Bitcoin

#426
#426
Seems like it’s simply a highly liquid repository of wealth that can be used for transactions and is largely obscured from government oversight. It’s forward appreciation should simply mirror inflation. The large swings in its value are due to the attractiveness of it as a method of conducting transactions and for storing value outside of government interference versus the uncertainty of what it really represents and the lack of that governmental oversight. It’s certainly an odd investment vehicle. Whether or not the finite supply justifies the rapidly rising valuation is the conundrum.

Another case for its increase in value is as a counter to governmental monetary systems which have no limits on printing more money (which supports the earlier reference to inflation). The absence of regulation makes it both attractive and risky.
 
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#427
#427
VolStrom said:
I always urge people to invest into things that have no intrinsic value. Always invest your money in things that don't create value and you'll be fine.
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Things that have intrinsic value and things that create value are two different things. The creation of value is sort of a fleeting illusion. It's just a way to explain the perception that something has value above and beyond the sum of its parts. A gold necklace made with $500 worth of gold is still worth only $500 until we are sure somebody is willing to pay more for it. The exchange is when the value is "created". You could make a Zack Morris style cell phone and claim to have created value by making its parts into functioning tech, but it's an obsolete tech and nobody will perceive it to have value.

Currency has value as a medium of exchange (literally a value-creating tool) and as a store of value and bitcoin/cryptocurrency is special in both regards. It "creates" value because people see it as more valuable than the sum of its parts.
 
#428
#428
Thunder Good-Oil said:
Seems like it’s simply a highly liquid repository of wealth that can be used for transactions and is largely obscured from government oversight. It’s forward appreciation should simply mirror inflation. The large swings in its value are due to the attractiveness of it as a method of conducting transactions and for storing value outside of government interference versus the uncertainty of what it really represents and the lack of that governmental oversight. It’s certainly an odd investment vehicle. Whether or not the finite supply justifies the rapidly rising valuation is the conundrum.

Another case for its increase in value is as a counter to governmental monetary systems which have no limits on printing more money (which supports the earlier reference to inflation). The absence of regulation makes it both attractive and risky.
Click to expand...
I want to get into it without a paper trail. If I can figure that out, I am going in.
 
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#429
#429
Anybody dabbled in the new Crypto ETF?

DITW - Bitwise 10 Crypto Index Fund

The market-cap-weighted fund is 75% Bitcoin and 13% Ethereum, with the remaining 12% allocations across XRP, Litecoin, Chainlink, Tezos and other cryptocurrencies.
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I have indirect exposure to BTC thru the Grayscale Bitcoin Trust. This would be my first direct play (as direct as an Index can be), and is obviously spread across the Top 10 cryptos.

The NAV spread is crazy, but it’s brand new and appears to be the 1st of its kind.

@n_huffhines
@Septic
@DC_Vol
 
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#430
#430
85SugarVol said:
Anybody dabbled in the new Crypto ETF?

DITW - Bitwise 10 Crypto Index Fund



I have indirect exposure to BTC thru the Grayscale Bitcoin Trust. This would be my first direct play (as direct as an Index can be), and is obviously spread across the Top 10 cryptos.

The NAV spread is crazy, but it’s brand new and appears to be the 1st of its kind.

@n_huffhines
@Septic
@DC_Vol
Click to expand...

I haven't done that but I like the idea of it.
 
#431
#431
n_huffhines said:
I haven't done that but I like the idea of it.
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Yea I’m really intrigued. It’s obviously heavy Bitcoin, put provides exposure to the other relative players - so it should do a good job of capturing the winners.

The only thing that gives me pause is the steep premium to the NAV.
 
#432
#432
85SugarVol said:
Yea I’m really intrigued. It’s obviously heavy Bitcoin, put provides exposure to the other relative players - so it should do a good job of capturing the winners.

The only thing that gives me pause is the steep premium to the NAV.
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I've been buying bitcoin and etherium in like a 3:1 ratio and this just makes it easier to diversify and you also don't have to worry about setting up a wallet and losing a password or getting hacked.
 
