Butch Jones is Concerned About Vols' OL

#3
#3
I'm not CFB strategist but why is our OL sucking so bad?? Injuries, coaching, motivation????
Please explain it to me like I'm a 4 yr old. Not hating just confused and early happy hour. :)
 
#5
#5
MaTaLa said:
I'm not CFB strategist but why is our OL sucking so bad?? Injuries, coaching, motivation????
Please explain it to me like I'm a 4 yr old. Not hating just confused and early happy hour. :)
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In the App game they were getting beaten by App's quickness off the snap and cut blocking. Coleman Thomas in particular was abused - just a quick swim move by their DT and he was in the backfield on multiple plays.
 
#6
#6
What? He said (in context of play-action 1st down), he'd rather see 2nd and 10, rather than 2nd and 19 or 2nd and 14.

How about, 2nd and 6, or 2nd and 4, or, just another 1st and 10?
 
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#7
#7
Individually OL play is feet, hands, and pad level. From what I have seen the biggest complaint I have is with our feet and not moving them well.
 
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#8
#8
MaTaLa said:
I'm not CFB strategist but why is our OL sucking so bad?? Injuries, coaching, motivation????
Please explain it to me like I'm a 4 yr old. Not hating just confused and early happy hour. :)
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Personnel choices are the first part. No way J Jones should have sat with either Thomas or Richmond starting. There could be other OL's that could perform like JJ but just aren't getting their shot. IMHO, JJ would be buried on the depth chart too if he had not been forced into action last year.

The second part is probably the techniques and plays they're being asked to execute. Jones' O system is relatively complex for OL's. It takes a lot of coordination to execute on the OL.... not very much man on man blocking. A lot of influence blocks as opposed to firing off, hitting someone, and creating run lanes.
 
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#9
#9
05_never_again said:
In the App game they were getting beaten by App's quickness off the snap and cut blocking. Coleman Thomas in particular was abused - just a quick swim move by their DT and he was in the backfield on multiple plays.
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Coleman Thomas got shoved around like a schoolgirl by App State. Our Offensive line everyone of them get too high in their blocking, if they get lower they could get some leverage , but they stand straight up. This needs to get fixed now. Florida is much faster than App State. OL Better dig in , gonna be a long day in the trenches. GBO
 
#11
#11
Jones is stubborn. He has been rigid in sticking to HIS system since arriving and then forcing players to try to execute it.

It is completely possible that it is just too complex for OL's to learn and execute effectively against the types of athletes UT faces.
 
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#13
#13
CBJ is going to have to scheme something to help this line vs UF. Whether it's a double tight end set or perhaps a fullback/tight end in the backfield, I don't know; I'm not a football coach. But even I can see that if Dobbs is planning to throw the ball, someone is going to have to block.

JMHO
 
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#14
#14
OrangeByBirth said:
Solutions:

1. Recruit OL
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They have talented OL's.... and definitely more than other programs whose OL's haven't stank it up.
2. Get a real offensive coordinator
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Why? Would a different OC do it Jones' way better than Debord?

The only way hiring a different OC will matter is if Jones lets go and gives them control of the "system". That is unlikely.... but if it is likely... why not let Debord change the system first to see if he can make his system work?
3. Start coaching
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That's a little broad isn't it?
4. Find a fullback
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Again, why? Jones' runs his O system. He developed it and thinks it is the best one going. Finding a FB who won't play anyway.... is pretty pointless.


If Jones' system doesn't prove to be effective and a lot more so than we've seen through 3 games then it has to go... even if he has to go with it. If your "system" takes 5 years to teach and execute.... that's simply too long for football at any level.
 
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#16
#16
sjt18 said:
Jones is stubborn. He has been rigid in sticking to HIS system since arriving and then forcing players to try to execute it.

It is completely possible that it is just too complex for OL's to learn and execute effectively against the types of athletes UT faces.
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I think this is problem number 1.

