At what point...?

[HILLBILLY VIA VIB]

Poor play calling, foster continues to fumble in the red zone, the d cant d short passes, the o line is hugely over rated, crompton over rated and or poorly coached, the wr's are pygmys, the recruiting is poor colquit should be kicked off the team, special teams coaches continue to stink. Season is over put ej abrams ward in at qb

 

[torchb]

I guess my gripe is that, being someone who has played (and still does) various sports it's always irked me that there is some nigh-omniscient quality given to coaching. I don't care if it was friggin pee-wee league, when I blew up a play I like some credit and if I got beat I had to man up and say "guys, that was all me". When I see a great play made by whoever in whatever sport my first inclination is not to go "Wow, check out the coaching on that guy!" I'm not about to say coaching isn't relevent but there has never been a single pass completed...ever...where a player didn't have to make a throw and the other guy actually catch it. I don't care what the play call was or even if it was a busted play the completion happened wholly and entirely between two guys on the field. Maybe I'm just an old player that wants to see what's on the field more than what's on the sideline but watching a game, any game of any sport, I like to believe that the guys out there hold most of their own fate in their own hands and wouldn't want it any other way. Give them the praise they deserve when appropriate and expect them to be man enough to say "I just got beat." when they were.

Anyway, I'd like to think our team can, and will, do better.

You're exactly right. Crompton didn't play well, Foster had the fumble. My gripe with the coaching staff is that particularly in the second half they didn't call the game to the strengths of the players they have. They put the game on Crompton when it was he was not playing well. They started playing very soft on the corners against a QB who threw 4 ints in the first half against their pressure defense. When the secondary is the best unit on the team you don't play them so far off you concede the short passing game against an unproven QB. When your unproven QB is having a bad night don't put the game squarely on his shoulders.

 

[General Jack]

This loss was unforgivable with the talent disparity at hand. Flat out embarrassing from our inability to capitalize on turnovers, to our inability to get a stop late in the game, to the overriding lack of adjustments in response to those made by UCLA.

Just plain pathetic, I never dreamed we would lose this game, but I had momentarily forgotten the ineptness of our coaching staff.

Really thought Crompton was going to play better.

 

[BigVOLFAN1]

Is it not the coaches job to teach fundamentals of the game? Is it not the coaches job to prepare the team for the game and manage the game. I do undestand that the coach can not go out on the field and execute, but it is his job to find and recuit players that can. FL,GA,AL and LSU all do out of all of the SEC teams that played over the weekend we looked the worst.

 

[hndog609]

Really thought Crompton was going to play better.

I think Clawson believed this as well.

I really do hate to dog somebody after one game, frankly it's not fair, but you have to wonder if there is sufficient lack of confidence in Crompton that a change of philosophy might be undergone prior to UF.

 

[hndog609]

Is it not the coaches job to teach fundamentals of the game? Is it not the coaches job to prepare the team for the game and manage the game. I do undestand that the coach can not go out on the field and execute, but it is his job to find and recuit players that can. FL,GA,AL and LSU all do out of all of the SEC teams that played over the weekend we looked the worst.

I would like to point out that our D, while going soft at the end, still only allowed 17 points in regulation, 288yds (OT included) and less than 1 ypc on the ground. Guys, that's supposed to have the game won, warts and all.

On the other hand our offense completed 45% of it's passes for a meager 189yds. Again, I'm NOT saying coaching doesn't matter but there is not a team in our league that is going to win many games without better QB play on the field. I don't care who you have calling the plays there will be times when the guy behind center is going to have to make the play. Ours didn't last night...often. He needs to start doing so or the rest of it won't much matter.

 

[jakez4ut]

I would like to point out that our D, while going soft at the end, still only allowed 17 points in regulation, 288yds (OT included) and less than 1 ypc on the ground. Guys, that's supposed to have the game won, warts and all.

On the other hand our offense completed 45% of it's passes for a meager 189yds. Again, I'm NOT saying coaching doesn't matter but there is not a team in our league that is going to win many games without better QB play on the field. I don't care who you have calling the plays there will be times when the guy behind center is going to have to make the play. Ours didn't last night...often. He needs to start doing so or the rest of it won't much matter.

i don't disagree with that.

and for the purposes of this discussion, as it relates to what we've seen thus far of our football team so far, it's simply not 100% accurate.

it's not the result that concerns me as much as how we got those results. and how we got those results has a lot to do with the coaches, since so many mistakes from so many different areas contributed to those results.

if they got those results because that's all they were capable of doing, ok, then we just got beat. fine, i can live with that.

but that's not the case. that's the difference.

