Doomsday Fans

#51
#51
zach0105 said:
1) 5-15 in the NFL. Been called a flat out liar on national tv, granted it was Al Davis but he was right. Sure he came in and got our program some attention, but at what cost? The possibility of an NCAA investigation.

Sure I was excited about the hire when Kiff got here. But knowing what I know now, I'm ecstatic that he's gone and that we have a respectable coach.

2) Taken an awful NCAA program and got them to a bowl game in the first time in 7 seasons. Got said program the most attention, the right way not the Kiff way, that I can remember in my lifetime(which isn't that long but...). Came here and saved a class that could have possibly bottomed out and been a sub top 25 class after your hero fu*ked us.

And yes he fu*ked us, there's no way getting around it no matter how good the job he took was.

I know why your not excited about the program this year. You don't have someone in your face, on the media every day telling you how good we are gonna be this year and then going slightly above .500

We will see this year how it goes, and if it goes the way I'm figuring it to go and the players/staff perform; come to my house and I will have a huge helping of Dooley crow for you!
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Notice that I said Kiffin and Co. ... not Kiffin only. I fully recognize that Kiffin didn't light up the NFL (even though he did improve the Raiders). If you're going to rely on Al Davis' opinion of anyone, then good luck with that. I prefer Kiffin because of his recruiting abilities and his ability to put together a coaching staff. He (along with Chaney) also turned our offense around last year, so he has shown significant signs of being a great coach in the most key areas.

That's funny that you think LA Tech became a nationally known program under Dooley. Most people had no clue who Derek Dooley was before he was hired at UT. I'm not saying that he didn't improve them, but that was difficult not to do considering where LA Tech was before he got there. Keep in mind, they went 4-8 last year. Did you honestly keep up with LA Tech under Dooley? I highly doubt it unless you're from Louisiana or something.

When did I say that Kiffin was my hero? I simply said that I would rather have that coaching staff over what we have now. You should work on your reading comprehension ability. Also, when did Kiffin talk about how good we were going to be? Please don't throw the Florida comment at me. If you bought into that, then you've been watching too much ESPN.

Finally, the fact that you thought the NCAA was actually going to do anything speaks volumes for you. I'm sure you were one of the people going ballistic about his 6 secondary violations. Oh no!
 
#53
#53
zach0105 said:
1) 5-15 in the NFL. Been called a flat out liar on national tv, granted it was Al Davis but he was right. Sure he came in and got our program some attention, but at what cost? The possibility of an NCAA investigation.

Sure I was excited about the hire when Kiff got here. But knowing what I know now, I'm ecstatic that he's gone and that we have a respectable coach.
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I guess our opinions of what a "respectable" coach is differ. I'd take an ass who wins over a nice guy who loses every day of the week, but that's just me.
 
#55
#55
I continue to find it amazing that folks will 'acknowledge' Kiffin's ability to improve selected statistics of the Oakland Raiders, yet are unwilling to 'acknowledge' Dickey's obvious improvements of La Tech. :banghead2:

I also find it amusing that posters will cover their arse by claiming that DD will fail, but all the while saying that they 'hope they are wrong'. At least get a backbone and stand for one or the other for crying out loud! We know that you are covering your arse so that next December you can proclaim the season went as you predicted (good or bad).

It's also mirthful of those that thought that Kiffin and company was a great hire, yet can't find the intestinal fortitude to admit that Dooley and company is at worst an "equal" hire - based on previous qualifications. And that includes not only the head coaches, but assistant coaches as well.

And don't use this crutch about the infamous Tampa 2 defense and Monte Kiffin. Last year, it stayed in Tampa (or just outside the stadium at Ole Miss - LOL). Just because "perception" may be reality for some of you, "perception" is still "perception".

Kiffin and 70-year old daddy along with Orgeron are perceive to be great coaches. The reality from last year disputes that "perception".
 
#57
#57
They can win 4, they can 13, or they can lose 4, or 13...seriously guys watch the braves for a few months and relax
 
#58
#58
Volfan8282 said:
1) He was at LA Tech. It's not like he did UT any favors necessarily. UT offering him the job is a lot bigger deal than him accepting the job.

2) Brought in some great coaches? I've said this before, but Baggett is the only new coach that I would for sure take over the previous staff. I think our definitions of "great" are different.

