Coaching Change Will = Kiffin 2.0

#128
#128
Sarms58 said:
Sometimes you fire a coach even though his record isn't that bad but because he's moving in the wrong direction...Bill Battle comes to mind.

Sometimes you fire a coach because his record is bad and the program is declining...Dereck Dooley comes to mind.

But it's more rare to fire a coach who has improved the record and has the team on an upward trajectory...
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Actually to fire a coach for the third makes absolutely no sense.
 
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#129
#129
I think if we get the money right we might be shocked how easy it is to hire a coach
 
#131
#131
TheDeeble said:
What are you considering a "big time" coach?

A coach ready to make the move from a mid major/respectable to a top program? Sure. It would be appealing and pay better probably.

A coach already at an established top program? Not going to happen. Money will be matched.
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A coach with a proven track record of success at an elite level. I'm biased as far as the S.E.C. goes. If you aren't in this conference, then it's not big time football.
 
#132
#132
TheDeeble said:
What are you considering a "big time" coach?

A coach ready to make the move from a mid major/respectable to a top program? Sure. It would be appealing and pay better probably.

A coach already at an established top program? Not going to happen. Money will be matched.
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Doesn't necessarily have to a current college coach.
 
#134
#134
Lane Kiffin is the best coach we have had since Fulmer. He had a better job opportunity show up and he took it. I know USC and UT are basically lateral moves but USC was a better fit for his family at the time. I was pissed too, but let's be realistic, he nearly beat Bama in the one year he was here. He was a QB magician.
 
#135
#135
GetEmVols said:
Lane Kiffin is the best coach we have had since Fulmer. He had a better job opportunity show up and he took it. I know USC and UT are basically lateral moves but USC was a better fit for his family at the time. I was pissed too, but let's be realistic, he nearly beat Bama in the one year he was here. He was a QB magician.
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#136
#136
UneducatedGuess said:
While several are out harassing our recruits and blistering our message board to feel like you matter, a few of us remember what happened in 2008 when Tennessee was ripe for a coaching change...the cupboard was stocked...
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No it wasn't. Fulmer left one... ONE DT on the roster with anything close to SEC ability. Kiffin started two undersized former walk ons and a very undersized RS Fr on the OL. UT had very, very little at LB. Hardesty was really the only RB... and he'd had a career of knee injuries. Crompton was the QB.

It was a hard situation because of Fulmer's time and success... but he was fired two years too late to leave a decent roster.

Not sure who is harassing recruits. I don't know why a UT fan would do that even if they want Jones gone. But NOTHING negatively impacts recruiting any more than poor coaching and losing. NOTHING boosts recruting more than great coaching and winning. There is NOTHING that can be said on a chat board that will impact these recruits more than what Jones does for the rest of the season.

John Currie lead a nation wide search to hire Lane Kiffin.

While Hamilton gets the rap, it was the Associate AD, John Currie, who was in charge of the task.

Keep that in mind as you demand change for the sake of change. Perhaps the greatest change will be letting a new QB, new RBs, new WRs, new OC, and new position coaches evolve and grow.
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I didn't like Kiffin but who knows what would have happened had he stayed. Contrary to what he thought, UT was a better fit for him than USC was. If he had kept that staff together for 3 years... UT would have been loaded with talent regardless of what he did.

That said... Jones gets how many mulligans... but Currie is responsible because Kiffin hosed UT? An Associate AD who is responsible for presenting candidates... not choosing them?

Just a thought. History shows us that fire everyone under the current leadership is a recipe for disaster.
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No. That's revisionism... and it isn't even relevant.

You compare to what other programs have done to succeed and fail. Programs that tolerate mediocre coaches... sink. Programs that demand coaches perform (or else)... rise. Pretty much that simple.

The worst thing UT did with Fulmer is not quietly ask him to step aside after 2005. The signs of decline had been there since Cut left. Discipline was non-existent on or off the field. Loyalty to assistants outweighed holding sub par coaches accountable. UT couldn't pull the trigger because of what Fulmer HAD BEEN.... even though by then he was a has been. The game had passed him by and his being outclassed by the SEC's new blood showed it.

That is NOT a problem with Jones. He doesn't have a bank full of credits.
 
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#137
#137
BJWeeks said:
The people that want to keep Jones are the same ones who thought Dooley needed more time
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Maybe some are...Dooley was a 0.500 coach at a directional school who showed no real talent for recruiting or coaching... it was clear to most that the program was in worse shape after three years of Dooley than it was when he took over. No sane person could argue that Jones hasn't improved the program. They question with Jones is where is his ceiling? Some are sure he has hit it already at 9 wins but others think there might be more improvements in him. Regardless of which camp you're in, finances pretty much dictate we keep Jones through 2018.
Hopefully he will win the east either this year or next but if not the administration will have had the time to make a sound decision.
 
#138
#138
UneducatedGuess said:
While several are out harassing our recruits and blistering our message board to feel like you matter, a few of us remember what happened in 2008 when Tennessee was ripe for a coaching change...the cupboard was stocked...players weren't being developed....and a new offense struggled to be installed.

John Currie lead a nation wide search to hire Lane Kiffin.

While Hamilton gets the rap, it was the Associate AD, John Currie, who was in charge of the task.

Keep that in mind as you demand change for the sake of change. Perhaps the greatest change will be letting a new QB, new RBs, new WRs, new OC, and new position coaches evolve and grow.

