Article on players who should have won the Heisman

[kcvols1]

Ah, then my bias has stained my memory of that season - it felt like an entire season to me. But in reflecting, what you say makes sense. Ohio State - Michigan was the crescendo. For some reason I thought it was earlier in the year, but maybe it just felt like the highlights lasted a year from my memory. It was all "Woodson, Woodson, Woodson," and then he had a good game and the tone became "See? See? Peyton couldn't beat Florida but Woodson beat Ohio State so he's clearly the better choice." It was crap then and it is crap now.

I think if Tennessee had beaten Florida that year Manning would have overcome the ESPN effect, sadly, but we all know how that went.

I have a running text battle with a law school classmate about this. Here’s my latest salvo:




Of course he exploded with righteous indignation.

It’s my favorite.

 

[BanditVol]

Bear had great players during the 60s that were more than Heisman worthy if the northern sportwriters werent so biased towards southern teams and players. Pat Trammell, Joe Namath, Steve Sloan and Ken Stabler were all great players. The 70s Bear used depth to wear teams down but rarely had stars in the backfield. Ozzie Newsome may have been the best offensive skill guy during his 70s run and he didnt catch that many passes out of the wishbone. The 70s Bama teams dominated on the LOS and by great defenses. Wishbone just wore teams down. I recall several games during the 70s that Tennessee was even or maybe ahead going into the 4th qtr and the Tide just worn them down.

Maybe the media was biased against southern players, IDK (Namath was originally from NY though), but it's a fact that Bear didn't want anyone from bammer to win the Heisman. Went against his concept of team. The usual thought is that if bammer had promoted Broadway Joe at all, he would have been an easy winner. We'll never know because it didn't happen, but I have lived in bammer for 30 years now and any tide fan of that era will say the same thing.

Look at it this way, Fran Tarkenton won it at Georgia, Pat Sullivan won it at AU, etc. It's not like southern players weren't winning the Heisman.

 

[wmcovol]

Maybe the media was biased against southern players, IDK (Namath was originally from NY though), but it's a fact that Bear didn't want anyone from bammer to win the Heisman. Went against his concept of team. The usual thought is that if bammer had promoted Broadway Joe at all, he would have been an easy winner. We'll never know because it didn't happen, but I have lived in bammer for 30 years now and any tide fan of that era will say the same thing.

Look at it this way, Fran Tarkenton won it at Georgia, Pat Sullivan won it at AU, etc. It's not like southern players weren't winning the Heisman.

Fran Tarkenton never won the Heisman.

Here’s a fact. Bryant coached John David Crow at Texas A&M who won the Heisman.

 

[Vol737]

The Heisman is a sham and completely unworthy of Johnny Majors or Peyton Manning. Ranks up there with the gum wrapper I throw away without a second thought.

 

[BanditVol]

Fran Tarkenton never won the Heisman.

Here’s a fact. Bryant coached John David Crow at Texas A&M who won the Heisman.

So the "northern media" was biased against Texas A&M also, right?

Are you doubting that the reason Joe Namath wasn't a Heisman candidate was due to Bryant's philosophy?

Will Alabama's Heisman drought end?

I could probably find a dozen more.

You're right about Tarkenton, I was thinking of Frank Sinkwich of Georgia way back in 1942. But there was also Spurrier in 67 and Cannon in 58. It's not like the SEC won 0 Heismans prior to Walker.

Texas A&M wasn't in the SEC in 1957, but they were a southern team.

But my main point is that bammer would have had a Heisman trophy winner or two under Bryant, if Bryant believed in such things. Any older bammer fan will tell you this, but I could easily find a dozen links.

Not sure why anyone is even trying to argue this, but not everyone has lived among the gumps I suppose.

 

[wmcovol]

So the "northern media" was biased against Texas A&M also, right?

Are you doubting that the reason Joe Namath wasn't a Heisman candidate was due to Bryant's philosophy?

Will Alabama's Heisman drought end?

I could probably find a dozen more.

You're right about Tarkenton, I was thinking of Frank Sinkwich of Georgia way back in 1942. But there was also Spurrier in 67 and Cannon in 58. It's not like the SEC won 0 Heismans prior to Walker.

Texas A&M wasn't in the SEC in 1957, but they were a southern team.

But my main point is that bammer would have had a Heisman trophy winner or two under Bryant, if Bryant believed in such things. Any older bammer fan will tell you this, but I could easily find a dozen links.

Not sure why anyone is even trying to argue this, but not everyone has lived among the gumps I suppose.

From 1942 to 1971, the SEC won 2 Heisman trophies.

Your biggest mistake is letting bamers teach you history about anything but especially Bear Bryant. They’ll tell you he integrated the SEC, he didn’t. They’ll tell you what a great man he was, he wasn’t. They’ll tell you he wasn’t a cheater, he was.

