UF received.

You can make fun of UF for a bad run, but I was proud of our guys for doing as well as they did, all things considered.

I think there is actually more validity in picking on the Zook years, because, even though his records were somewhat better, he had the full complement of schollys to work with, and didn't do diddly with them.
 
#48
#48
I don't believe he was making fun of the Gators, or any of the other teams. We've all had ups and downs. Florida wasn't really much more than a middle of the road program until Spurrier came in. We had good and bad years, but nothing consistent until the 90's. Living in Maryville, this is the 1st year I'm actually cheering for TN.
 
#49
#49
WesternKyVol said:
Right and wrong. There is no natural "winning cycle." Bad choices and management lead to downfalls. Once your program gets down, it takes even better effort, leadership, and decision-making to rise again. The idea that history repeats itself naturally is a fallacy that has been around since the ancient Greeks. Things happen for logical reasons with logical causes and effects.

I wonder if Tulane, Minnesota, Syracuse, UCLA, Kentucky, Ole Miss, SMU, Baylor, Rice, Army, and Navy would agree with your assessment. All of these programs were--at one time or another-- at or near the top of the College Football world. That being said, we have the will, the resources, and the fan-base to be a top ten program. So I do believe we will rise again--but not automatically, just because we have been a big-time program in the past, by any means
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This^^^. People can imagine that UT will simply re-emerge as an SEC and national power because of some ridiculous cycle all they want....but it won't cause it to occur. The only possible way Tennessee will avoid evolving into the Ole Miss of this generation will be to clean house, spend whatever it takes to put the best HC available in charge of the program, and provide him with whatever resources and support he demands. Period. To propose any other scenario, other than hoping the Dooley experiment works, is nothing more than make-believe.
 
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