Does this change anything?

#26
#26
KK is absolutely correct. There are not as many designed runs/passes as you might think.

Most of the time, the RB does not even know he is getting the ball until the last second. If Dobbs sees a huge hole, he pulls it and runs. If he sees everything close, guess who gets the ball? I do understand that it is one of the purposes of this offense, but it doesn't make me detest it any less.
 
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#27
#27
KK is absolutely correct. There are not as many designed runs/passes as you might think.

Most of the time, the RB does not even know he is getting the ball until the last second. If Dobbs sees a huge hole, he pulls it and runs. If he sees everything close, guess who gets the ball? I do understand that it is one of the purposes of this offense, but it doesn't make me detest it any less.

Sounds like an offense that's 'to cute' for its own good....
 
#28
#28
Dobbs seems to be very conservative. Both overthrows to Malone he seemed rushed when there was no pressure. Had he made the same throw but a 1/2 second later both would have been on the money.

When in doubt he gives it to either Hurd or Kamara knowing that even hit early they are liable to make it happen.

We got this Vols.
 
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#29
#29
Wow I never would have assumed Dobbs had that much autonomy over a play. That actually sounds like a huge issue, in my understanding. How is the OL supposed to pass protect on a play they aren't sure is going to be a run or pass? I would bet the issues with the OL would decrease significantly if they knew what was going on behind them. Maybe if Dobbs' arm could be relied upon every play, it would be the dynamic offense we've been looking for.

(all based on Kerbyson's comment holding true for this season)

No way that's what Kerbyson meant... I didn't hear the audio but you can't not know if every play is going to be a run or a pass....

If that were the case you would have about 15 illegal man downfield penalties on passes... Which isn't happening.

Also, how many run/throw reads have we seen and it ended up being a throw? I'm not sure I've seen 3.

Lastly, so the TD's Malone has caught on deep balls could have been a run if Dobbs chooses?

Like I said, I haven't heard the audio, but no way every play is a decision of Dobbs in regards to run/pass.
 
#30
#30
Did Kerbyson explain the clear situations calling for drop back protections when the OL don't even get a hand on the DL he's matched up with? Now who's ****ing fault is that?

I see more of that than I do confusion on who to block or what you're blocking for.
 
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#31
#31
Sounds to me like it's a scheme issue then. With our offensive players struggling as much as they do, you'd think our offensive staff would swallow their pride and throw in some plays where everybody knows what is going to happen and our players can just attack and execute instead of having to think and react.
 
#32
#32
No way that's what Kerbyson meant... I didn't hear the audio but you can't not know if every play is going to be a run or a pass....

If that were the case you would have about 15 illegal man downfield penalties on passes... Which isn't happening.

Also, how many run/throw reads have we seen and it ended up being a throw? I'm not sure I've seen 3.

Lastly, so the TD's Malone has caught on deep balls could have been a run if Dobbs chooses?

Like I said, I haven't heard the audio, but no way every play is a decision of Dobbs in regards to run/pass.

I highly doubt that a run gets changed to a pass often. His point was obviously that Dobbs has more control over each play than anyone outside the program understands and many more decisions to make than almost any other qb.

Don't take this wrong, I don't mean it to be rude. But I just passed the info along and I provided the link. What he is saying is clear when you hear and see him saying it. And it's in the 3rd segment of the link. Instead of others trying to explain each detail or answer questions about it, it just seems it would be simpler to watch and judge yourself. If you get a completely different feeling that's ok too.
 
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#33
#33
Run pass option. Everyone does it now. The idea is one player on defense cannot do the right thing. The qb reads him. If he plays the run the qb throws it. If he plays the pass the qb keeps/hands off to the rb.

Examples of it working well: Alabama this year hanging 50 on USC and ole miss
 
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#34
#34
Run pass option. Everyone does it now. The idea is one player on defense cannot do the right thing. The qb reads him. If he plays the run the qb throws it. If he plays the pass the qb keeps/hands off to the rb.

Examples of it working well: Alabama this year hanging 50 on USC and ole miss

Agreed but still glances over the point. I imagine there is an audible for the line in those.

I will quote word for word
"A lot of those things that you thought were play action, they're hitting stop routes over on the sideline, they were supposed to be runs. And Dobbs just pulled it and threw it. And that was the decision of him.
If you watch, the offensive line were being very aggressive because THEY THINK Hurd or Kamara is getting the ball."


The second point being our "conservative" play calling is more Dobbs than Debord according to Kyler
And I quote.... first the question.
John
"So the criticism that Mike Debord is too conservative... where do you stand?"

Kyler
"It's up to Dobbs. I mean I love the guy" several more compliments - "but he decides who is getting the ball, who is running, who is catching... It really is up to him".

All the comments and questions about our offense and this seems to be the most insight we have ever received.

I've got to learn to imbed videos. I don't often click links either but under the circumstances, well.
 
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#35
#35
Agreed but still glances over the point. I imagine there is an audible for the line in those.

I will quote word for word
"A lot of those things that you thought were play action, they're hitting stop routes over on the sideline, they were supposed to be runs. And Dobbs just pulled it and threw it. And that was the decision of him.
If you watch, the offensive line were being very aggressive because THEY THINK Hurd or Kamara is getting the ball."


The second point being our "conservative" play calling is more Dobbs than Debord according to Kyler
And I quote.... first the question.
John
"So the criticism that Mike Debord is too conservative... where do you stand?"

