Coaches Salaries

[volmanjr]

of course, your entitled to your opinion, your a vn mod so yours doesnt get edited. But is it really asking so much that you actually defend your position with something of substance as opposed to "tired of fulmer bashing thread" what is that contributing to the thread?

the majority opinion or the herd opinion is the apologist position, its not the critic position. every vn mod on this board has a pro-fulmer position.

So me being a Moderator (who by the way has never edited any of your posts as long as they were clean and weren't personal attacks) makes my opinion less valid what a crock. If you don't like the "pro-Fulmer" position go start your own board, where you can reguritate to same spew over and over all you want and you can edit out all the sheep that come to visit.

 

[OWB]

of course, your entitled to your opinion, your a vn mod so yours doesnt get edited. But is it really asking so much that you actually defend your position with something of substance as opposed to "tired of fulmer bashing thread" what is that contributing to the thread?

Come on oklavol, you're smart enough to know that this is a lame statement. There's a reason that volmanjr's posts don't get edited and it's not because he's a mod.

 

[U-T]

If you don't like the "pro-Fulmer" position go start your own board, where you can reguritate to same spew over and over all you want and you can edit out all the sheep that come to visit.

:dance2: :dance2: :dance2: :dance2:

 

[CSpindizzy]

Answer me this.....if this was "Just one bad year" should Fulmer have kept everyone on staff instead of firing him? Answer that. Should all of those unemployed coaches still be on board? I mean if this was a fluke year, there was no reason to fire anyone correct?

 

[volfan2024]

If you apologists had your way, we'd probably still have bill battle and wade houston as coaches. it takes a lot more to criticize fulmer then it does to come in here and :air_kiss: :moon2:

!Sus palabras no tienen sentido! :wavey:

 

[U-T]

Answer me this.....if this was "Just one bad year" should Fulmer have kept everyone on staff instead of firing him? Answer that.

Here is the answer to all the Fulmer-haters

No

 

[CSpindizzy]

Here is the answer to all the Fulmer-haters

No

I'm asking you.....if that is your answer are you saying there was good reason for Fulmer to fire them?

 

[U-T]

I think there was a very good reason.

Our offense crumbled and blew beyond epic proportions.

I blame both the coaches and players. Sanders being fired was fantastic though I don't think he was the main source of our problems.

 

[CSpindizzy]

I think there was a very good reason.

Our offense crumbled and blew beyond epic proportions.

I blame both the coaches and players. Sanders being fired was fantastic though I don't think he was the main source of our problems.

Now we're getting somewhere. Did this all suddenly happen this year? Or by some strange allignment of the planets could this have been something festering for more than this one year?

 

[U-T]

Did this all suddenly happen this year?

We had a bad year, one in which everything fell apart. It sucked but it can be fixed. We won the East in 2004.

We have more wins than any other SEC team since 1997 and have SECC's and a NC to show for it.

To suddenly think Fulmer can't regroup is laughable and part of the Bitchers who can't seem to be happy no matter what.

 

[VolunteerHillbilly]

 

[U-T]

There ya go, Hillbilly

 

[VolunteerHillbilly]

There ya go, Hillbilly

That is much, much better. I already feel more sypathetic to your arguments. I'll try to find something to change mine to.

 

[CSpindizzy]

We had a bad year, one in which everything fell apart. It sucked but it can be fixed. We won the East in 2004.
We have more wins than any other SEC team since 1997 and have SECC's and a NC to show for it.
To suddenly think Fulmer can't regroup is laughable and part of the Bitchers who can't seem to be happy no matter what.

That's not my question. My question is do you think this was some 5-6 flop that appeared in one season or was this something that could have been developing for some time? I'm not asking for records, NC, or any of that. I'm asking the basics of team mental condition, attitude, fundamentals, etc.

I've never said Fulmer can't regroup. Quite the opposite actually. I've clearly and repeatedly stated my reasons for dissatisfaction with Fulmer, all legit. I've even stated my respect for his accomplishments. But I have also stated that it is HIS responsibility as the HC for allowing the program to go from your high rated 2004 team to the 5-6 2005 team with very little loss and nothing but more experience and depth. I will keep bringing up the fact that Fulmer has allowed this every time people claim that Fulmer has done nothing wrong. As long as there are those equating Fulmer with perfection and claiming this past season is a fluke I will reply in kind with "flukes are brief mishaps....like fumbles....not losing 6 games and even to Vandy at home, or repeated penalties, fumbles, false starts, missed routes, bad play calls, etc."

