Celtics vs Heat ECF

#551
#551
milohimself said:
Wasn't talking about Philly. Boston will show out. Whether or not they win... Who knows.
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Show out? Not sure on that.

The effort and intensity will be there but will the production?

They looked tired, short on jumpers all night, not getting the 50/50 balls, not finishing at the rim.

I don't think it's a coincidence that Rondo was by far the most energetic and best player seeing as how he is the youngest of them as well.
 
#552
#552
zjcvols said:
Easy. Not enough close.

I don't know if you did or not, but ready the Simmons/Gladwell exchange on Grantland about LeBron. It's fantastic reading.
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It was really a rhetorical question.

It isn't close.

I love Simmons so I will certainly check that out.
 
#553
#553
Boston didn't play bad, like they did in Game 1. They just looked tired and dead. Old legs can just appear one day.
 
#557
#557
_vol said:
I'd have to say Tiger.
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Tiger got to spend the first, reputation-establishing part of his career in the soft-focus glow that used to envelop sports figures before the internet and Twitter and all of it became all-powerful. He's only spent the last couple of years getting a taste of what LeBron's been dealing with for most of his own career.

It's interesting to speculate how different Jordan's career and especially reputation would be if his whole career had taken place 15 years later. He's the best basketball player I've ever seen, but he's also the sports figure who benefited most from the old-school cone of silence that used to operate around all of them too.
 
#558
#558
zjcvols said:
Tiger was LOVED before Thanksgiving 2009. LeBron has been the most scrutinized athlete since he was 16.
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This.

Couple that with the complete difference in sport.

Where if Tiger losses, more often than not its cause of him compared to LeBron where he could be sensational and the team still lose and the blame still fall on him.
 
#559
#559
n_huffhines said:
Lebron went crazy.

Where does this rank all time in elimination game performances?
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It's the greatest non-NBA Finals playoff game ever considering everything.

I mean, this was it. Even though it was really small, they were talking about "Could they move LeBron"? His legacy was on the line, moreso than even against Dallas. And he put up 45/15/6 on 19-26 shooting.
 
#560
#560
Vercingetorix said:
Tiger got to spend the first, reputation-establishing part of his career in the soft-focus glow that used to envelop sports figures before the internet and Twitter and all of it became all-powerful. He's only spent the last couple of years getting a taste of what LeBron's been dealing with for most of his own career.

It's interesting to speculate how different Jordan's career and especially reputation would be if his whole career had taken place 15 years later. He's the best basketball player I've ever seen, but he's also the sports figure who benefited most from the old-school cone of silence that used to operate around all of them too.
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Everyone's reaction to the Jordan Rules. They thought it was a smear campaign by Smith.

You read the Simmons/Gladwell exchange, didn't ya you bastard :)
 
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#561
#561
Also, let's think about it. Not polling women, how many casual golf fans cheer for Tiger to succeed? I'd say 60-70%. I know I do (though I'm not not even a casual golf fan) because he makes the PGA more exciting and watchable.

How many people cheer for LeBron? 20%? Maybe 30%?
 
#562
#562
zjcvols said:
Tiger was LOVED before Thanksgiving 2009. LeBron has been the most scrutinized athlete since he was 16.
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To scrutinize is not a negative assertion. By definition it means to closely inspect. Nothing about a negative connotation.

Even before Tiger brought it down on himself, he was still constantly measured against the golf greats of past. Every swing he took a debate would rise, and still to this day, will he match Jack's major win total?
 
#563
#563
zjcvols said:
It's the greatest non-NBA Finals playoff game ever considering everything.

I mean, this was it. Even though it was really small, they were talking about "Could they move LeBron"? His legacy was on the line, moreso than even against Dallas. And he put up 45/15/6 on 19-26 shooting.
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Tonight was just the first half. He has to bring a similar I-am-taking-this-fscking-game-over approach Saturday night or tonight won't have meant anything.

Let's not kid ourselves. 19-26 means he had a hell of a lot of good luck tonight.
 
#564
#564
I suppose the question should be changed to which athlete experiences the most pressure for failure, versus pure scrutiny by definition.
 
#565
#565
Vercingetorix said:
Tiger got to spend the first, reputation-establishing part of his career in the soft-focus glow that used to envelop sports figures before the internet and Twitter and all of it became all-powerful. He's only spent the last couple of years getting a taste of what LeBron's been dealing with for most of his own career.

