Dooley's Stats in 2nd half

[theFallGuy]

Derek Dooley at UT versus SEC and BCS level non conference teams, 20 games, he is +7 differential in the first half, -179 in the 2nd half.

 

[Govol111]

That goes to show the awful depth he had first couple years, inexperience, and poor leadership from players mostly, and also lack of significant halftime coaching changes.

 

[Cartervol]

Best coach in America for a half. Then it all goes to sheet........

 

[theFallGuy]

It tells me other teams are making adjustments while we roll over and die in the 2nd half.

 

[Gator H8R]

A lot of that is depth. Now we have some, albeit, not much, but some. Our 2 deep still isnt SEC level, IMO. Bama could beat any SEC team with their 2nd string. Until we get talented 2 deep, we are going to keep seeing the same thing.

 

[theFallGuy]

A lot of that is depth. Now we have some, albeit, not much, but some. Our 2 deep still isnt SEC level, IMO. Bama could beat any SEC team with their 2nd string. Until we get talented 2 deep, we are going to keep seeing the same thing.

Okay, I get what you are saying in some regard but let's do a little comparison.

2007, Saban's first year, he went 7-6. By 2008, Saban's second year, he went 12-0.

Now, how much depth did Alabama really have by Saban's 2nd year?

From 1997 - 2006 they had a lot of coaching changes and instability. Here are their recruiting classes.

2002 - no top 25
2003 - no top 25
2004 - 19th overall
2005 - 16th overall
2006 - 18th overall
2007 - 22nd overall
2008 - Saban's first year, 1st overall

So, you can't tell me that Saban was playing all freshman recruits his first year from his #1 recruiting class when he went 12 - 0. He was playing with some average recruiting classes from the Shula era.

 

[tm3]

Did Satan have the attrition that we had?

Did Satan have a total bust class like kitten?

Did Satan have a year with only 56 scholarship players?

I am not trying to support our future ex coach, I just do not see comparable situations.

 

[Gator H8R]

Okay, I get what you are saying in some regard but let's do a little comparison.

2007, Saban's first year, he went 7-6. By 2008, Saban's second year, he went 12-0.

Now, how much depth did Alabama really have by Saban's 2nd year?

From 1997 - 2006 they had a lot of coaching changes and instability. Here are their recruiting classes.

2002 - no top 25
2003 - no top 25
2004 - 19th overall
2005 - 16th overall
2006 - 18th overall
2007 - 22nd overall
2008 - Saban's first year, 1st overall

So, you can't tell me that Saban was playing all freshman recruits his first year from his #1 recruiting class when he went 12 - 0. He was playing with some average recruiting classes from the Shula era.

Lets try this, check and see how many players Saban had on scholarship his first year and look how many Dools had. Im sure youll be surprised.

 

[GahLee]

Okay, I get what you are saying in some regard but let's do a little comparison.

2007, Saban's first year, he went 7-6. By 2008, Saban's second year, he went 12-0.

Now, how much depth did Alabama really have by Saban's 2nd year?

From 1997 - 2006 they had a lot of coaching changes and instability. Here are their recruiting classes.

2002 - no top 25
2003 - no top 25
2004 - 19th overall
2005 - 16th overall
2006 - 18th overall
2007 - 22nd overall
2008 - Saban's first year, 1st overall

So, you can't tell me that Saban was playing all freshman recruits his first year from his #1 recruiting class when he went 12 - 0. He was playing with some average recruiting classes from the Shula era.

Somehow, someway, the info you've provided here and in the OP will be refuted.

 

[Gator H8R]

Did Satan have the attrition that we had?

Did Satan have a total bust class like kitten?

Did Satan have a year with only 56 scholarship players?

I am not trying to support our future ex coach, I just do not see comparable situations.

This. Apples to oranges.

 

[golfballs]

mostly a depth issue

 

[chattavol420]

mostly a depth issue

No it's not. That's everyone's excuse. Dooley included. Compare our roster to boisy state or stanford. We have wayyyy more talent than either of those programs. In fact only abut 4 sec teams have as many 3/4* players as we do

 

[golfballs]

No it's not. That's everyone's excuse. Dooley included. Compare our roster to boisy state or stanford. We have wayyyy more talent than either of those programs. In fact only abut 4 sec teams have as many 3/4* players as we do

If you want to talk about the Florida game, fine. But over the past two years, it's been mostly a depth issue.

 

[Gator H8R]

No it's not. That's everyone's excuse. Dooley included. Compare our roster to boisy state or stanford. We have wayyyy more talent than either of those programs. In fact only abut 4 sec teams have as many 3/4* players as we do

Boise and Stanford arent in the SEC. Again, apples to oranges.

 

[theFallGuy]

Lets try this, check and see how many players Saban had on scholarship his first year and look how many Dools had. Im sure youll be surprised.

