Desmond Oliver to ETSU (maybe)

#26
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#26
Imo..... this why protests shouldn’t be allowed when people are representing their university.... This protest in particular.... several white people/boosters/fans are not going to understand why minorities are protesting bc they don’t live it..... at the same time the people doing the protesting is not going to understand why that flag means so much to some people..... The university is in a really difficult spot between the two groups.
Big fat NO to any suggestion of voice suppression. I mean, that's allegedly the entire reason of this debacle. You are asking for a disaster.
 
#27
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#27
I mean, it could also be ETSU releasing information they are going after a black coach when they actually aren’t to say “Look see we tried to hire a black coach!”...not saying that’s happening but it’s a possibility.
They we be profoundly dumb to not do that, regardless of intention imo.

I'll throw out that if they do hire Oliver or another black coach, that doesn't necessarily disprove anything about the Shay debacle. Then again, I guess none of us know all the details of either situation for sure. It's all speculation. But it's fun.
 
#28

mr.checkerboards

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#28
I mean, it could also be ETSU releasing information they are going after a black coach when they actually aren’t to say “Look see we tried to hire a black coach!”...not saying that’s happening but it’s a possibility.
They just hired one in WBB after letting that coach go. Happened about 2 weeks before this.
 
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#30

volbeast33

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#30
Big fat NO to any suggestion of voice suppression. I mean, that's allegedly the entire reason of this debacle. You are asking for a disaster.
I disagree..... I think you can do whatever you want to on your own time....when you are representing the university or any job than you don’t have the same privileges.
 
#31
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#31
I disagree..... I think you can do whatever you want to on your own time....when you are representing the university or any job than you don’t have the same privileges.
I don't disagree with that point. I do disagree with any governing body deciding to implement what you suggested.
 
#33

azvol03

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#33
Big fat NO to any suggestion of voice suppression. I mean, that's allegedly the entire reason of this debacle. You are asking for a disaster.
“Voice suppression”? I don’t know WTH that means—not being allowed to SING the National Anthem??? I guess you mean the players should be able to EXPRESS their 19-20 year old brainy thoughts anywhere or anyplace. They’re kids. They get their impulses from social media and join the latest mass mentality. Deep, philosophical principles? Sure.

I don’t give a flip what they do, say or think on their own time—-but, when they don the university’s uniform, on the university’s property, playing in a university’s sponsored game and in front of the university‘s supporters, they must REPRESENT the university, selflessly, rather than demonstrate their private and (I’m sure) “thoroughly fleshed-out” philosophies. And, yes, I AM the old man who doesn’t want kids playing on his front lawn riding Little Tykes toys.
 
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#34
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#34
“Voice suppression”? I don’t know WTH that means—not being allowed to SING the National Anthem??? I guess you mean the players should be able to EXPRESS their 19-20 year old brainy thoughts anywhere or anyplace. They’re kids. They get their impulses from social media and join the latest mass mentality. Deep, philosophical principles? Sure.

I don’t give a flip what they do, say or think on their own time—-but, when they don the university’s uniform, on the university’s property, playing in a university’s sponsored game and in front of the university‘s supporters, they must REPRESENT the university, selflessly, rather than demonstrate their private and (I’m sure) “thoroughly fleshed-out” philosophies. And, yes, I AM the old man who doesn’t want kids playing on his front lawn riding Little Tykes toys.
A lot of people think the way you do. I still lean toward freedom. I don't see a lot of good in making kids feel like their opinions don't matter. I don't see good in it for anyone of any age for that matter.
 
#35

BigOrangeNC

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#35
I think they have 6 players in the transfer portal and its gonna be very hard to recruit there for awhile. They paid Shay $450k which was his buyout amount and used the word severance in the settlement agreement. It doesn't appear he really resigned on his own terms.
 
#39

cncchris33

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#39
I don’t think so...Maze connection is still there, not as if Oliver was his AAU coach and only connection. I do wonder if potential Clark hire is made because he’s a younger guy with AAU connections, probably knows Maze to an extent.
I wonder if they choose to go with Clark and the guy from South Alabama, now, or if there is a preference to add an older coach back to the mix with Oliver leaving. The dynamic changes a little bit with him gone, I think.
 
#40

InVOLuntary

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#40
A lot of people think the way you do. I still lean toward freedom. I don't see a lot of good in making kids feel like their opinions don't matter. I don't see good in it for anyone of any age for that matter.
Just to be clear, if some students wanted to support the KKK or some other hate group or something similar you'd go the freedom route too? What if in response to some players kneeling, a white teammate chose to wear the blue line us flag? It's a slippery slope.
 