 

[U-T]

That's not my question. My question is do you think this was some 5-6 flop that appeared in one season or was this something that could have been developing for some time?

I would say it was something just for 2005 yet changing OC's was a good move.

 

[VolunteerHillbilly]

I thought this thread was about salaries. Probably most D1 coaches are overpaid when you compare their salaries to that of professors with a similar number of years experience studying and teaching a subject. That aside, a significant part of the compensation comes from the radio and tv shows, athletic apparel contract, etc.

 

[CSpindizzy]

I would say it was something just for 2005 yet changing OC's was a good move.

I'd like to think that since changes were made, this was in fact something just for 2005 as far as record. But if things were kept the same, we'd see another losing season. I personally think there was a team mindset, more prevalent on the offense, that led to this season's results. I seriously doubt that this mindset just appeared overnight to cause this system. I think it came on slowly in the past few years. While our record did not show this, our results in everything else but a record showed this. Finally a 5-6 record came and showed us all what many had feared for a few years.

The fact still remains that the HC is the one ultimately responsible for this. The fact is that the record was the only thing that made the needed changes. The fact is that had our record been 7-4 or even 8-3, our plays and failures would have still been the same. We'd still be missing out on the basics/fundmentals. We'd still be missing routes, dropping passes, not reaching out for passes, making stupid penalties like false starts, fumbling, etc. Change our record to whatever you want and it would not have changed the fact that the main issues and problems were still there. These problems have been there for a couple of years and have been growing. Anyone questioning this was told "hey shut up and be happy with a decent record."

The fact remains that needed changes were made. Enough changes? Only time will tell. While some are content with above .500 ratings and others perhaps will never be content, things have changed and next year will be different. While we hope the difference is wins, lots more of them of course, no one knows for sure what the outcome will be. Until then, we'll all be calling each other nancy's, bandwagoners, sheep, kool aid drinkers and posting and reposting the same arguments and insults over and over. There will be "I told you so's" exchanged on a daily basis by all sides. More fun for all....and editing by the Mods.

To 2006 and all the enjoyment it will bring to us all here at VN...... :toast:

 

[volinbham]

Answer me this.....if this was "Just one bad year" should Fulmer have kept everyone on staff instead of firing him? Answer that. Should all of those unemployed coaches still be on board? I mean if this was a fluke year, there was no reason to fire anyone correct?

The last few seasons have been somewhat up and down compared to Fulmer's first 7 or so years. However, we don't know what changes he has tried within the organization. Some here imply that the Vols have been sliding and Fulmer has done nothing about it, was oblivious, lazy, etc. We simply do not and will not know what he has tried over the last several years. I'm sure he hasn't ignored it and more likely tried to fix things without firing (as a good manager would do). This year showed that staff changes were necessary. But not firing anyone until this year is not the same thing as not trying to improve the team. Look at last year - it was our defense in the Auburn games that was the problem. This year the defense was solid. We went 7-1 in the SEC and made the SECCG - with two 2 freshmen QB's - both of whom got hurt! Hardly a bad year or evidence of the Fulmer death slide into mediocrity, incompetence and poor leadership.

I would imagine that most of us "apologists" are concerned but feel that Fulmer has earned the chance to work on the team in the way he sees fit. If we continue to be non-competitive for a year or two then I would suggest you'll see us (me) call for a change. There is always a regression to the mean - you won't find a coach that is around as long as Fulmer that doesn't have ups and downs. Quite frankly, until this year the downs were mild. I'll stick with Fulmer for a couple of more years rather than yank him on the hopes that some unknown, unamed coach could replace him and the SECC's and NC's magically begin to appear. Even if that person was out there, he wouldn't put up 13 straight years without some downs.

Finally, characterizing Fulmer supporters as sheep, who only see last year as a fluke is a complete overstatement of our (my) opposing position. It's a convenient strawman. I would suggest this is the reason most of us reply with icons, jokes, etc. Our views are stretched and exaggerated so that they are appear ridiculous then they are trashed. Hardly makes it worth taking the time...