 

[hndog609]

i don't disagree with that.

and for the purposes of this discussion, as it relates to what we've seen thus far of our football team so far, it's simply not 100% accurate.

it's not the result that concerns me as much as how we got those results. and how we got those results has a lot to do with the coaches, since so many mistakes from so many different areas contributed to those results.

if they got those results because that's all they were capable of doing, ok, then we just got beat. fine, i can live with that.

but that's not the case. that's the difference.

Thanks for the reasoned responses. As to your points there's always opportunity to 2nd guess coaching. Heck, we can do that after a dominant win. What I'm trying to determine is how much blame I (or "we") should attribute to the coaching. As I stated earlier I just can only put so much on the defense, coaching issues or not. Giving up 288yds (including OT) and holding your opponent to .9ypc I'll take all year.

What were our coaches "mistakes" on offense? To me the most glaring would appear to be throwing when we were looking pretty good rushing the ball. But let's define that mistake. Were there receivers open? I saw more than a few. Isn't opening up the offense what so much of the fan bitching has been about? I'd argue yes. So if we've opened up the offense and the opportunity is there to try to get the ball "to our playmakers" and it doesn't happen is the biggest mistake having too much faith in our QB? If you answer yes then I suppose that could be called a coaching error...but would that not also be admitting that it's the guy on the field that's forcing that limitation on the coaches?

 

[champyvol]

OK, there's a lot of frayed nerves out there (and here) so please, I'm trying to posit this as a general question that could, perhaps, be applied to UT's game last night. My goal, though, is to see what people think of the question in general, at any level, any sport.

At what point does the coach's (any coach) responsibility start to ebb (or disappear) and the players are expected to do what they are supposed to do?

I have played many sports and still play several recreationally. If I'm at the free throw line I don't get to whine about what the coach's did or didn't tell me...I'm gonna make the shot or miss. If I'm 80 yds off the green with a good lie I (me, nobody else) am going to stick it on the flat stuff or not. I guess I've read and heard many people that, swear to God, you'd think they actually believed that the game was being played by the coaches in some video game and not by players on the field/court/whatever. Pick a game, any game, where a receiver was open and the QB flat missed him. Simple as that, sailed it 10yds over the guy. If it suits some people to do so they will find a way to blame a coach. It's just beyond me.

The little cadre of watchers we assembled to watch the game were unanimous in one single concern above all others after last nights game; do we or do we not have an SEC caliber player at QB. If the answer really is no (and this applies to ANY SEC team) then winning in this league is going to be very, very tough and who is under center might be every bit as important than who is on the sideline.

we no longer have a sec caliber coach.

 

[BigPapaVol]

I would like to point out that our D, while going soft at the end, still only allowed 17 points in regulation, 288yds (OT included) and less than 1 ypc on the ground. Guys, that's supposed to have the game won, warts and all.

On the other hand our offense completed 45% of it's passes for a meager 189yds. Again, I'm NOT saying coaching doesn't matter but there is not a team in our league that is going to win many games without better QB play on the field. I don't care who you have calling the plays there will be times when the guy behind center is going to have to make the play. Ours didn't last night...often. He needs to start doing so or the rest of it won't much matter.

bottom line is that our QB should not have been asked to continue trying to make the play. He threw 42 times in a game where we showed we could dominate on the left end.

Call that anything you like, but it's poor coaching from someone. Sure, execution wasn't great from our QB, but once he showed it wasn't his day, he should have become a handoff machine and tried to take advantage of the ensuing play action.

 

[jakez4ut]

Thanks for the reasoned responses. As to your points there's always opportunity to 2nd guess coaching. Heck, we can do that after a dominant win. What I'm trying to determine is how much blame I (or "we") should attribute to the coaching. As I stated earlier I just can only put so much on the defense, coaching issues or not. Giving up 288yds (including OT) and holding your opponent to .9ypc I'll take all year.

