Dobbs in the NFL

#151
#151
KBVol said:
Dear God Almighty........ Hurd, and his mother, have laughed at suggestions of him declaring for the draft this year and continue to insist he's gonna transfer. He's also already said he's switching positions, to tight end or even wideout.

Now, Hyams reported yesterday that Hurd supposedly not gotten any calls from other schools inquiring about his services, so who knows, perhaps he winds up with no good options and declares out of desperation...I think that's highly unlikely.

But either way, Hurd was vastly overrated here as a running back. So many, me included at first, were enamored with his great size and what was originally reported as world class, sub 4.4 speed, which was very apparent, very quickly that he does not have. And then he just lacked burst, balance and general running instincts.

He averaged 3.7 ypc this year behind our bad OL....Kelly 6.4, Kamara 5.8, even Dobbs averaged 5.5......so you do the math.

Despite your unfounded declarations of greatness, Jalen Hurd just isn't that good, never was nearly as good as his hype, and will do next to nothing as a RB in the NFL imho.
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Jalen Hurd will be a great NFL RB.

Read it and weep.
 
#152
#152
hndog609 said:
I'm not saying it isn't possible but my observation stands...if Hurd is a legit 4.4 guy then it's tantamount to a BB player with a 40" vertical that you never see dunking or blocking shots. I've watched every run Hurd ever had here and he's never looked close to that fast.
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Hurd has a great burst through the hole when allowed to run downhill. The problem here was we ran him sideways too much.

Just watch the bowl game against Northwestern again when we ran him from under center. His burst was elite.

Hurd will be a monster in the league.

Pro-bowl talent.
 
#153
#153
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Here is my list of the top NFL prospects in college football with their pro comparison in parentheses:

QB: Josh Dobbs (Randall Cunningham), Sam Darnold (Matt Stafford), Jarrett Guarantano (Colin Kaepernick)

RB: Saquon Barkley (more explosive and agile Ezekiel Elliott), Alvin Kamara (Marshall Faulk), Leonard Fournette (Marcus Dupree if he didn't bust), Jalen Hurd (more explosive Eddie George)

WR: Corey Davis (Jerry Rice), Antonio Callaway (Marvin Harrison), Noony Murray (Steve Smith)

TE: Evan Engram (Shannon Sharpe), Ethan Wolf (Greg Olsen)

DL: Myles Garrett (Bruce Smith), Arden Key (Simeon Rice), Ed Oliver (John Randle), Solomon Thomas (don't know right who he reminds me of)

LB: Jarrad Davis (Randall Godfrey), Darrin Kirkland Jr. (Bobby Wagner)

DB: Derwin James (Sean Taylor), Cam Sutton (Darrelle Revis)
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You are a certifiable idiot. I hate Alabama but how can you not have a single defensive player for them on your completely baseless and arbitrary list of players you decided to make this comparison list of after seeing them play in a bowl game? You have Guarantano, a kid you've only seen in a few throwaway drills on youtube over Deshaun Watson, one of the winningest QB's with comprehensive talent and will surely be a top ten draft pick. It's not just insanity, it's sad. Please stop.
 
#154
#154
ptclaus98 said:
You are a certifiable idiot. I hate Alabama but how can you not have a single defensive player for them on your completely baseless and arbitrary list of players you decided to make this comparison list of after seeing them play in a bowl game? You have Guarantano, a kid you've only seen in a few throwaway drills on youtube over Deshaun Watson, one of the winningest QB's with comprehensive talent and will surely be a top ten draft pick. It's not just insanity, it's sad. Please stop.
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Alabama has more average to above average NFL players on their roster than anyone else. That is why they succeed. Its more their depth than top line talent.

I don't see any elite NFL players starting on the 2016 Alabama team. The guy with the highest pro potential IMO is CB Marlon Humphrey. But I need to see alot more out of him. On offense they have no future NFL studs. Only guy who I like is WR Calvin Ridley. But like Humphrey I need to see more from him. Guys like Jonathan Allen that get alot of hype are simply average NFL players. They are not superstars. My list up there is of guys I believe will be superstars.

