Dooley vs. History

#76
#76
Bossfrog said:
I don't play roulette, bad odds. I'm more into blackjack or craps and blackjack depend on the players at the table or i'll not sit.
I was born with Orange blood back in 1958, I've been through the ups and downs for awhile. What most of you young snots don't understand is IT HAPPINS TO ALL TEAMS, don't like it, but it happins. We had a great run and it could have/should have been better. We had the teams where mulitiple National Championships SHOULD HAVE been won. We will be back on top before long.

Oh, and everyone read this v. :)
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Well I'm 64 years old bossytapole and I can recognize wishful thinking and utter nonsense when I see it. Guess I've seen a few more ups and downs than you old wise one. I am happy for your family that you don't play roulette.
 
#77
#77
Why didn't you include Majors?

It would be the only fair comparison given the state of the roster in 1977 and 2010.

First&Tenn said:
I was a wait-and-see fan for the last two years, and I said repeatedly that we didn't have enough data to judge Dooley. After this years UF game, I decided to take some time to do some research. I wanted to find out what the history of the SEC said about Dooley's chances of future success, because (as the old saying goes) if we don't learn from history we are doomed to repeat it.

I went back and compiled the records for every coach that has won an SEC title since the beginning of the championship game in 1992. That gives us 20 years of data. For each coach, I examined their first three years at the program where they won the title. I compiled win/loss statistics along with their wins and losses over Top 25 opponents. I wanted to get a baseline of performance for a coach capable of winning the SEC title.

Here are the numbers:

Stallings (Bama)
  • Year 1: 7-5
  • Year 2: 11-1
  • Year 3: 13-0
  • 3 Year Total: 31-6
  • Win %: 83.78%
  • vs Top 25: 9-2
  • % vs Top 25: 81.82%

Spurrier (UF)
  • Year 1: 9-2
  • Year 2: 10-2
  • Year 3: 9-4
  • 3 Year Total: 28-8
  • Win %: 77.78%
  • vs Top 25: 8-8
  • % vs Top 25: 50.00%

Fulmer (UT)(Beginning with first full year)
  • Year 1: 10-2 (Tie with #2 Bama was forfeited and counted here as a win)
  • Year 2: 8-4
  • Year 3: 11-1
  • 3 Year Total: 29-7
  • Win %: 80.56%
  • vs Top 25: 9-6
  • % vs Top 25: 60.00%

Dubose (Bama)
  • Year 1: 4-7
  • Year 2: 7-5
  • Year 3: 10-3
  • 3 Year Total: 21-15
  • Win %: 58.33%
  • vs Top 25: 5-8
  • % vs Top 25: 38.46%

Saban (LSU)
  • Year 1: 8-4
  • Year 2: 10-3
  • Year 3: 8-5
  • 3 Year Total: 26-12
  • Win %: 68.42%
  • vs Top 25: 7-7
  • % vs Top 25: 50.00%

Richt (UGA)
  • Year 1: 8-4
  • Year 2: 13-1
  • Year 3: 11-3
  • 3 Year Total: 32-8
  • Win %: 80.00%
  • vs Top 25: 10-7
  • % vs Top 25: 58.82%

Tuberville (Auburn)
  • Year 1: 5-6
  • Year 2: 9-4
  • Year 3: 7-5
  • 3 Year Total: 21-15
  • Win %: 58.33%
  • vs Top 25: 5-8
  • % vs Top 25: 38.46%

Meyer (UF)
  • Year 1: 9-3
  • Year 2: 13-1
  • Year 3: 9-4
  • 3 Year Total: 31-8
  • Win %: 79.49%
  • vs Top 25: 11-5
  • % vs Top 25: 68.75%

Miles (LSU)
  • Year 1: 11-2
  • Year 2: 11-2
  • Year 3: 12-2
  • 3 Year Total: 34-6
  • Win %: 85.00%
  • vs Top 25: 15-5
  • % vs Top 25: 75.00%