I agree with the rest, but people have every right to be skeptical about the hire. Dooley didn't exactly light it up at LA Tech. Just b/c he's a Saban disciple doesn't mean that he's the next Saban.
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1st) Ignorance is your middle name. Ya CDD was at La Tech so what, he made progress with what he had. Obviously he did do us a favor by accepting the job, a lot of recruits said they'd see who was hired before making any final decisions. So we get a top 10 recruiting class, I'd say that's significant. He did us a big favor.

2nd) I would take Baggett, Wilcox, and Smith over last years coaches at those positions. Bagget tons of experience with superstars. Wilcox is a college coach which suits us better since Tennessee is in fact a college. Monte struggled against the spread offense and other formations is college that aren't in the nfl. Wilcox has seen it all in the WAC. And finally Oregeron was a good coach but I'd take a tennessee alumni with a great back round in the nfl any day. I mean look at the new work let's dline last year, monsters.

3rd) You gotta start somewhere. CDD has had saban and his dad as mentors. He'll keep learning. And he doesn't need his daddy told hold his hand like kiffin did.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#60
#60
SmartVolFan said:
I continue to find it amazing that folks will 'acknowledge' Kiffin's ability to improve selected statistics of the Oakland Raiders, yet are unwilling to 'acknowledge' Dickey's obvious improvements of La Tech. :banghead2:

I also find it amusing that posters will cover their arse by claiming that DD will fail, but all the while saying that they 'hope they are wrong'. At least get a backbone and stand for one or the other for crying out loud! We know that you are covering your arse so that next December you can proclaim the season went as you predicted (good or bad).

It's also mirthful of those that thought that Kiffin and company was a great hire, yet can't find the intestinal fortitude to admit that Dooley and company is at worst an "equal" hire - based on previous qualifications. And that includes not only the head coaches, but assistant coaches as well.

And don't use this crutch about the infamous Tampa 2 defense and Monte Kiffin. Last year, it stayed in Tampa (or just outside the stadium at Ole Miss - LOL). Just because "perception" may be reality for some of you, "perception" is still "perception".

Kiffin and 70-year old daddy along with Orgeron are perceive to be great coaches. The reality from last year disputes that "perception".
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Why is it wrong for a person to be of the opinion that DD isn't SEC material, but hope for the sake of UT football that they are wrong. Not being willing to blindy support a risky at best hire does not equate to liking UT football any less.

To believe that the two staffs are in any way equal is crazy IMO. When you mention DD's "obvious" improvements at La Tech, are you referring to the one extra game over a 3 year period that he managed to win (17-20) over the previous 3 year stretch (16-20)? All this in the second worst conference in FBS? Then, he goes and hires a largely unknown staff. Here's what we do know, LK and Co. took a team with a losing record and abominable QB play, improved them and went to a bowl game last year. They were also on track for a top 5 recruiting class to help add much needed depth to our lineup. Keeping Lance Thompson is huge, but there's no way this staff will be able to recruit the way Kiffin and EO could. They are some of, if not THE BEST recruiters in America, and have proven it time and again.
 
#61
#61
Volfan8282 said:
Notice that I said Kiffin and Co. ... not Kiffin only. I fully recognize that Kiffin didn't light up the NFL (even though he did improve the Raiders). If you're going to rely on Al Davis' opinion of anyone, then good luck with that. I prefer Kiffin because of his recruiting abilities and his ability to put together a coaching staff. He (along with Chaney) also turned our offense around last year, so he has shown significant signs of being a great coach in the most key areas.

That's funny that you think LA Tech became a nationally known program under Dooley. Most people had no clue who Derek Dooley was before he was hired at UT. I'm not saying that he didn't improve them, but that was difficult not to do considering where LA Tech was before he got there. Keep in mind, they went 4-8 last year. Did you honestly keep up with LA Tech under Dooley? I highly doubt it unless you're from Louisiana or something.

When did I say that Kiffin was my hero? I simply said that I would rather have that coaching staff over what we have now. You should work on your reading comprehension ability. Also, when did Kiffin talk about how good we were going to be? Please don't throw the Florida comment at me. If you bought into that, then you've been watching too much ESPN.

Finally, the fact that you thought the NCAA was actually going to do anything speaks volumes for you. I'm sure you were one of the people going ballistic about his 6 secondary violations. Oh no!
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First off apparently you need to freshen up on your reading comprehension as well. I never said that LA Tech got national attention just the most attention I can remember them having. Second, I noted that Al is not a reliable source to make opinions from, even though he was right this time.