#42
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#42
Just to be clear, if some students wanted to support the KKK or some other hate group or something similar you'd go the freedom route too? What if in response to some players kneeling, a white teammate chose to wear the blue line us flag? It's a slippery slope.
If either of those hypotheticals happened, yeah maybe I'd change my tune.

On the actual topic at hand, you know my opinion.
 
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#43

bleedingTNorange

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#43
I wonder if they choose to go with Clark and the guy from South Alabama, now, or if there is a preference to add an older coach back to the mix with Oliver leaving. The dynamic changes a little bit with him gone, I think.
Rob had mentioned he didn’t see them hiring Jonas Hayes if Oliver was here because of recruiting overlap, I wonder if they’d look to him assuming Oliver leaves...he’s younger but quite experienced still.
 
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#45

InVOLuntary

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#45
If either of those hypotheticals happened, yeah maybe I'd change my tune.

On the actual topic at hand, you know my opinion.
So you're ok with free speech if you agree with the message?

Look, I'm not trying to be argumentative, I just think with anything like this, whether you're a private company, a government entity, or whatever, it's best to remain apolitical. If it's truly free speech, you have to be prepared for speech you don't agree with. It's a stage that's provided by the university, they should have a right to limit what's on that stage. JMO.
 
#46
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#46
So you're ok with free speech if you agree with the message?

Look, I'm not trying to be argumentative, I just think with anything like this, whether you're a private company, a government entity, or whatever, it's best to remain apolitical. If it's truly free speech, you have to be prepared for speech you don't agree with. It's a stage that's provided by the university, they should have a right to limit what's on that stage. JMO.
Sounds like we agree on the whole. My personal call is do not put policies in place to limit expression. That doesn't mean I don't support any institution's right to govern how they see fit.

We're really beating around the bush because the issue at hand is that athletes are protesting racism and police brutality. In theory, I would think all Americans could agree on that. There are a lot of people, seemingly like yourself, who choose to make assumptions and draw conclusions about how others think and feel. Imo, in no world is it right to claim that college athletes "don't even know what they're protesting about." Seems like a lot of people just look at these protests and automatically associate the protestors with the violent rioters we've seen over the last several months. I understand that some just cannot and/or will not separate these ideas for whatever reason.

So where we probably disagree is that I think players are truly protesting racism and police brutality, and I think it'd be pretty crappy of ETSU or any other institution or business to choose to not support the protests. Obviously the institution can do whatever it wants.
 
#48

InVOLuntary

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#48
Sounds like we agree on the whole. My personal call is do not put policies in place to limit expression. That doesn't mean I don't support any institution's right to govern how they see fit.

We're really beating around the bush because the issue at hand is that athletes are protesting racism and police brutality. In theory, I would think all Americans could agree on that. There are a lot of people, seemingly like yourself, who choose to make assumptions and draw conclusions about how others think and feel. Imo, in no world is it right to claim that college athletes "don't even know what they're protesting about." Seems like a lot of people just look at these protests and automatically associate the protestors with the violent rioters we've seen over the last several months. I understand that some just cannot and/or will not separate these ideas for whatever reason.

So where we probably disagree is that I think players are truly protesting racism and police brutality, and I think it'd be pretty crappy of ETSU or any other institution or business to choose to not support the protests. Obviously the institution can do whatever it wants.
My point is that you can't choose what you support and not. You become the arbiter of what's supposedly a good cause and what's not. I think we can agree that the majority of police men and women are are good people. If an athlete wore a "back the blue" t-shirt, some would consider that as terrible. You're always going to offend some folks. My point is the athletic stage shouldn't be the stage to advance social justice. It's a time and place thing for me.
 
#50

azvol03

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#50
A lot of people think the way you do. I still lean toward freedom. I don't see a lot of good in making kids feel like their opinions don't matter. I don't see good in it for anyone of any age for that matter.
Again, I’m reflecting an unparalleled unwokeness: —ALL opinions don’t matter. At the very least, not equally. Shocker, I know. I willingly admit my opinion on this topic just doesn’t matter. No one has a right to have their opinions matter. Heard? Nope. Everyone has a RIGHT to speak their opinions. No one has a right to be heard. Rude? I guess, but no one has a right to NOT be offended.
 

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