Saban (Bama)
  • Year 1: 7-6
  • Year 2: 12-2
  • Year 3: 14-0
  • 3 Year Total: 33-8
  • Win %: 80.49%
  • vs Top 25: 11-5
  • % vs Top 25: 68.75%

Chizik (Auburn)
  • Year 1: 8-5
  • Year 2: 14-0
  • Year 3: 8-5
  • 3 Year Total: 30-10
  • Win %: 75.00%
  • vs Top 25: 9-6
  • % vs Top 25: 60.00%

And for the sake of comparison:

Dooley (UT)
  • Year 1: 6-7
  • Year 2: 5-7
  • Year 3: 3-2 (So Far)
  • Total (So Far): 14-16
  • Win %: 46.67%
  • vs Top 25: 0-12
  • % vs Top 25: 0.00%

Also for comparison, I put together a best case scenario for Dooley this year. This scenario has UT winning every possible game left on the schedule (including the SEC title game and a bowl game over a ranked opponent) to get to 12-2.

Dooley (Best Case Scenario)
  • Year 1: 6-7
  • Year 2: 5-7
  • Year 3: 12-2
  • 3 Year Total: 23-16
  • Win %: 58.97%
  • vs Top 25: 5-12
  • % vs Top 25: 29.41%

Takeaways:

1. Coaches who win the SEC title very rarely have losing seasons. Only Dubose and Tuberville had any losing seasons, and in both cases only in their first year.

2. Coaches who win the SEC title have good records against the top 25. Dubose and Tuberville are the only two to post an average below .500.

3. The Dubose case was unique and interesting. Dubose started right after the Stallings era ended. Bama had just been punished with severe NCAA sanctions that caused them to lose 26 scholarships over a 3 year period and a 2 year bowl ban (Started as a 3 year ban, but was later reduced). The NCAA considered the death penalty for the program. I think it is fair to argue that Dubose had a situation as difficult or more so than Dooley's

4. Les Miles has the best overall win % in the first 3 years. It can be argued that he was winning with Saban's players, but it is still an impressive feat.

5. Even in a best case scenario for Dooley, his win % is low and his % vs the Top 25 would be the lowest in history. I have no doubt that Dooley will get a raise and extension if this team wins 12 games, an SEC title, and a major bowl game, but he still looks bad in comparison to the others.

6. Dooley already has more losses in his first 3 years than any coach that has won an SEC title in the title game era.

History is not always the best indicator of the future, but it can be revealing. Dooley did have several issues to face when he accepted the UT job, but it does not look like he will be the one to take the program back to the championship level.

Extra Historical Fact: 2010 & 2011 are the first back-to-back losing seasons for UT since 1910 & 1911.
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#78
#78
I appreciate the time that you put into compiling your statistics, and they tell a partial story. There are several other considerations that should be taken into account. First and foremost, you have to look at the level of talent that each coach inhereted. In my opinion, Dooley inhereted less talent than any of any of the other coaches.

One would also want to consider the level of competition in today's SEC. Most people would agree that the SEC is the most talented conference in the nation, which makes it harder to win now versus years past. You also have look at injuries to key players. Would Auburn have won the NC if they lost Cam in the middle of the season? Would UT have won 1 maybe 2 more games last year had Bray and Hunter stayed healthy?

In my opinion it is impossible to win on a consistent basis with less talent, and Dooley has had less talent in every one of his losses with the exception of Kentucky. Will a good coach sometimes beat a more talented team? Absolutely, and Dooley has not done this yet. Do good coaches ever lose to less talented teams? Absolutely, and Dooley did.

To get to my point, from my perspective and I'm guessing from Dave Hart's perspective Dooley is being graded on a broader range of criteria. Dooley will ultimately be judged on his wins and his losses, but right now, it isn't rational to look solely at his record. When he has has time to build an upper tier SEC roster, I will pay more attention to his record verus the upper tier coaches.