Jones is stubborn.

People who are stubborn don't like change until it's a must.

If we lose against FL and we see a change in Offense, it's clearly because he is on the hot seat.
 
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#17
#17
sjt18 said:
The only way hiring a different OC will matter is if Jones lets go and gives them control of the "system". That is unlikely....
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Have said this numerous times.. Not sure why people can't seem to wrap there head a round this concept..

I'm afraid Butch is going to live or die by his system..
 
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#18
#18
jarhead said:
CBJ is going to have to scheme something to help this line vs UF. Whether it's a double tight end set or perhaps a fullback/tight end in the backfield, I don't know; I'm not a football coach. But even I can see that if Dobbs is planning to throw the ball, someone is going to have to block.

JMHO
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They need to switch to a pro-style offense....... JMO
 
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#19
#19
He said much more interesting things in that presser but I guess you guys hear what you want to hear. It wouldn't be click bait.
 
#20
#20
BallerVols said:
Individually OL play is feet, hands, and pad level. From what I have seen the biggest complaint I have is with our feet and not moving them well.
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Yea, and then they have to be on the same page...we've let a few rushers come free because of guys not knowing their assignments...note - it's not easy because teams jump around and disguise their rush...also, 2nd/3rd and long are really hard of the OL because the D is willing to gamble up front and just sell out for a pass rush...look at our DL, they love rushing the QB when it's 3rd and 10...
 
#21
#21
It's amazing how some of y'all on here are so much smarter and well versed on OL play and our current staff. That Dummy Kyler Kerbyson doesn't know anything he's talking about. Because he essentially has said pretty much the opposite of what our VN coaches have stated here.
 
#22
#22
sjt18 said:
They have talented OL's.... and definitely more than other programs whose OL's haven't stank it up.
Why? Would a different OC do it Jones' way better than Debord?

The only way hiring a different OC will matter is if Jones lets go and gives them control of the "system". That is unlikely.... but if it is likely... why not let Debord change the system first to see if he can make his system work?
That's a little broad isn't it?

Again, why? Jones' runs his O system. He developed it and thinks it is the best one going. Finding a FB who won't play anyway.... is pretty pointless.


If Jones' system doesn't prove to be effective and a lot more so than we've seen through 3 games then it has to go... even if he has to go with it. If your "system" takes 5 years to teach and execute.... that's simply too long for football at any level.
Click to expand...
I agree 100% but I think it may be too late for the next 4 games. Sigh
 
#23
#23
sjt18 said:
Personnel choices are the first part. No way J Jones should have sat with either Thomas or Richmond starting. There could be other OL's that could perform like JJ but just aren't getting their shot. IMHO, JJ would be buried on the depth chart too if he had not been forced into action last year.

The second part is probably the techniques and plays they're being asked to execute. Jones' O system is relatively complex for OL's. It takes a lot of coordination to execute on the OL.... not very much man on man blocking. A lot of influence blocks as opposed to firing off, hitting someone, and creating run lanes.
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How many times is that last part going to be puked onto this website? Zone blocking is not mentally hard. They have terrible technique. They don't use their feet well and they don't finish their blocks. Zone blocking is all about working together and getting guys to the second level, but you have to block the first level before anything and that's where we fail. Guys are trying to get to the LBs and they're whiffing the first level and due to being overextended they whiff on the second half the time.
 
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#25
#25
ReaderVol said:
It's amazing how some of y'all on here are so much smarter and well versed on OL play and our current staff. That Dummy Kyler Kerbyson doesn't know anything he's talking about. Because he essentially has said pretty much the opposite of what our VN coaches have stated here.
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Jesus Christ, I don't need a degree in quantum physics to understand football. I wasn't physically good enough to make it to D-1. I imagine there are plenty that weren't but were still good students of the game. I'm so sick of hearing this tired argument. Just because Kyler grew into a 6'4 300 lb HS senior doesn't make him the sole authority on OL play.
 
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