My concern with Watson is I don't trust his durability. He takes alot of big shots. Already has an ACL injury in his past. And almost ever game I see him adjusting that knew brace.

Plus tell me the last time a QB with big time success in college where he was a heisman finalist and playing for national titles actually lived up to the hype and had success in the NFL? Typically its the guys who are overlooked in college like Russell Wilson and Dak Prescott that have the great NFL careers versus the guys like RG3 and Andrew Luck that have all the college hype.

Josh Dobbs will be in the NFL what people think Watson will be.
 
#155
#155
A couple of new comps after more film study:

RB Saquon Barkley = LaDanian Tomlinson

WR Antonio Callaway = Isaac Bruce

Along with Derwin James, these are my favorite prospects for the 2018 draft. Once again here is my top 5 prospects:

1. Saquon Barkley - best RB since Adrian Peterson....a LaDanian Tomlinson clone

2. Derwin James - best safety prospect since Sean Taylor and Eric Berry

3. Sam Darnold - Matt Stafford 2.0

4. Antonio Callaway - Isaac Bruce 2.0

5. Arden Key - Simeon Rice 2.0

2017 draft will be the best since 2011. 2018 should be just as good if not better. The NFL will be getting a huge talent infusion over the next 2 years.
 
#156
#156
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Hurd has a great burst through the hole when allowed to run downhill. The problem here was we ran him sideways too much.

Just watch the bowl game against Northwestern again when we ran him from under center. His burst was elite.

Hurd will be a monster in the league.

Pro-bowl talent.
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Let's simplify this; in 589 carries at UT Hurd never showed us sub-4.5 speed on the field. (I'm including the NW game btw) Good athleticism for a guy his size? Absolutely. They are not the same thing.

As for being a "monster in the league" are you saying as a RB or some other position? (pure speculation of course, all of it, but I was curious)
 
#158
#158
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Plus tell me the last time a QB with big time success in college where he was a heisman finalist and playing for national titles actually lived up to the hype and had success in the NFL? Typically its the guys who are overlooked in college like Russell Wilson and Dak Prescott that have the great NFL careers versus the guys like RG3 and Andrew Luck that have all the college hype.
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Jameis Winston

And Andrew Luck? You mean 3 time Pro Bowl/3 time 4K+ yards in a season Andrew Luck? Most yards by a QB in his first 3 seasons Andrew Luck? Really?
 
#159
#159
hndog609 said:
Jameis Winston

And Andrew Luck? You mean 3 time Pro Bowl/3 time 4K+ yards in a season Andrew Luck? Most yards by a QB in his first 3 seasons Andrew Luck? Really?
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For a guy that claims to know so much about how college talent translates to the NFL, D4H provides no evidence that he watches either.
 
#160
#160
bamawriter said:
His career long is 48 yards.
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And?

What does that have to do with burst?

I already said his long range speed isn't the best hence the reason he got caught from behind.

Hurd is the opposite of Henry. While Henry was slow to get going, once he got up to speed, his top end speed was pretty incredible. Hurd is great when he starts going but flatlines in terms of long range speed. The reason I was always higher on Hurd as a NFL prospect than Henry is because initial burst is more important than long range speed for a RB in the NFL. That is because holes in the NFL are small or don't stay open very long. Compared to college where Henry got to run through gargantuan holes that stayed open for ages.
 
#161
#161
hndog609 said:
Jameis Winston

And Andrew Luck? You mean 3 time Pro Bowl/3 time 4K+ yards in a season Andrew Luck? Most yards by a QB in his first 3 seasons Andrew Luck? Really?
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Jameis Winston has not been very good at all in the NFL. Hasn't made the playoffs yet. He reminds me of Byron Leftwich. I don't see big time NFL stardom for him.