Based on the state of the program, Dooley has done an exceptional job of recruiting. Most talented players tend to stay away from programs that were the shape that our program was in. His recruiting has paid off because our offense is loaded with talent. The defense has a lot of talent, but there are still a few positions that need to be upgraded. I think that even NegaVols and Sunshine Pumpers can agree that our roster is far more talented than when Dooley arrived. I believe that this increase in talent will lead to Dooley's ultimate success.
 
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#79
#79
jcknight1 said:
I appreciate the time that you put into compiling your statistics, and they tell a partial story. There are several other considerations that should be taken into account. First and foremost, you have to look at the level of talent that each coach inhereted. In my opinion, Dooley inhereted less talent than any of any of the other coaches.

One would also want to consider the level of competition in today's SEC. Most people would agree that the SEC is the most talented conference in the nation, which makes it harder to win now versus years past. You also have look at injuries to key players. Would Auburn have won the NC if they lost Cam in the middle of the season? Would UT have won 1 maybe 2 more games last year had Bray and Hunter stayed healthy?

In my opinion it is impossible to win on a consistent basis with less talent, and Dooley has had less talent in every one of his losses with the exception of Kentucky. Will a good coach sometimes beat a more talented team? Absolutely, and Dooley has not done this yet. Do good coaches ever lose to less talented teams? Absolutely, and Dooley did.

To get to my point, from my perspective and I'm guessing from Dave Hart's perspective Dooley is being graded on a broader range of criteria. Dooley will ultimately be judged on his wins and his losses, but right now, it isn't rational to look solely at his record. When he has has time to build an upper tier SEC roster, I will pay more attention to his record verus the upper tier coaches.

Based on the state of the program, Dooley has done an exceptional job of recruiting. Most talented players tend to stay away from programs that were the shape that our program was in. His recruiting has paid off because our offense is loaded with talent. The defense has a lot of talent, but there are still a few positions that need to be upgraded. I think that even NegaVols and Sunshine Pumpers can agree that our roster is far more talented than when Dooley arrived. I believe that this increase in talent will lead to Dooley's ultimate success.
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The problem seems clear to me. IF you have to have more talent than any team you coach against to have a chance to beat them, then we have the wrong man leading the team. Doolanders keep saying we do not have enough talent to compete. They then say we can't pull the big name recruits because we don't win. See the issue here? You can't make excuses going both ways. If Dooley can not beat the big SEC schools in the recruiting battles(I am not talking about when other teams fill up and the player falls to us), then he has to out coach them with lesser talent. It's one or the other IMO or be replaced. Of course better recruits would consider the Vols if Dooley proved he could win some SEC games. He just has not shown the ability to do so. How can Dooley build an upper level SEC roster if he can't get the big time recruits until he starts winning? Are we back to the "Just give him more time and we will see BS"? He has never been a winner. Those who think he is going to wake up tomorrow and become this great SEC coach are just living a dream.
 
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#80
#80
jcknight1 said:
I appreciate the time that you put into compiling your statistics, and they tell a partial story. There are several other considerations that should be taken into account. First and foremost, you have to look at the level of talent that each coach inhereted. In my opinion, Dooley inhereted less talent than any of any of the other coaches.

One would also want to consider the level of competition in today's SEC. Most people would agree that the SEC is the most talented conference in the nation, which makes it harder to win now versus years past. You also have look at injuries to key players. Would Auburn have won the NC if they lost Cam in the middle of the season? Would UT have won 1 maybe 2 more games last year had Bray and Hunter stayed healthy?

In my opinion it is impossible to win on a consistent basis with less talent, and Dooley has had less talent in every one of his losses with the exception of Kentucky. Will a good coach sometimes beat a more talented team? Absolutely, and Dooley has not done this yet. Do good coaches ever lose to less talented teams? Absolutely, and Dooley did.