It's interesting to speculate how different Jordan's career and especially reputation would be if his whole career had taken place 15 years later. He's the best basketball player I've ever seen, but he's also the sports figure who benefited most from the old-school cone of silence that used to operate around all of them too.
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Can you imagine I'd LeBron had been out gambling all git at a casino the night before a playoff game?

Or hearing about LeBron punching a teammate during practice?

He has been sacrificed amongst the media and public for "The Desicion", which at its absolute worst was a multi-million dollar fund raising event for the Boys & Girls Clubs of America which also featured a superstar athlete displaying his unquestionably enormous ego.
 
#566
#566
_vol said:
To scrutinize is not a negative assertion. By definition it means to closely inspect. Nothing about a negative connotation.

Even before Tiger brought it down on himself, he was still constantly measured against the golf greats of past. Every swing he took a debate would rise, and still to this day, will he match Jack's major win total?
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Some. But even then, people always cheered for Tiger. Yeah, he was scrutinized but with a "I hope he gets it going" way, not where everyone wanted you to fail.

Nobody of my facebook friend cares that Tiger didn't win the 2010 Masters and mentioned he was a choke artist. About 30 of them mentioned LeBron 48 hours ago.l
 
#567
#567
_vol said:
I suppose the question should be changed to which athlete experiences the most pressure for failure, versus pure scrutiny by definition.
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It's LeBron on both accounts.

And he didn't have an epic fall from grace like Woods did.
 
#568
#568
Vercingetorix said:
Tonight was just the first half. He has to bring a similar I-am-taking-this-fscking-game-over approach Saturday night or tonight won't have meant anything.

Let's not kid ourselves. 19-26 means he had a hell of a lot of good luck tonight.
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Agree. But can you imagine Boston coming back? I can't. Not from...THAT.
 
#570
#570
Vercingetorix said:
Tonight was just the first half. He has to bring a similar I-am-taking-this-fscking-game-over approach Saturday night or tonight won't have meant anything.

Let's not kid ourselves. 19-26 means he had a hell of a lot of good luck tonight.
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Or means he was in the mother****ing zone...which he was.
 
#571
#571
GahLee said:
It's LeBron on both accounts.

And he didn't have an epic fall from grace like Woods did.
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Morally and personally, no. Tiger's failures in his personal life played out for the world to watch in all it's horrible glory.

But, professionally I'd argue what Lebron did two years ago brought the crap storm down onto his own head. I don't agree with the amount of crap he receives, but when you poke fun at the system like he did with his "taking my talents to south beach" disaster of a press conference and not back it up to date, the press pays the bills on this kind of stuff.
 
#572
#572
zjcvols said:
Some. But even then, people always cheered for Tiger. Yeah, he was scrutinized but with a "I hope he gets it going" way, not where everyone wanted you to fail.

Nobody of my facebook friend cares that Tiger didn't win the 2010 Masters and mentioned he was a choke artist. About 30 of them mentioned LeBron 48 hours ago.l
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Well, Tiger could retire today as at worst the second best player ever in mosts minds.

LeBron isn't near that conversation because of the lack of winning.
 
#573
#573
zjcvols said:
Everyone's reaction to the Jordan Rules.

You read the Simmons/Gladwell exchange, didn't ya you bastard :)
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Uh, I haven't read either the Jordan book or any recent Simmons thing. All I know is that MJ is just the specter that hangs in the air every time LeBron plays. And I am old enough to have watched Jordan's whole career, from UNC to the Wizards.

The part of Jordan's personality that he's so celebrated for -- the hyper-competitve assassin on the court -- only existed because the guy is basically a complete ass_hole. Jordan played in basically the last era possible in American culture that you could have it both ways. He's a beloved elder statesman/advertising icon now. It would be totally different if he had to deal now with what modern players have to deal with.
 
#575
#575
Vercingetorix said:
Uh, I haven't read either the Jordan book or any recent Simmons thing. All I know is that MJ is just the specter that hangs in the air every time LeBron plays. And I am old enough to have watched Jordan's whole career, from UNC to the Wizards.

The part of Jordan's personality that he's so celebrated for -- the hyper-competitve assassin on the court -- only existed because the guy is basically a complete ass_hole. Jordan played in basically the last era possible in American culture that you could have it both ways. He's a beloved elder statesman/advertising icon now. It would be totally different if he had to deal now with what modern players have to deal with.
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In other words Jordan was the apex of the sport at its apex.
 
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