Other than bringing his dad, I don't consider any of the other coaches as a home run hire. As for his recruiting abilities. He has the ability to recruit the players, but honestly where has it got us? Three of his great recruits are now gone.

The jury is still out on Dooley's recruiting here. He did a great job keeping Kiffins mess together, and managed to get a few recruits that were not considering us as well.

That's 4-8 last year, was similar to our situation now. Was thin on the depth chart and had a lot of injuries putting a lot of walk ons on the field. Most of his losses for his overall record was away games. With three against a good Boise team, two against LSU, loss to Auburn, and one by a then good Kansas.

You didn't have to say he was your hero. I just assumed by the way you are defending him. That man didn't stop all off season. Every chance he got he said something stupid to the media. I didn't buy in to the Florida comment. It got me excited, but it made the loss that more embarrassing.

They might not have done anything about the current violations. But, I'm sure there would have been a lot more. Maybe even enough to get into the mess USC is possibly gonna be in now.
 
#62
#62
And don't use this crutch about the infamous Tampa 2 defense and Monte Kiffin. Last year, it stayed in Tampa (or just outside the stadium at Ole Miss - LOL). Just because "perception" may be reality for some of you, "perception" is still "perception".

Haha i agree with you. Just because the previous coaching staff had more hype doesn't mean that this one couldn't succeed just because they didn't get alot of media attention.
 
#63
#63
bleedorange0037 said:
Why is it wrong for a person to be of the opinion that DD isn't SEC material, but hope for the sake of UT football that they are wrong. Not being willing to blindy support a risky at best hire does not equate to liking UT football any less.

To believe that the two staffs are in any way equal is crazy IMO. When you mention DD's "obvious" improvements at La Tech, are you referring to the one extra game over a 3 year period that he managed to win (17-20) over the previous 3 year stretch (16-20)? All this in the second worst conference in FBS? Then, he goes and hires a largely unknown staff. Here's what we do know, LK and Co. took a team with a losing record and abominable QB play, improved them and went to a bowl game last year. They were also on track for a top 5 recruiting class to help add much needed depth to our lineup. Keeping Lance Thompson is huge, but there's no way this staff will be able to recruit the way Kiffin and EO could. They are some of, if not THE BEST recruiters in America, and have proven it time and again.
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The point I'm making is prior to Kiffin arriving at UT. His record, background and accomplishments prior to Tennessee, is very similar to Dooley's.

There is a difference between recruiting and coaching. A lot of great recruiters have never won the national or conference championship, and a lot of great coaches have never had the consensus #1 recruiting class.

I'll take great coaching over great recruiting every day!
 
#66
#66
SGMVols said:
You can have Vince Lombardi as your coach and it won't matter in the SEC if you can't recruit elite talent.
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Okay, let's rank the talent and call it a year... There's no reason for playing the game if it's all about the talent, right?
 
#70
#70
IndianaVolunteer said:
1st) Ignorance is your middle name. Ya CDD was at La Tech so what, he made progress with what he had. Obviously he did do us a favor by accepting the job, a lot of recruits said they'd see who was hired before making any final decisions. So we get a top 10 recruiting class, I'd say that's significant. He did us a big favor.

2nd) I would take Baggett, Wilcox, and Smith over last years coaches at those positions. Bagget tons of experience with superstars. Wilcox is a college coach which suits us better since Tennessee is in fact a college. Monte struggled against the spread offense and other formations is college that aren't in the nfl. Wilcox has seen it all in the WAC. And finally Oregeron was a good coach but I'd take a tennessee alumni with a great back round in the nfl any day. I mean look at the new work let's dline last year, monsters.

3rd) You gotta start somewhere. CDD has had saban and his dad as mentors. He'll keep learning. And he doesn't need his daddy told hold his hand like kiffin did.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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1) My point is that he didn't set the world on fire down there. LA Tech finished 4-8 last year. Chalk that up to whatever you want, but that's the opposite of impressive. I don't care if you're at LA Tech or UT, you have to show steady improvement. We gave a guy who just came off of a 4-8 season the head coaching job at UT. I would say UT did Dooley quite a favor considering Dooley isn't bringing an all-world staff with him.

2) The fact that you would take Smith and Wilcox over Orgeron and Monte says all that I need to know about your knowledge of football. Ever entertained the idea that maybe we didn't have the athletes/depth to stop a spread offense last year? Doubt it. Ever thought about the fact that we only play one team a year (Florida) who runs a quirky offense? Doubt it. Monte has forgotten more about running a defense than Wilcox actually knows about it... and I'm not a Wilcox hater. But, he's not in the same league as Monte Kiffin. Sorry.