To get to my point, from my perspective and I'm guessing from Dave Hart's perspective Dooley is being graded on a broader range of criteria. Dooley will ultimately be judged on his wins and his losses, but right now, it isn't rational to look solely at his record. When he has has time to build an upper tier SEC roster, I will pay more attention to his record verus the upper tier coaches.
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I get nauseated everytime I hear "more time". If he had an impressive coaching career before he came to UT, then I could understand giving him more time--but he doesn't. Please review his coaching experience and tell me what in his coaching background leads you to believe that he will be successful (I am not trying to be argumentative, but I have reviewed his background and I am at a loss to understand why he was hired).
 
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#81
#81
dont114 said:
I get nauseated everytime I here "more time". If he had an impressive coaching career before he came to UT, then I could understand giving him more time,but he doesn't. Please review his coaching experience and tell me what in his coaching background leads you to believe that he will be successful (I am not trying to be argumentative, but I have reviewed his background and I am at a loss to understand why he was hired).
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IMO, there is 1 reason the man was hired. He would take the job for the 2 million dollars Hammy wanted to spend and he would take the job quickly. We are past the NCAA rumors/what may come down. The roster is a little better. There is alot of returning starters on this football team. The problem I have is they look like freshman still. They do not seem to be getting better. Same mistakes and same outcome. It comes down to money. Hart can spend the cash to make UT relevant again or he can allow Dooley another couple years to lose while he builds the budget back up. I do think the latter will prove to be costly. Empty seats will equate to alot more than the funds to hire a winner. As the loses pile up, recuiting will take a nose dive as well. Kids are just not going to keep buying the dream Dools is selling. JMO
 
#82
#82
vols-1 said:
LMAO, how can you say there is no question and include NC when there is no playoff? And Auburn went undefeated twice in recent history and didn't even play for the NC.
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Ok, let's include those Auburn undefeated seasons. For argument's sake, let's assume that the Bowden-led Auburn played those extra 2 games against the tough competetion of an SEC championship and for the National Championship, AND WON BOTH. Odds are somewhat against this, but let's say it happened. And, let's say that Tubberville-led Auburn played a tougher opponent than a team barely in the Top 10 in the bowl game and won.

Guess what? It doesn't change a single thing I wrote regarding those coaches' opponents in their first 3 years. NONE OF THEM PLAYED AUBURN in those years.

So, please explain why you are laughing.

I believe you will find that most people, including most true experts, believe that the SEC is tougher in the past several years than it was in the 1990s or early 2000s. If you believe otherwise, please provide some rationale for it. I'm not saying it is not possible, but I don't know of any reason.

Phil Fulmer sure found it to be tougher in the late 2000s than he did in the 1990s.
 
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#83
#83
dont114 said:
I get nauseated everytime I here "more time". If he had an impressive coaching career before he came to UT, then I could understand giving him more time,but he doesn't. Please review his coaching experience and tell me what in his coaching background leads you to believe that he will be successful (I am not trying to be argumentative, but I have reviewed his background and I am at a loss to understand why he was hired).
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List all the "big-name" coaches that have taken over programs with roster issues like 2010 Vols.

Then list how long it took each coach to turn it around.

2 seasons and 5 games is enough time?

If Kiffin's '09 recruiting class wasn't a total bust you may have a point - as it stands, 4 years is fair to judge Dooley's performance.
 
#84
#84
ajvol01 said:
List all the "big-name" coaches that have taken over programs with roster issues like 2010 Vols.

Then list how long it took each coach to turn it around.

2 seasons and 5 games is enough time?

If Kiffin's '09 recruiting class wasn't a total bust you may have a point - as it stands, 4 years is fair to judge Dooley's performance.
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He has had 2 years and 5 games too long already. You do not wait 4 years to correct a mistake in the hope that it will correct itself. UT head football coach is not a position for on-the-job training.
 