Kyler
"It's up to Dobbs. I mean I love the guy" several more compliments - "but he decides who is getting the ball, who is running, who is catching... It really is up to him".

All the comments and questions about our offense and this seems to be the most insight we have ever received.

I've got to learn to imbed videos. I don't often click links either but under the circumstances, well.

It is on Sports Source on YouTube. I can't remember which segment.
 
#37
#37
We've got to get these guys thinking less...our most electric plays are busted scrambles thanks to individual athleticism and effort. It's obvious something has to be changed. I have faith butch and co will make adjustments...just hope it's not after we learn the hard way like last year. I felt like after OK he came out swinging at Florida (going for it on 4th down, pass back to Dobbs play) and that was after everyone ripped him all week for being conservative. Time to show us and not tell us. We can beat this Florida team and by a comfortable margin if we put it all together this week
 
#38
#38
Dobbs just has to keep the ball on the read a bit more than he does. The defense has to have that sliver of hesitation as to whether he's going to pull the ball or give it to Hurd/Kamara, and when they commit to the running back it's up to the QB to keep it and go. Herbstreit even called it out a few times during the Tech game. Of course, being on target with the receivers will help too, but really, there just has to be better reads once the defense commits.
 
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#39
#39
The following post is a no way referencing positive or negative outlook, but how we feel about certain concepts.
Kyler Kerbyson made several remarks this morning on one of the local sports shows . . .

Great post. I do watch the show (sometimes I'm only able to view it online due to travel requirements), and it was great to hear KK's opinion of things. Maybe I need to rethink my "observations" and opinions on CDM.
 
#40
#40
Agreed...yet another reason why we make other d lines look so great...cause they are pinning their dam ears back and jammin Hurd up...you are right...not a millisecond of hesitation...that's gotta be worth 40-60 lbs advantage we had on app state ha
 
#41
#41
It doesn't change my view of debord even if true. Let's say it is...it's still up to debord to simplify this for Dobbs and the offense because whatever's happening isn't working. He's the grown man getting paid to put them in position to succeed and determine their capabilities both physically and mentally
 
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#42
#42
I still cannot understand why an OL unit cannot be settled upon. This whole philosophy about whoever does the best im practice is about as stupid as it gets. Pick a freaking line up and go with it. We need cohesion and consistency. You cannot build those constantly rotating OL. Jesus, seems like that would be a simple concept.

If, and I mean if, Dobbs has that much freedom with the playcalling, then he needs to relinquish the roll to Debord. No offense to Dobbs, but he is no Peyton Manning. He doesnt have that kind of ability to read a defense. Let Debord call most of the plays and see how it works out. Maybe we have been blaming the wrong person.
 
#43
#43
The following post is a no way referencing positive or negative outlook, but how we feel about certain concepts.
Kyler Kerbyson made several remarks this morning on one of the local sports shows, the following is two that I found most interesting.
I will be paraphrasing, as it's not in transcript and I'm not going to listen and write down word for word.

1. Basically every play is an option. I know what you're thinking , "of course it is", but it is beyond what I thought.
Kyler said that the play call could even be a run for Hurd. That he could have lined up for a run, and do his best to make a huge hole for Hurd to run through, and Dobbs decide to make a pass play instead. Basically, almost every play, in the end, was the decision of Dobbs.
Now I was well aware that Dobbs may run because the pass play wasn't there, but this is a little different than how I had it in my head.
I have made several comments here about pass to run ratio, all of them, assuming that Dobbs did what was called 90% of the time. That is not how Kyler made it sound at all.
I know I grumbled about 2 identical pass plays in the flat being called, and this makes it sound like that may very well not have been the calls.

At the beginning of the post I said this may not have anything to do with you feeling positive or negative. As for me, I'm not sure how to feel about this, but it might change which part of the game I'm upset about.


To a lesser degree, because I believe opinion can play a big factor here.
2. He got on the o-line a little, while somewhat sticking up for Mahoney.
Paraphrasing again, but he basically said that Mahoney does a really good job teaching them. "You can only show proper technique to the guys so many times". And that they looked really good at times last year and not at others because of their consistency.
They do it right in practice, they do it right two or three times on the same play call, then they just suddenly whiff next time on the same kind of play.
As I pointed out, this one can be opinion - maybe a better coach could have made them more consistent. I still found it interesting, so thought I would pass it along as well.

Like I said, these are his paraphrased comments.
But the first comment on play calling, was very interesting to me. Maybe I'm not any less upset but possibly for a different reason.
I'll try to post the link below if anyone would like to hear it for themselves. You may not usually enjoy the show but I found it to be very informative this time around.

Sports Source | Sundays at 11am on WATE Channel 6

I'm calling BS on number 1, too often Tennessee pulls the guard and center.
 
#44
#44
Not sure why we give a QB that much freedom. I understand the audible and option part, just sounds like he can do whatever and whenever. That can't be the case.
 
#45
#45
Not sure why we give a QB that much freedom. I understand the audible and option part, just sounds like he can do whatever and whenever. That can't be the case.

I don't think it would go that far. I think he stays within certain boundaries. I believe a lot of this is being misinterpreted. I think he has more freedom and control than any offense I'm familiar with, but I don't think it's just totally unbridled either.

A couple also took the 'passing on run plays' things too far. I highly doubt that happens often, Kyler just gave instances where it has gone that far.
So not what some have made it out to be, but still, I think it's fairly unique in CFB.
 
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