(ESPN) Harris expected to stay in draft; Hopson a mystery

#27
#27
hatvol96 said:
8 more minutes, a shot clock that's 11 seconds shorter, the 360 best players in the world versus a game littered with the Dane Bradshaws and Sylar McBees of the world. Yeah, I can't figure where those extra points come from.

Also, compare the top offensive teams in college football average points per game versus the highest scoring teams in the NFL. It's never close.
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The NBA also shoots two shots for every foul over five and players like Dwight Howard aren't allowed to just chill under the rim and contest every shot. Having to play man defense creates lots of difficult defensive match-ups.
 
#28
#28
hatvol96 said:
8 more minutes, a shot clock that's 11 seconds shorter, the 360 best players in the world versus a game littered with the Dane Bradshaws and Sylar McBees of the world. Yeah, I can't figure where those extra points come from.

Also, compare the top offensive teams in college football average points per game versus the highest scoring teams in the NFL. It's never close.
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Prolific shooting and the spacing caused by the 3 point line are probably factors as well.
 
#30
#30
hatvol96 said:
8 more minutes, a shot clock that's 11 seconds shorter, the 360 best players in the world versus a game littered with the Dane Bradshaws and Sylar McBees of the world. Yeah, I can't figure where those extra points come from.

Also, compare the top offensive teams in college football average points per game versus the highest scoring teams in the NFL. It's never close.
Click to expand...

Agreed, agreed. I would say the shot clock has more to do with it than anything...I understand the players are better, but that should translate to both sides of the ball.

As for comparing college to pro football, so the scoring actually decreases as it goes to the pro ranks...

I was wrong on, "no one plays defense in the nba". I should have clarified.
 
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#31
#31
The don't call it the defensive end of the floor for nothing. Now whether a kid like Harris is equipped (strong or quick enough) to step right in and slow down big time NBA players, that's another issue.
 
#32
#32
Harris is not ready to step in and be a starter in the NBA. His talent and upside says he is ready to be developed in the league. If he is projected under the 20th pick he has to go - he would be risking too much to stay.

I have watched some really good defense in the playoffs this year. Not just man - some match-up and help type zone as well. There are a few teams and a number of players that play the matador defense - but the better ones really work on the defensive end. For the most part the NBA players are more mature and don't get hung up on being toasted on one possession. They forget it and move on. College kids tend to give up more quickly - like the Hopson's of the world.
 
#33
#33
Yes for defense in playoffs. Not a lot during the regular season, except for crunch time and rivalry games. They can't d up hard the whole year. Their bodies wouldn't hold up.
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#34
#34
Domestic Silence said:
Agreed, agreed. I would say the shot clock has more to do with it than anything...I understand the players are better, but that should translate to both sides of the ball.

As for comparing college to pro football, so the scoring actually decreases as it goes to the pro ranks...

I was wrong on, "no one plays defense in the nba". I should have clarified.
Click to expand...

Did we actually just have a civil argument on here with a resolution? I'm impressed, gentlemen.

A quick look at the stats shows college teams average ~68 ppg, while NBA teams average ~99 ppg--a 45% increase. I agree with hat, though, that several factors more than make up for this difference. The game is 20% longer, the shot clock is 31% shorter, and the offensive skill in the nba is simply unreal. There are still plenty of posts that can clang an open jump shot, but the majority of guys can really shoot.

I'm not a huge NBA fan, but I've also tried to dispel the myth of "no defense in the nba" with friends. Even more ridiculous are the ones that argue it while holding up the 70's and 80's as the golden age of NBA basketball--when the defense was much, much worse.

My theory is that most casual sports fans are more into hero worship than the games themselves. They haven't embraced the current stars like they did Jordan, Magic, Larry, etc. They use the 'no defense' argument when they haven't watched much nba in a long time. Even though the NBA season seems way too long, the playoffs are usually very entertaining. These guys play incredibly tough, physical defense for sure.
 