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#85
#85
dont114 said:
He has had 2 years and 5 games too long already. You do not wait 4 years to correct a mistake in the hope that it will correct itself. UT head football coach is not a position for on-the-job training.
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Small Mike?
 
#90
#90
LebanonVolunteer said:
IMO, there is 1 reason the man was hired. He would take the job for the 2 million dollars Hammy wanted to spend and he would take the job quickly. We are past the NCAA rumors/what may come down. The roster is a little better. There is alot of returning starters on this football team. The problem I have is they look like freshman still. They do not seem to be getting better. Same mistakes and same outcome. It comes down to money. Hart can spend the cash to make UT relevant again or he can allow Dooley another couple years to lose while he builds the budget back up. I do think the latter will prove to be costly. Empty seats will equate to alot more than the funds to hire a winner. As the loses pile up, recuiting will take a nose dive as well. Kids are just not going to keep buying the dream Dools is selling. JMO
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Agree. I personally want to reserve judgement until the season is over. But, if this ship isn't turned around, we have a problem.

Hamilton was at least partially to blame for a lot of these problems. We should have give him the boot long ago, instead of inexplicably handing him a million dollars to leave.
 
#94
#94
First&Tenn said:
I was a wait-and-see fan for the last two years, and I said repeatedly that we didn't have enough data to judge Dooley. After this years UF game, I decided to take some time to do some research. I wanted to find out what the history of the SEC said about Dooley's chances of future success, because (as the old saying goes) if we don't learn from history we are doomed to repeat it.

I went back and compiled the records for every coach that has won an SEC title since the beginning of the championship game in 1992. That gives us 20 years of data. For each coach, I examined their first three years at the program where they won the title. I compiled win/loss statistics along with their wins and losses over Top 25 opponents. I wanted to get a baseline of performance for a coach capable of winning the SEC title.

Here are the numbers:

Stallings (Bama)
  • Year 1: 7-5
  • Year 2: 11-1
  • Year 3: 13-0
  • 3 Year Total: 31-6
  • Win %: 83.78%
  • vs Top 25: 9-2
  • % vs Top 25: 81.82%

Spurrier (UF)
  • Year 1: 9-2
  • Year 2: 10-2
  • Year 3: 9-4
  • 3 Year Total: 28-8
  • Win %: 77.78%
  • vs Top 25: 8-8
  • % vs Top 25: 50.00%

Fulmer (UT)(Beginning with first full year)
  • Year 1: 10-2 (Tie with #2 Bama was forfeited and counted here as a win)
  • Year 2: 8-4
  • Year 3: 11-1
  • 3 Year Total: 29-7
  • Win %: 80.56%
  • vs Top 25: 9-6
  • % vs Top 25: 60.00%

Dubose (Bama)
  • Year 1: 4-7
  • Year 2: 7-5
  • Year 3: 10-3
  • 3 Year Total: 21-15
  • Win %: 58.33%
  • vs Top 25: 5-8
  • % vs Top 25: 38.46%

Saban (LSU)
  • Year 1: 8-4
  • Year 2: 10-3
  • Year 3: 8-5
  • 3 Year Total: 26-12
  • Win %: 68.42%
  • vs Top 25: 7-7
  • % vs Top 25: 50.00%

Richt (UGA)
  • Year 1: 8-4
  • Year 2: 13-1
  • Year 3: 11-3
  • 3 Year Total: 32-8
  • Win %: 80.00%
  • vs Top 25: 10-7
  • % vs Top 25: 58.82%

Tuberville (Auburn)
  • Year 1: 5-6
  • Year 2: 9-4
  • Year 3: 7-5
  • 3 Year Total: 21-15
  • Win %: 58.33%
  • vs Top 25: 5-8
  • % vs Top 25: 38.46%

