Decision Time for SEC

[turbovol]

I blame the Big 10 for taking two schools, UCLA and USC, that were not even remotely close to the region they play in and tore apart the Pac 12. From this day on, everyone should hate the Big 10 and publically root against their schools and avoid supporting them in any capacity.

Yea, that was a desperate grab by the Big10, in reaction to the SEC's expansion--but it was also a desperate grab by Pac12 teams who haven't been very good and haven't gotten much TV exposure in recent years--a problem for the Pac12 as a whole. But then IMO the SEC should not have taken Texas and Oklahoma. Just a pure greed move by both the SEC and Texas/Oklahoma. It was obvious before that move that conference expansion/realignment had spun out of control--and it's just gotten stupid since. I supposed will soon just end up with ONE Super conference of 25 teams or somesuch, which will be really stupid. All the conference commissioners, university presidents, network sports chiefs have lost their heads and now nobody knows what the f--k is going on--not to mention all the madness unleashed by NIL and the transfer portal. It's basically anarchy--or close to it. Conferences with 18/20 teams aren't really conferences anymore but more like rush-hour NYC subway cars--a large number of schools packed cheek-by-jowl in a small vehicle hurtling down a track in the darkness, destination unknown.

 

[Hairy Vols]

Let’s go back to say 1980. Out of those NCs, multiple ones have been named a total of 4 times (1990, 1991, 1997 and 2003). You say the industry needs work? That’s a statistically insignificant number of outliers. So your point blank statement is just demonstrably false.

Ya it does. There should never be a dispute for a national champion. It’s why playoffs work. If they didn’t work why does every single sport use a playoff system to determine a champion? Because it eliminates the need for human error. The fact it’s happened even once shows the system doesnt work. Because if it happened in 2003 it will happen again. For a billion dollar industry once is unacceptable let alone how many times it’s happened in the NCAA? 30+ in history?

 

[sjt18]

Not a fan of the appearance of changes being out of control and possibly short on logic. Just don't have any comfort zone that the coast to coast BIGx is practical and sustainable across all sports. I am wildly SPECULATING that somewhere down the road the remaining POWER? conferences will ATTEMPT to put some practicality into the travel aspects.

Could we end up with them withdrawing football from the NCAA and letting the rest of the sports remain?

Could we end up with a giant meeting of the minds and having a massive realignment instead of this chaos grab game we have had of late? Can't fix it piece meal I don't think. I could see a NEW WORLD ORDER where the bigtime far west schools would be joined by SOME of the most western schools in the current SEC and BIG and with those two picking the bones of the ACC. Could the SEC exchange Texas, TAM, MO and OK for FSU, Clemson, NC and VT? Could the BIG give up Nebraska and Iowa in exchange for Pitt and ND (finally forcing their hand). Or something along those lines for STARTERS. Do we see other adjustments like replacing Vandy and Northwestern type schools. Would ARK rather go with the west group? Would the Texas schools prefer to be split up again? Should they look for different adjustments to end up with four conferences instead of 3. I know the loss of the real Pac? and ACC would be hard to swallow, but the new world order in football driven by NIL and the Portal will create greater hardships on those that can't play the money game, so why keep them on an annual schedule?

That would still leave the new WESTERN conference with inefficient logistical issues, but put some reason back into the other big 2. The ACC residual might add Vandy, NW and a few other more BB competitive and centric schools and reformulate, same for the Pac. Some other conferences could pick up the rest based on geography.

I have long advocated for 3 conferences with 18 teams divided into 3 6 team divisions each. Playing 5 division teams and rotating 2 from each of the other 2. Division winners and highest rated non winner enter a semi then final game deal. Still leaves room to schedule natural rivalries when separated by the new conferences. There will be costs in that area. So some of the marginal schools could work their way into the new power conferences to fill up to 18,

I am sure there may be other more logical adjustments they could employ, but this would be a starting point for the rebuild of college athletics. I am sure Duke will not like it.

If football withdrew and realigned keeping the NEW conference groupings for BB and the Olympic sports just would not make sense. Football is the cash cow and needs to drive the train. We should be able to live with the results of a 48 team setup in FB.