And please tell me where Andrew Luck will be this weekend? That's right. Sitting at home watching the playoffs like us. Luck is one of the most overrated players in NFL history. Talk to me when he's back in the playoffs.
 
#163
#163
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Jameis Winston has not been very good at all in the NFL. Hasn't made the playoffs yet. He reminds me of Byron Leftwich. I don't see big time NFL stardom for him.

And please tell me where Andrew Luck will be this weekend? That's right. Sitting at home watching the playoffs like us. Luck is one of the most overrated players in NFL history. Talk to me when he's back in the playoffs.
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Jameis is in year two. His team had the first pick. It might take a minute to make the playoffs.

Luck still has no help. The colts franchise has been a disaster for years. Peyton helped cover that up.
 
#164
#164
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Jameis Winston has not been very good at all in the NFL. Hasn't made the playoffs yet. He reminds me of Byron Leftwich. I don't see big time NFL stardom for him.

And please tell me where Andrew Luck will be this weekend? That's right. Sitting at home watching the playoffs like us. Luck is one of the most overrated players in NFL history. Talk to me when he's back in the playoffs.
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"Jameis Winston has not been very good at all in the NFL." WTF is wrong with you? NFL ROTY and Pro Bowl is plenty adequate.

The only place I care where Luck is happens to be what he's done as a QB. Team success is just that and a different discussion. Luck has been in the league 5 seasons and finished in the top 10 in passing yardage 3 of those and been to 3 Pro Bowls. Deal with it.
 
#166
#166
The Orange Pants said:
Jameis is in year two. His team had the first pick. It might take a minute to make the playoffs.

Luck still has no help. The colts franchise has been a disaster for years. Peyton helped cover that up.
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Peyton made the playoffs consistently with no help. Aaron Rodgers is in the playoffs with a WR playing RB. Elite generational QBs create their own help.

I'm not saying Luck is a bad QB. He's just overrated. Nowhere close to an elite QB.

IMO Derek Carr (a guy with an unremarkable college career) is already better than him. He's a guy who looks like the elite generational talent. Not Andrew Luck. Similarly its Russell Wilson that looks like the elite generational QB rather than heisman and national title winner Cam Newton.

The best pro QBs are rarely the guys who get all the hype in college. They're typically the overlooked guys.
 
#167
#167
hndog609 said:
"Jameis Winston has not been very good at all in the NFL." WTF is wrong with you? NFL ROTY and Pro Bowl is plenty adequate.

The only place I care where Luck is happens to be what he's done as a QB. Team success is just that and a different discussion. Luck has been in the league 5 seasons and finished in the top 10 in passing yardage 3 of those and been to 3 Pro Bowls. Deal with it.
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Come on now. The official ROY is the awarded by Associated Press and Todd Gurley won the award last year.

You are citing the Pepsi ROY which is awarded thru fan voting online.

Be serious. Online fan voting doesn't make you ROY. For the record, while the AP and everyone else named Odell Beckham Jr. the ROY in 2014. The fan vote gave the Pepsi ROY to Teddy Bridgewater.

Please stop citing joke awards.
 
#168
#168
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
A couple of new comps after more film study:

RB Saquon Barkley = LaDanian Tomlinson

WR Antonio Callaway = Isaac Bruce

Along with Derwin James, these are my favorite prospects for the 2018 draft. Once again here is my top 5 prospects:

1. Saquon Barkley - best RB since Adrian Peterson....a LaDanian Tomlinson clone

2. Derwin James - best safety prospect since Sean Taylor and Eric Berry

3. Sam Darnold - Matt Stafford 2.0

4. Antonio Callaway - Isaac Bruce 2.0

5. Arden Key - Simeon Rice 2.0

2017 draft will be the best since 2011. 2018 should be just as good if not better. The NFL will be getting a huge talent infusion over the next 2 years.
Click to expand...