Meyer (UF)
  • Year 1: 9-3
  • Year 2: 13-1
  • Year 3: 9-4
  • 3 Year Total: 31-8
  • Win %: 79.49%
  • vs Top 25: 11-5
  • % vs Top 25: 68.75%

Miles (LSU)
  • Year 1: 11-2
  • Year 2: 11-2
  • Year 3: 12-2
  • 3 Year Total: 34-6
  • Win %: 85.00%
  • vs Top 25: 15-5
  • % vs Top 25: 75.00%

Saban (Bama)
  • Year 1: 7-6
  • Year 2: 12-2
  • Year 3: 14-0
  • 3 Year Total: 33-8
  • Win %: 80.49%
  • vs Top 25: 11-5
  • % vs Top 25: 68.75%

Chizik (Auburn)
  • Year 1: 8-5
  • Year 2: 14-0
  • Year 3: 8-5
  • 3 Year Total: 30-10
  • Win %: 75.00%
  • vs Top 25: 9-6
  • % vs Top 25: 60.00%

And for the sake of comparison:

Dooley (UT)
  • Year 1: 6-7
  • Year 2: 5-7
  • Year 3: 3-2 (So Far)
  • Total (So Far): 14-16
  • Win %: 46.67%
  • vs Top 25: 0-12
  • % vs Top 25: 0.00%

Also for comparison, I put together a best case scenario for Dooley this year. This scenario has UT winning every possible game left on the schedule (including the SEC title game and a bowl game over a ranked opponent) to get to 12-2.

Dooley (Best Case Scenario)
  • Year 1: 6-7
  • Year 2: 5-7
  • Year 3: 12-2
  • 3 Year Total: 23-16
  • Win %: 58.97%
  • vs Top 25: 5-12
  • % vs Top 25: 29.41%

Takeaways:

1. Coaches who win the SEC title very rarely have losing seasons. Only Dubose and Tuberville had any losing seasons, and in both cases only in their first year.

2. Coaches who win the SEC title have good records against the top 25. Dubose and Tuberville are the only two to post an average below .500.

3. The Dubose case was unique and interesting. Dubose started right after the Stallings era ended. Bama had just been punished with severe NCAA sanctions that caused them to lose 26 scholarships over a 3 year period and a 2 year bowl ban (Started as a 3 year ban, but was later reduced). The NCAA considered the death penalty for the program. I think it is fair to argue that Dubose had a situation as difficult or more so than Dooley's

4. Les Miles has the best overall win % in the first 3 years. It can be argued that he was winning with Saban's players, but it is still an impressive feat.

5. Even in a best case scenario for Dooley, his win % is low and his % vs the Top 25 would be the lowest in history. I have no doubt that Dooley will get a raise and extension if this team wins 12 games, an SEC title, and a major bowl game, but he still looks bad in comparison to the others.

6. Dooley already has more losses in his first 3 years than any coach that has won an SEC title in the title game era.

History is not always the best indicator of the future, but it can be revealing. Dooley did have several issues to face when he accepted the UT job, but it does not look like he will be the one to take the program back to the championship level.

Extra Historical Fact: 2010 & 2011 are the first back-to-back losing seasons for UT since 1910 & 1911.
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This is really good information.

You are leaving out one improtant issue. That is the player turnover. You need to add in what the recruiting was in each case.
I don't want to make excuses. But Tennessee has not had great players, NFL draftees etc. in the last 3 years. What is the situation with the other teams? Tennessee basically lost a comlete recruiting class did the others?

My bottomline is this:
This is the year to judge Dooley. They are definitely better than his last two teams. His two losses are disappointing. Especially Florida. They should have beaten that team. Georgia they could have won. Maybe even should have won.

The defense has been the problem. But the amazing thing is the number of big plays they give up. If you take away these big plays their defense is very good. They are getting turnovers and holding teams except for the big plays. Their redzone defense is giving up fieldgoals more than touch downs. Georgia gained 198 yards on 3 carries for touchdowns. The other 36 runs gained 89 yards. They stopped Georgia totally in the 2nd and 4th quarters. IF they can stop these big plays from ocurring they will be a pretty good defense.