Just a thought. History shows us that fire everyone under the current leadership is a recipe for disaster.
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That's a very cowardly way to think. Just because we weren't successful before, we can't be this time? It worked for bama, Ohio state, Michigan, and Washington. The one denominator with all those hires though is the administrations put together huge offers for proven coaches. That's how you make a hire without taking a huge step backwards
 
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#139
#139
UneducatedGuess said:
I remember being thrilled to make a bowl game. What started all that?

John Currie.
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If just getting to a bowl game "thrilled" you and is your response to the possibility of keeping a mediocre coach... then stop calling yourself a UT fan. UT SHOULD BE in the top tier of CFB. We should be DISAPPOINTED with the kinds of bowls you get for going 8-4.
 
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#140
#140
JMSqb11 said:
Your username speaks for itself.... We don't have Hamilton or Dave Hart. There are multiple big fish out there that we can seriously pursue.

Hiring Lane was all about a culture change from Fulmer with a dumbass Athletic Director.

You're lying to yourself if you think us changing coaches this offseason is anything similar to the coaching search of 2008.
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This is spot on. 110% agree
 
#141
#141
VolsSportsFan said:
Also, hiring Kiffin wasn't nearly as much of a problem as hiring Dooley; and don't start with the "He was all we could get" BS. He was brought in as a "safe" hire because he was a good 'ol southern boy who said "britches".
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AND we chose him over Sumlin. Man we made every wrong move possible almost. Butch has been a success though regardless if he wins and stays or goes.
 
#144
#144
jakez4ut said:
we don't have the greatest track record in regards to these things, and my confidence overall in the leadership on the Hill is low. between the big money, the athletic department, and university leadership on the whole....that's a lot that needs to get on the same page, and rarely has it.
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Haven't been a United front since Dickey left. Hopefully Currie is a strong AD but kissing Haslam butt during his initial press conference implies he isn't there yet.
 
#146
#146
Volsfaninva917 said:
Lane Kiffin was a good hire at the time, no one saw USC coming open. So Currie did a great job

Derek Dooley was a terrible hire, not hired by Currie

Butch Jones has been a mediocre higher so far, not hired by Currie
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Butch has been a successful hire ultimately. He was charged with getting this train back on the tracks and he has done that. He just can't seem to get it pulled into the station
 
#147
#147
UneducatedGuess said:
While several are out harassing our recruits and blistering our message board to feel like you matter, a few of us remember what happened in 2008 when Tennessee was ripe for a coaching change...the cupboard was stocked...players weren't being developed....and a new offense struggled to be installed.

John Currie lead a nation wide search to hire Lane Kiffin.

While Hamilton gets the rap, it was the Associate AD, John Currie, who was in charge of the task.

Keep that in mind as you demand change for the sake of change. Perhaps the greatest change will be letting a new QB, new RBs, new WRs, new OC, and new position coaches evolve and grow.

Just a thought. History shows us that fire everyone under the current leadership is a recipe for disaster.
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No one is "demanding change for the sake of change." No one.....everyone is sick of barely beating cream puffs and needing miracles to beat our peers. I've tried to support Butch, but my patience is running out. It's been five years. It's on him now.
 
#148
#148
sjt18 said:
It was a hard situation because of Fulmer's time and success... but he was fired two years too late to leave a decent roster.

The worst thing UT did with Fulmer is not quietly ask him to step aside after 2005.
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So first off, you would have Fulmer fired after the 2006 season when he went from 5-6 (2005) to 9-4 (2006). You would have fired him when he had a 4 game win improvement after his first losing season ever?

Secondly, Fulmer went 19-8 with an SEC Title game appearance after his first losing season. That's not horrible. Shoulda fired him after Outback Bowl Game honestly.


Going into 2008, he had a stellar recruiting class coming in. He just made a bad hire at OC and Hamilton was an idiot. He was a bean counter. For some reason, he was a moron cause you don't fire Fulmer in 2008 after giving him that 6 million dollar extension the year prior. That's what I never understood. You also don't fire Phil in 2008 as he always bounced back from a down year with an average of 3 wins better.

Coupled with the $6,000,000 extension and historically bouncing back after a down year, you don't fire the guy.

There also weren't a lot of hot coaching prospects that had a great track record that blew away Phil's record of the 4 years previously.

Anyway, we can all agree Hamilton was a complete asshat who had no idea what he was doing.
 
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#149
#149
UneducatedGuess said:
While several are out harassing our recruits and blistering our message board to feel like you matter, a few of us remember what happened in 2008 when Tennessee was ripe for a coaching change...the cupboard was stocked...players weren't being developed....and a new offense struggled to be installed.

John Currie lead a nation wide search to hire Lane Kiffin.

While Hamilton gets the rap, it was the Associate AD, John Currie, who was in charge of the task.

Keep that in mind as you demand change for the sake of change. Perhaps the greatest change will be letting a new QB, new RBs, new WRs, new OC, and new position coaches evolve and grow.

Just a thought. History shows us that fire everyone under the current leadership is a recipe for disaster.
Click to expand...

Currie may have led the search, but Hamilton made the decision. Currie may have agreed with it, but your suggestion that Currie was in charge is just wrong.
 
#150
#150
chattavol420 said:
That's a very cowardly way to think. Just because we weren't successful before, we can't be this time? It worked for bama, Ohio state, Michigan, and Washington. The one denominator with all those hires though is the administrations put together huge offers for proven coaches. That's how you make a hire without taking a huge step backwards
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You need to research who our current AD is and his track record for spending money on coaches.
 
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