 

[U-T]

I would imagine that most of us "apologists" are concerned but feel that Fulmer has earned the chance to work on the team in the way he sees fit. If we continue to be non-competitive for a year or two then I would suggest you'll see us (me) call for a change. There is always a regression to the mean - you won't find a coach that is around as long as Fulmer that doesn't have ups and downs. Quite frankly, until this year the downs were mild. I'll stick with Fulmer for a couple of more years rather than yank him on the hopes that some unknown, unamed coach could replace him and the SECC's and NC's magically begin to appear. Even if that person was out there, he wouldn't put up 13 straight years without some downs.

:clapping:

 

[CSpindizzy]

Again, a "down" year is a year full of injuries, off-years on recruiting, etc. A "down" year is not several years of sliding offense production, fumbles, penalties, various other mental mistakes, etc. I expect and have no problem overlooking the occassional down year. Things happen in cycles. But when the mental prep of the team gradually slides year after year, there's something more than the occassional down year.

I just don't see how returning the same players and getting more experience out of the "better" team from last year, same coaches, same play calling etc. would lead to this season. It's something greater than this anomaly down season that seems to be the trend excuse. Since U-T is a big copy and paste fan, I'll use those terms. How can you copy and paste last year's team, primarily on offense, and get the exact opposite result? The law of probability, physics, allignment of the stars and planets, or whatever just can't explain this as a token, fluke, occassional down year.

 

[volmanjr]

How can you copy and paste last year's team, primarily on offense, and get the exact opposite result? The law of probability, physics, allignment of the stars and planets, or whatever just can't explain this as a token, fluke, occassional down year.

How about with a coach that knows it's put up or shut up time, how about a new OC who can actually develope talent at the QB position, how about Arian Foster at Rb, how about a defensive that will be reloaded and ready via the "Chief".

 

[CSpindizzy]

How about with a coach that knows it's put up or shut up time, how about a new OC who can actually develope talent at the QB position, how about Arian Foster at Rb, how about a defensive that will be reloaded and ready via the "Chief".

How about one that had the same signs of a downward spiral prior to this past season but still did nothing?

I don't know how these questions were meant. But my point was last year and two years ago. It's easy to point to the upcoming season AFTER we tanked and had to make coaching changes. The only difference in your example above and going into last year is a new OC and a new RB. I heard the same thing from the Sanders defenders last year and about Riggs. Where did that get us?

Again, going full circle, I'm optimistic about next year. I think eyes were finally opened and Fulmer sacked up to make needed changes. I think a lot of the problems will take some time to get rid of. I think seeing the younger guys step up and some of the ones who had this wrong attitude about why they were here (Rob Smith) gone, we should see some quick results. While I don't think the turnaround will be completed in a season (hoping but not betting), I do see some better results for next year. But realize that it will take quite a few steps forward to just get out of the hole, much less step up to the advancing teams in the conference.

 

[volmanjr]

How about one that had the same signs of a downward spiral prior to this past season but still did nothing?

I don't know how these questions were meant.

I was just pointing out some reasons things could be better next yr, will they be? who knows? All I can say is "GO BIG ORANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[orange4ever]

Blaming all our faults on CPF and the other coaches does'nt make sense either. All of the players are there for a reason. You do not take 4 years of riding the bench or getting your body abused for nothing. Whether your there for a free education, a chance to someday coach, or a shot at the NFL, your there for a reason. Any player who has hopes of making the NFL should go out there and give 110% every play. Going by some of what I have read on this thread, we should fire all the coaches and get a whole new team (sarcasam). You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him drink. Same goes for players, you can teach them the plays, teach them to catch, throw, carry the ball, when and who to block, but you cannot make them execute. That is a fact of life. If I do not execute at my job then I get replaced. I am sure it is that way with 99% of this boards posters. I see our problems as both coach and player. But either way, GO BIG ORANGE.

 

[CSpindizzy]

I was just pointing out some reasons things could be better next yr, will they be? who knows? All I can say is "GO BIG ORANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Same thing I am saying. Same thing I'd say all are saying....except some said 'outsiders' on the board.