I have no real problems with the offense. They are scoring 40 points a game and averaging 177 yards rushing per game.

I expect 8-4 this year and the eastern division champion next year. Maybe SEC champion next year.
 
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#95
#95
dont114 said:
I get nauseated everytime I hear "more time". If he had an impressive coaching career before he came to UT, then I could understand giving him more time--but he doesn't. Please review his coaching experience and tell me what in his coaching background leads you to believe that he will be successful (I am not trying to be argumentative, but I have reviewed his background and I am at a loss to understand why he was hired).
Click to expand...

He was hired because of an absolutely frantic and totally ignorant AD named Hamilton believed a cargo ship of BS from an agent convience him that Dooley was the next greatest coach. To back this up tell me one coaching search anywhere in football that had DD targeted that year?
 
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#96
#96
cgbtn said:
Unfortunately, cold statistics cannot measure everything, and intangibles are important. If we consider UT alone, the team Majors left for Fulmer was miles ahead of the one the one he inherited. Similarly, Dooley had so few players that he had to play true freshmen. The roster was so short he couldn't even substitute. Considering the quality of Dooley's first team, a much better comparison would be with how long it has taken coaches to win at Vandy, KY, and Ole Miss.

I am neither a Dooley lover or hater. I have fired quite a few people, and emotions played no part in the decisions.
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We need you as AD.:good!:
 
#97
#97
midtnvol2 said:
He was hired because of an absolutely frantic and totally ignorant AD named Hamilton believed a cargo ship of BS from an agent convience him that Dooley was the next greatest coach. To back this up tell me one coaching search anywhere in football that had DD targeted that year?
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I remember hearing that Hamilton was pointed to Dooley by Muschamp after the details (buyout clause) couldn't be worked out between UT and Muschamp.
 
#98
#98
VolunteerHillbilly said:
This is not meant be argumentative but something I am throwing out as food for thought.

1. Is highly unlikely.

2. Is speculative. What if Dooley is still on the hotseat after a 7-8 win season this year and he cannot close out recruiting on a high note? It'll hurt 2012 and 2013 recruiting to keep him when we might be getting a big hire recruiting bounce for both of those classes if they get someone in here late November or early December.

3. Why wait a year? If you're #2 response is right, all you're doing is delaying the pain a year. 2013 will already be a tough one due to the schedule. Why not go ahead and take our medicine and look forward to 2014 instead of giving Dooley a victory lap and then tearing the whole thing down? If my #2 response is correct, we get the recruiting bump this year and hopefully get a couple of guys that can help win a couple of games where we're not completely out talented.
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Below is the link to what I said on 11/26/11 where I said it would be 2013.

http://www.volnation.com/forum/tenn...tin-hunter-tweet-post5913006.html#post5913006

Also anyone that thinks Gruden will coach at UT is :loco:. It will never happin.

And for those that think we will lose more than Hunter this year (only due to money) has not been watching the games. Neither Bray, CP or Hunter are ready for the NFL and will lose alot of $$$ if they leave unproven.

The wife said I have to quit playing now.
 
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#99
#99
Bossfrog said:
Below is the link to what I said on 11/26/11 where I said it would be 2013.

http://www.volnation.com/forum/tenn...tin-hunter-tweet-post5913006.html#post5913006

Also anyone that thinks Gruden will coach at UT is :loco:. It will never happin.

And for those that think we will lose more than Hunter this year (only due to money) has not been watching the games. Neither Bray, CP or Hunter are ready for the NFL and will lose alot of $$$ if they leave unproven.

The wife said I have to quit playing now.
Click to expand...

Do I understand you correctly that you are willing to pass judgement on Bray, CP and Hunter after 5 games, but we need to wait to judge Dooley?
 
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