This is the failure of big government, socialism, top driven corporations, public education, and every other organization that thinks that the "elites" know best. It may be "intuitive" to think that way but it ALWAYS produces a sub-par outcome. The plan is not determined by any kind of proof by failure. It is determined by politics causing failures to be band-aided or ignored.

It isn't that the other way lacks planning. It encourages MANY different plans, trial and error, and eventually the optimum or near optimum outcome. IF we want the best outcome then we do not want a top down approach.

 

[Hairy Vols]

This is the failure of big government, socialism, top driven corporations, public education, and every other organization that thinks that the "elites" know best. It may be "intuitive" to think that way but it ALWAYS produces a sub-par outcome. The plan is not determined by any kind of proof by failure. It is determined by politics causing failures to be band-aided or ignored.

It isn't that the other way lacks planning. It encourages MANY different plans, trial and error, and eventually the optimum or near optimum outcome. IF we want the best outcome then we do not want a top down approach.

Not really interested in debating politics but you do realize the majority of these moves come from a financial capitalistic push for more revenue? With investments, if you’re not growing you’re failing, is literally why these conferences are realigning so much.

As stated before I personally don’t have an issue with it, but the socialism comment confuses me. In an ideal socialist society (or even assuming you’re slightly referencing communism) the ideal scenario for both of them is a society without a higher form of power. You’re complaining about an oligarchy correct?

 

[sjt18]

Not really interested in debating politics but you do realize the majority of these moves come from a financial capitalistic push for more revenue? With investments, if you’re not growing you’re failing, is literally why these conferences are realigning so much.

As stated before I personally don’t have an issue with it, but the socialism comment confuses me. In an ideal socialist society (or even assuming you’re slightly referencing communism) the ideal scenario for both of them is a society without a higher form of power. You’re complaining about an oligarchy correct?

The comparison wasn't meant to be comprehensive. Socialism never works in practice. The "noble" idea of "from each according to his ability and to each according to his need" sounds good. It just doesn't work and actually contradicts human nature and Natural Law. It is unjust to reward two people the same when one contributes more.

Socialism always results in some form of oligarchy simply because people will not act against their nature and Natural Law without being forced to do so. And it actually doesn't matter what label you slap on it. Socialist "democracies" inevitably develop an exclusive political class. Because of the concentration of power and wealth in one entity... it also assures that political class is corrupt.


Lastly, it would be a mistake to consider college sports a free market exercise right now. But free market principles to determine the best form that optimizes satisfaction for all parties including players and fans... is still the best way to go. There are competing interests so there is no way of making everyone completely happy.

 

[JRich]

The changes in college football are reflective of the cultural changes of the United States, it's target audience. The reason the SEC has been successful and lucrative is because people in the Southeast care about college football, as do most in the Midwest (Big10) and some in the Plains (Big12). They spend the money on tickets, travel, and merchandise. The tiered nature of these three conferences is reflective of the fanbase's desire to support the game in those regions. College football does poor in the Northeast, and the Atlantic coast, which is why premier players and coaches don't consider those programs. College football is fading fast on the West coast and Mountain states and the blue bloods are jumping ship to compensate for the losses in revenue over the last decade.

They are all chasing the money, and it all makes sense to me. OK and TX to SEC makes sense, the remaining teams in the Big 12 and the Mountain states joining forces makes sense, and the legacy blue bloods on the West coast are just trying to save themselves, although I think they should have considered being independents and focused on urban and national markets rather than joining the Big10 - that seemed like a desperate move.

 

[RDU VOL#14]

Ya it does. There should never be a dispute for a national champion. It’s why playoffs work. If they didn’t work why does every single sport use a playoff system to determine a champion? Because it eliminates the need for human error. The fact it’s happened even once shows the system doesnt work. Because if it happened in 2003 it will happen again. For a billion dollar industry once is unacceptable let alone how many times it’s happened in the NCAA? 30+ in history?

People get all nostalgic for the bowl alliance and a lot of the old parts of the game. I get it to a degree, but every single level of football has and has had a playoff to determine a champion forever. The fact that we’ve had a CFP for barely a decade is ridiculous. The fact that the Rose Bowl is still holding up the process of allowing the CFP to evolve is absurd. People complain about $ being the problem w/ the game today. $$ has been holding up the game for decades and decades with the back room days of the bowl chairman lining their pockets forever and ever.