Once again, you're comparing a guy who had a fair catch at the 1 yard line to another technician at WR. At least come up with realistic comparisons.
 
#169
#169
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Peyton made the playoffs consistently with no help. Aaron Rodgers is in the playoffs with a WR playing RB. Elite generational QBs create their own help.

I'm not saying Luck is a bad QB. He's just overrated. Nowhere close to an elite QB.

IMO Derek Carr (a guy with an unremarkable college career) is already better than him. He's a guy who looks like the elite generational talent. Not Andrew Luck. Similarly its Russell Wilson that looks like the elite generational QB rather than heisman and national title winner Cam Newton.

The best pro QBs are rarely the guys who get all the hype in college. They're typically the overlooked guys.
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Derek Carr had a great college career. You also think 40 yard dashes actually matter.
 
#170
#170
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Bad o-line. Poor scheme fit.
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But UT's offensive line improved, at least marginally, each year. Kamara and Kelly certainly had no trouble running behind it this year.

Yet, despite that improvement, Hurd's ypc dropped each year. And in terms of hitting the hole, Hurd became less and less explosive each year.

In 2014, 51% of Hurd's carries went for 3 yards or less.
In 2015, 57%.
In 2016, 59%. Out of 122 carries, only 51 went for 4 yards or more.

Hurd is just a guy. Decent back. Nothing more.
 
#171
#171
Dobbs 4 Heisman said:
Come on now. The official ROY is the awarded by Associated Press and Todd Gurley won the award last year.

You are citing the Pepsi ROY which is awarded thru fan voting online.

Be serious. Online fan voting doesn't make you ROY. For the record, while the AP and everyone else named Odell Beckham Jr. the ROY in 2014. The fan vote gave the Pepsi ROY to Teddy Bridgewater.

Please stop citing joke awards.
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Pepsi voting trumps your forum opinion by about Carl Sagan numbers so there's that.

At any rate Pro Bowls are synonymous with NFL success, we both know it*, and both cited players have achieved that level.

*You often cite pro bowls in your predictions. In fact we only have to go back to post 152 in just this thread to demonstrate that fact. Sometimes people come off looking worse trying to save face than taking the loss...that's you at this point in this particular discussion.
 
#172
#172
Burger said:
Once again, you're comparing a guy who had a fair catch at the 1 yard line to another technician at WR. At least come up with realistic comparisons.
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Antonio Callaway is the best WR in college football going into 2017. He's special and will dominate in the NFL. He just needs to stay out of trouble.
 
#173
#173
Burger said:
Derek Carr had a great college career. You also think 40 yard dashes actually matter.
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Derek Carr was not the face of college football. Sheesh some of you are thick. Everyone who gets drafted into the NFL has a great college career. What I'm saying is no one had Derek Carr as a surefire elite NFL QB. If they did, he wouldn't have fallen to the second round. Everyone proclaimed Andrew Luck the best QB prospect since John Elway. And so far he's been anything but that.

I expect Watson to have an epic Vince Young like performance Monday in the national title game against Alabama once again. And once again the hype train will be off the hook for him. He'll probably be taken 1st overall and have expectations to be an elite NFL QB. Those guys typically don't live up to that hype.

Typically the elite NFL guys have college careers like Dobbs. Very good but never really the guy who all of college football is talking about.
 
#174
#174
bamawriter said:
But UT's offensive line improved, at least marginally, each year. Kamara and Kelly certainly had no trouble running behind it this year.

Yet, despite that improvement, Hurd's ypc dropped each year. And in terms of hitting the hole, Hurd became less and less explosive each year.

In 2014, 51% of Hurd's carries went for 3 yards or less.
In 2015, 57%.
In 2016, 59%. Out of 122 carries, only 51 went for 4 yards or more.

Hurd is just a guy. Decent back. Nothing more.
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Kelly and Kamara were better scheme fits for the zone read. Hurd is a pro style downhill RB. In a different scheme he would be more successful.
 
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