#35
#35
Vols4us said:
Harris is not ready to step in and be a starter in the NBA. His talent and upside says he is ready to be developed in the league. If he is projected under the 20th pick he has to go - he would be risking too much to stay.

I have watched some really good defense in the playoffs this year. Not just man - some match-up and help type zone as well. There are a few teams and a number of players that play the matador defense - but the better ones really work on the defensive end. For the most part the NBA players are more mature and don't get hung up on being toasted on one possession. They forget it and move on. College kids tend to give up more quickly - like the Hopson's of the world.
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Other sources are predicting #14 to the Rockets.
Okay, it's bleacherreport but still.
I think he's gone.
 
#36
#36
hallowed_hill said:
Did we actually just have a civil argument on here with a resolution? I'm impressed, gentlemen.

A quick look at the stats shows college teams average ~68 ppg, while NBA teams average ~99 ppg--a 45% increase. I agree with hat, though, that several factors more than make up for this difference. The game is 20% longer, the shot clock is 31% shorter, and the offensive skill in the nba is simply unreal. There are still plenty of posts that can clang an open jump shot, but the majority of guys can really shoot.

I'm not a huge NBA fan, but I've also tried to dispel the myth of "no defense in the nba" with friends. Even more ridiculous are the ones that argue it while holding up the 70's and 80's as the golden age of NBA basketball--when the defense was much, much worse.

My theory is that most casual sports fans are more into hero worship than the games themselves. They haven't embraced the current stars like they did Jordan
, Magic, Larry, etc. They use the 'no defense' argument when they haven't watched much nba in a long time. Even though the NBA season seems way too long, the playoffs are usually very entertaining. These guys play incredibly tough, physical defense for sure.[/
QUOTE]

I lost interest when shaq was the top dog. I just couldnt stand the one on one game. Pass it to shaq, watch him back his man down, everyone foul him, then watch him clank to FTs. Just not as much team oriented in my opinion.
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#37
#37
MikeHamiltonFan said:
Hopson going makes the 1 year Wood presence more likely.

Wood, McRae. That could be some very strong scoring.

Golden
Wood
McRae
Woolridge
Hall.

A lean and long team. Would look a good bit like the Michigan team that just destroyed us.
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Except they had several good shooters on that team. I'm not seeing it in your list above (unsure on Wood); unless of course there is a lot of improvement in the offseason.


GBO!!!!
 
#39
#39
Neither will be back to school next year. As I said a few days ago this is almost certain now. I actually had a little hope for Harris to come back but things have changed for him. The 2012 recruiting class is going to be a huge factor for Martin's success at UT.
 
#40
#40
Harris has a pro game, a big that can handle the ball, pass the ball, decent on the boards and an ever developing jumper.

He will make a good pro, will have an adjustment period but with as hard as he works he shouldn't have to wait too long.

As for Hopson, he will be lucky to maintain a roster spot.

Seems destin for the NBDL or overseas.
 
#42
#42
Domestic Silence said:
I've seen far worse players in the nba this season than Tobias. Let's be honest, there isn't much D played up there anyways.
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Maybe on the team you follow. The team I follow actually plays Defense.
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#43
#43
I don't trust ESPN but Jon G from Draft Express just tweeted this:
Next player that will likely announce he's staying in the draft -- Tobias Harris. Getting strong feedback from teams.

Jon knows his stuff. Bye Tobias.
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#44
#44
Tobias should stay one more year...he should see what happened to Michael Beasley...similar game, same size...
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#46
#46
Still say Harris is 50/50 and Hopson is gone unless something has changed within the past week.
 
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#47
#47
I don't think hopson is ready by any means, but I think tobias has an opportunity he can't pass up. with some good workouts, he might sneak into the top 10. I wish him all the best.
 
#48
#48
LazhilUT said:
I don't trust ESPN but Jon G from Draft Express just tweeted this:
Next player that will likely announce he's staying in the draft -- Tobias Harris. Getting strong feedback from teams.

Jon knows his stuff. Bye Tobias.
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Later Tobias.
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