3) If I have the chance to hire Monte Kiffin as my DC, I'm doing it. I don't care if he's my dad or not. I've never understood the "hold his hand" comments.
 
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#72
#72
SmartVolFan said:
The point I'm making is prior to Kiffin arriving at UT. His record, background and accomplishments prior to Tennessee, is very similar to Dooley's.

There is a difference between recruiting and coaching. A lot of great recruiters have never won the national or conference championship, and a lot of great coaches have never had the consensus #1 recruiting class.

I'll take great coaching over great recruiting every day
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I'd rather have both.
 
#74
#74
zach0105 said:
First off apparently you need to freshen up on your reading comprehension as well. I never said that LA Tech got national attention just the most attention I can remember them having. Second, I noted that Al is not a reliable source to make opinions from, even though he was right this time.

Other than bringing his dad, I don't consider any of the other coaches as a home run hire. As for his recruiting abilities. He has the ability to recruit the players, but honestly where has it got us? Three of his great recruits are now gone.

The jury is still out on Dooley's recruiting here. He did a great job keeping Kiffins mess together, and managed to get a few recruits that were not considering us as well.

That's 4-8 last year, was similar to our situation now. Was thin on the depth chart and had a lot of injuries putting a lot of walk ons on the field. Most of his losses for his overall record was away games. With three against a good Boise team, two against LSU, loss to Auburn, and one by a then good Kansas.

You didn't have to say he was your hero. I just assumed by the way you are defending him. That man didn't stop all off season. Every chance he got he said something stupid to the media. I didn't buy in to the Florida comment. It got me excited, but it made the loss that more embarrassing.

They might not have done anything about the current violations. But, I'm sure there would have been a lot more. Maybe even enough to get into the mess USC is possibly gonna be in now.
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Kiffin definitely ran his mouth, but I don't remember him talking about how good we were going to be which is what you said. Those are 2 totally different things. I assumed by you saying that Dooley got LA Tech more attention that you meant that they were talked about outside of the state of Louisiana. But, I guess their popularity could've spread from Ruston to the entire northern part of the state... my apologies. I still highly doubt you knew much about Dooley's program down there prior to him being hired here.

Lance Thompson, Ed Orgeron, Eddie Gran, and Jim Chaney were all excellent hires. Gran, Orgeron, and Thompson are arguably 3 of the best position coaches in the business. Chaney proved incredibly useful in revamping the offense around Crompton last year. I don't know what you consider home run hires, but those are all great hires in my book. Also, in regard to recruiting, you can't win in the SEC if you don't recruit well. But, considering how bare Fulmer left the cupboards, you weren't going to see us go 10-2 last year just b/c Kiffin had a top 10 class. That's not how it works. It would've still taken 3-4 years to get it rolling.

As far as violations, I would've been upset had he not been getting secondary violations as I will be if Dooley doesn't get secondary violations. They don't mean anything unless you rack up just tons of them which Kiffin wasn't doing. As far as last year being similar for Kiffin and Dooley, maybe. The difference is that Dooley was in his 4th year as their coach. Who's fault was it that they had a lack of depth?
 
#75
#75
DocVol said:
Are there really those here that are still calling for a 4-win season from Tennessee?! After the O&W game, it seems that all the Doomsday Vol Fans have come out. The team will be just fine and it wouldn't surprise me if the team finished with a better record that last year's squad. There are too many weapons on this team not to win a fair number of games--especially on offense. Even if we back our way into a few of them, we will be a good team. While it is still true that defense wins championships, a good offense will win you an number of games. Not to mention the great D-line that's shaping up, the secondary that shined yesterday, and special teams that CDD is determined to make priority. The O-line will come....and if it is not as soon as many would like, I'm confident that CDD will put together a much more organized and detailed scheme to play to the team's abilities (i.e. lining Bray up in the shotgun, screen passes, flare outs for Poole, quick west coast posts for our big receivers...). We will be okay...it's not quite time for Doomsday yet!

-DocVol
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Good post! I agree 100%.

It's funny, because a lot of the "doomsday fans" remind me of the Auburn fans last year after Chizik was hired. Well, Auburn turned out OK. We will too.

Dooley has a lot to prove, but no doubt he will have success at UT.

Go Vols!
 
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