But we aren't talking about Dooley year 1 anymore. 3 years now. time to start holding him accountable

 

[Gator H8R]

But we aren't talking about Dooley year 1 anymore. 3 years now. time to start holding him accountable

Ok so hes 3 games into his 3rd year and FINALLY has a full roster. That doesnt mean all 85 of those kids can compete in the SEC. Id stretch to say about 10% of them could start on another SEC team.

 

[tm3]

Absolutely have to hold him accountable. We need to see substantive progress, framed in the context of the mess he inherited.

Not accurate to frame it using the context of Satan's situation at tuscalooser, IMO.

 

[theFallGuy]

Absolutely have to hold him accountable. We need to see substantive progress, framed in the context of the mess he inherited.

Not accurate to frame it using the context of Satan's situation at tuscalooser, IMO.

I'm not saying I expected us to go 12-0 this year like some did, not even 10-2.

I just think Dooley is getting out coached in the 2nd half.

 

[Brooktrout]

So you are not happy with the program in year 3 of the Dooley experiment? Try to imagine what year 4 will be like, because all of the explosive offensive playmakers (Bray, Hunter and Patterson) are gone. Anyone who argues that point is wrong. So now imagine the team next year with a less than stellat running game and Worley as the starting QB, w/o Hunter and Patterson to throw to. How does that image look? Year 4 of the experiment will be absolutely brutal IMO.

 

[DC Vol]

Did Satan have the attrition that we had?

Did Satan have a total bust class like kitten?

Did Satan have a year with only 56 scholarship players?

I am not trying to support our future ex coach, I just do not see comparable situations.

Alabama, IIRC, couldn't afford to kick anyone off the team in Saban's first year. By year 2, bolstered by that monster class, Saban started cutting the fat and demanding results.

Saban inherited an average SEC team and turned them around. What do you think Jim Harbaugh inherited at Stanford?

There isn't a comparison because it's obvious that Dooley isn't in their league. At best he's a mediocre SEC-level coach and that might not even be obvious until year 5 or 6 which nobody could tolerate.

Again, it's not the number of wins that has me set against Dooley. It's the manner and margin in which UT loses combined with no actual improvement to this point. That may turn around... but I highly doubt it.

I also doubt we would be having this conversation if Dooley had replaced Jim Chaney in the off-season as well as bringing in a proven 4-3 DC that could transition to the 3-4 in 2013 and on. Dooley didn't do that, though. He staked his job on an unproven 3-4 DC that hadn't held a DC position since 1999 and kept Jim Chaney on staff even though it was obvious his scheme wouldn't work in the SEC and his playcalling is lackluster at best. Those were decisions that Dooley made and he will either succeed or fail directly due to them.

 

[Volz4lif3]

Gotta hold him accountable for this also..

 

[Mav145]

Actually Dooley is not getting out-coached in the 2nd half. This board is a good example of your gut telling you one thing and your head needing to tell you another.

So let's look at the offense for this year and the last. We are quitting in the 2nd half, right?

Tennessee scored 350 points - 225 (64%) in the first half and 125 (36%) in the second. Georgia scored 590 points - 336 (57%) in the first half and 254 (43%) in the second.
Alabama scored 556 points - 272 (49%) in the first half and 284 (51%) in the second.

We are not out of whack offensively with other teams in the SEC when it comes to scoring. Most of the teams that I looked at scored around 60% of thier points in the first half and 40% of their points in the second half.

For Defense:
Tennessee gave up 342 points - 141 (41%) in the first half and 201 (59%) in the second.
Georgia gave up 351 points - 151 (43%) in the first half and 200 (57%) in the second.
Alabama gave up 99 points - 57 (58%) in the first half and 42 (43%) in the second.

So the pattern that you see is not that we are experiencing some sort of collapse in games over a long period of time. There are some games where that occurs - 2012 Florida and 2011 Alabama are prime examples. But, there is no collapse. We are statistically identical to most other college football games by the percentages.

Where we are different is in the amount of points scored. We are not putting up the same numbers offensively and we are allowing more points defensively.

You guys can argue that it's coaching, depth, skill or whatever. I think it's depth but that's just an opinion. But, you can forget about this "collapse" nonsense.

 

[DC Vol]

Mav145 why don't you recompile UT's stats against meaningful opponents and not us scoring against juggernauts like Buffalo, Georgia State, etc.

 

[Mav145]

Mav145 why don't you recompile UT's stats against meaningful opponents and not us scoring against juggernauts like Buffalo, Georgia State, etc.

Already had it done.

Against ranked opponents for the last 3 years:

Tennessee has scored 219 total points - 128 (58%) in the first half and 91 (42%) in the second half. For the defense, we have allowed 424 points - 154 (36%) in the first half and 270 (64%) in the second half.

So, against ranked opponents, we are worse but still no huge collapse.

 

[tm3]

DC I concur on all of your points, except the analogy to bama and Stanford. IMO the mess that our future ex coach stepped into was much worse.

Having noted that my expectation is somewhat tempered, I still say that our future ex coach has to be held accountable and has to make substantive progress. Right now things do not look good.