What were our coaches "mistakes" on offense? To me the most glaring would appear to be throwing when we were looking pretty good rushing the ball. But let's define that mistake. Were there receivers open? I saw more than a few. Isn't opening up the offense what so much of the fan bitching has been about? I'd argue yes. So if we've opened up the offense and the opportunity is there to try to get the ball "to our playmakers" and it doesn't happen is the biggest mistake having too much faith in our QB? If you answer yes then I suppose that could be called a coaching error...but would that not also be admitting that it's the guy on the field that's forcing that limitation on the coaches?

Here's how i see it.......

Defensively, we played about as well as you could expect in the 1st half. i think where i draw the line for the coaches is the soft coverages in the 4th quarter and not taking advantage of our supposed strength in our secondary. 150 yards given up mainly thru the air in those last two TD drives is a tough pill to swallow after you had controlled the game defensively for the 1st three quarters.

Offensively, it was little things. they weren't lined up in the right places, too many penalties.......delay of game on a fg attempt that led to a punt, back to back fals starts, motion, ineligible down field.......Foster running in to Crompton because he didn't know what play was being run, the way Foster carried the ball on the fumble, our 2nd down offense was awful, and some of that was execution, and some of it was bad playcalling. The blocked punt, the over loaded the right side of the formation, they had 2 guyes for both gaps and we didn't catch it......should have been a time out called. this is why i put it on the coaches.......too many errors in too many places for me to say this team was well coached.

put it this way.....how many games in football in general do you win the rushing yardage and turnover ratios and lose?

 

[gainesvol82]

Consistently getting beat head to head due to bad coaching will kill your recruiting. If I were a 5 star talent, I sure as hell wouldn't go to UT to lose games to teams with less talent but better coaches. Pathetic.

 

[hndog609]

Here's how i see it.......

Defensively, we played about as well as you could expect in the 1st half. i think where i draw the line for the coaches is the soft coverages in the 4th quarter and not taking advantage of our supposed strength in our secondary. 150 yards given up mainly thru the air in those last two TD drives is a tough pill to swallow after you had controlled the game defensively for the 1st three quarters.

Offensively, it was little things. they weren't lined up in the right places, too many penalties.......delay of game on a fg attempt that led to a punt, back to back fals starts, motion, ineligible down field.......Foster running in to Crompton because he didn't know what play was being run, the way Foster carried the ball on the fumble, our 2nd down offense was awful, and some of that was execution, and some of it was bad playcalling. The blocked punt, the over loaded the right side of the formation, they had 2 guyes for both gaps and we didn't catch it......should have been a time out called. this is why i put it on the coaches.......too many errors in too many places for me to say this team was well coached.

put it this way.....how many games in football in general do you win the rushing yardage and turnover ratios and lose?

I see where you're coming from but by "offense" I meant specifically offense so let's set aside the kicking game. (I did go NUTS on the delay penalty for the FG) Those Foster examples I think fall primarily on Foster. I could have done without the penalties you mention but for a first game I found it more fustrating than damning though.

For the sake of our discussion let's say we remove every offensive penalty. I still think it very possible, even likely, that the score would not have changed due to poor play centered very much around execution by the QB. I don't disagree that perhaps Clawson could have shunted some of the load off Cromp and onto the RB's but, again, isn't that kinda a tricky way of laying all the blame on the coach's without admitting that it was poor QB play that made that an issue to begin with?

 

[balasama]

Back in May or June, I indicated to a couple of you that I would be back today with the same comment. We will loose the game at UCLA for one reason and one reason only. We have a head coach that won one National Championship because of luck, and he continues to under achieve with quality caliber players. He does not know the first thing about motivating players, thus we end up here again with no shot at another national championship. I went to UT, but have stopped contributing 5 years ago until Fulmer is gone. The longer you guys avoind the issue, the longer you will be in misery. Will someone please tell Jim Haslem that enough is enough and be done with him. After seeing that crap last night, I now alter my prediction of a 6 and 6 record this year. If 6 wins gets you to a bolw this year, 6 and 7.

And yes, I will be back at the end of the year as before.

 

[hndog609]

So...one year later. Same question.

If you chimed in last year be careful as there's some real landmines.