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#433
#433
n_huffhines said:
I've been buying bitcoin and etherium in like a 3:1 ratio and this just makes it easier to diversify and you also don't have to worry about setting up a wallet and losing a password or getting hacked.
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you are concerned about getting hacked with blockchain?
 
#434
#434
I'm looking forward to 5 years from now and you guys telling me how much you've made or lost by "dabbling" in fake currencies.
 
#435
#435
SpaceCoastVol said:
you are concerned about getting hacked with blockchain?
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Right now I don't have a wallet and I've been trading with the Coinbase app, which can be hacked.

Also, if you have a wallet with a passcode, hackers are designing malware that searches your computer for 12 digit codes, so you can't store your passcode on your computer.

In other words, they aren't hacking the blockchain tech, they're hacking an app or you.
 
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#437
#437
n_huffhines said:
Right now I don't have a wallet and I've been trading with the Coinbase app, which can be hacked.

Also, if you have a wallet with a passcode, hackers are designing malware that searches your computer for 12 digit codes, so you can't store your passcode on your computer.

In other words, they aren't hacking the blockchain tech, they're hacking an app or you.
Click to expand...
Thanks.
 
#438
#438
n_huffhines said:
You want our investments to fail?
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Not at all, I just want people to invest in things that are actually backed by something, you know like a company stock that has earnings or bonds backed by government taxpayers.
Things like bitcoin and the like are just pie in the sky make believe imaginary numbers like the j operator.
 
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#439
#439
VolStrom said:
Not at all, I just want people to invest in things that are actually backed by something, you know like a company stock that has earnings or bonds backed by government taxpayers. Things like bitcoin and the like are just pie in the sky make believe imaginary numbers like the j operator.
Click to expand...

Why do you care what we invest in?
 
#440
#440
n_huffhines said:
I've been buying bitcoin and etherium in like a 3:1 ratio and this just makes it easier to diversify and you also don't have to worry about setting up a wallet and losing a password or getting hacked.
Click to expand...
The simplicity of it is definitely a bonus. That convenience makes the premium a bit more palatable.
 
#441
#441
VolStrom said:
Not at all, I just want people to invest in things that are actually backed by something, you know like a company stock that has earnings or bonds backed by government taxpayers.
Things like bitcoin and the like are just pie in the sky make believe imaginary numbers like the j operator.
Click to expand...
Now, now... there’s more in this world than just Vanguard Index Funds...
 
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#442
#442
n_huffhines said:
Right now I don't have a wallet and I've been trading with the Coinbase app, which can be hacked.

Also, if you have a wallet with a passcode, hackers are designing malware that searches your computer for 12 digit codes, so you can't store your passcode on your computer.

In other words, they aren't hacking the blockchain tech, they're hacking an app or you.
Click to expand...
You thought about keeping any of it in cold storage?
 
#444
#444
VolStrom said:
I'm looking forward to 5 years from now and you guys telling me how much you've made or lost by "dabbling" in fake currencies.
Click to expand...
I wish these guys all kinds of luck. I just don't know enough about cryptos to make me confident that they can't be hacked or created out of thin air like regular FED notes. I'm also concerned that this might be a backdoor way of getting people to used to digital currency before they finally do away with physical money and these guys were basically testing its resiliency over the last few years without knowing.
 
#446
#446
n_huffhines said:
Right now I don't have a wallet and I've been trading with the Coinbase app, which can be hacked.

Also, if you have a wallet with a passcode, hackers are designing malware that searches your computer for 12 digit codes, so you can't store your passcode on your computer.

In other words, they aren't hacking the blockchain tech, they're hacking an app or you.
Click to expand...

I just had a very tech savvy client lose 6 btc through coinbase. They got in and installed a 2fa pass and cleaned him out.
 
#450
#450
Septic said:
I just had a very tech savvy client lose 6 btc through coinbase. They got in and installed a 2fa pass and cleaned him out.
Click to expand...

Yeah, they hack the app and watch and wait until it's big $ then they empty it out. Gotta go wallet if you have real $ in there
 
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