 

[BanditVol]

From 1942 to 1971, the SEC won 2 Heisman trophies.

Your biggest mistake is letting bamers teach you history about anything but especially Bear Bryant. They’ll tell you he integrated the SEC, he didn’t. They’ll tell you what a great man he was, he wasn’t. They’ll tell you he wasn’t a cheater, he was.

Well, he was a great coach, for sure.

No bammer of that era has ever mentioned Bryant and integration to me. They dislike talking about it for some reason.

Some of them actually admit he cheated, believe it or not, though it's a minorty.

Most admit he had a drinking problem, that's well known.

Yes, they think he was great of course. I would expect no less though.

Did you not read the link? Do you need more?

I have zero doubt bammer would have won a Heisman if Bryant hadn't discouraged it. There is no way to prove this of course, but that's a consensus of just about anyone from that era whether they are bammers or not.

 

[BanditVol]

From 1942 to 1971, the SEC won 2 Heisman trophies.

Your biggest mistake is letting bamers teach you history about anything but especially Bear Bryant. They’ll tell you he integrated the SEC, he didn’t. They’ll tell you what a great man he was, he wasn’t. They’ll tell you he wasn’t a cheater, he was.

And get your facts right! From 1935 to 1971, the SEC won FOUR Heismans (see below). That's a span of 35 years. Since there were five major conferences in that span also (SWC, SEC, Big 8, Pac 8/10, and Big 10), plus independents and "everyone else") it might be reasonable to expect the SEC to win about 1/6th of them, which would be six.

Had Bryant done his part, Namath and maybe Stabler win and then the SEC is at six.

· Georgia RB Frank Sinkwich in 1942,
· LSU RB Billy Cannon in 1959,
· Florida QB Steve Spurrier in 1966,
· Auburn QB Pat Sullivan in 1971

 

[wmcovol]

And get your facts right! From 1935 to 1971, the SEC won FOUR Heismans (see below). That's a span of 35 years. Since there were five major conferences in that span also (SWC, SEC, Big 8, Pac 8/10, and Big 10), plus independents and "everyone else") it might be reasonable to expect the SEC to win about 1/6th of them, which would be six.

Had Bryant done his part, Namath and maybe Stabler win and then the SEC is at six.

· Georgia RB Frank Sinkwich in 1942,
· LSU RB Billy Cannon in 1959,
· Florida QB Steve Spurrier in 1966,
· Auburn QB Pat Sullivan in 1971

I didnt include the 1942 win of Sinkwich or the 71 win of Sullivan. Cannon won in '58 and Spurrier won in '66. That's two in between those years. I never included the years 1935-1942. That is your mistake.

 

[BanditVol]

I didnt include the 1942 win of Sinkwich or the 71 win of Sullivan. Cannon won in '58 and Spurrier won in '66. That's two in between those years. I never included the years 1935-1942. That is your mistake.

You literally included 1971 and 1942, so they ARE included.

I guess you meant to say 1943 to 1970, a period of 17 years that included part of WW II, when the Army understandably won two Heismans.

You can selectively pick any time period you want. Here's a newsflash, the Pac 8/10 didn't win a single Heisman until 1962. If anyone can complain about bias it's them. But they won a **** ton in the 60s and 70s.

 

[wmcovol]

You literally included 1971 and 1942, so they ARE included.

I guess you meant to say 1943 to 1970, a period of 17 years that included part of WW II, when the Army understandably won two Heismans.

You can selectively pick any time period you want. Here's a newsflash, the Pac 8/10 didn't win a single Heisman until 1962. If anyone can complain about bias it's them. But they won a **** ton in the 60s and 70s.

I guess you meant to say 1943 to 1970, a period of 17 years that included part of WW II, when the Army understandably won two Heismans.

17 years? I guess Bamers have been teaching you math too.......you need help, dude. Serious help. Ate up with dumbass.....

 

[VolForLife83]

Manning should be high on the list, but Johnny Majors or Jim Brown for 1956 should be at #1. Paul Hornung is the worst player to ever win the Heisman; bad stats, played on a 2-8 team; only won because he was the QB for Notre Dame. Both Majors and Jim Brown had incredible seasons and somehow got passed up for a 2-8 QB who threw 4 times as many INTs as TDs.

THIS!

 

[BanditVol]

Another thing. I am onboard with saying Hornung didn't deserve it in 1956. I mean, Majors was the runner up and I am a Vol after all.

But for the record, Hornung was the no. 1 draft pick in 1957 and then went on to win 3 NFL championships and the first two Super Bowls (back to back) at Green Bay.

Arguably he was the best QB in 1956, for sure. (not sure where to get 1956 passing stats for the whole country)

Since the Heisman is an INDIVIDUAL award, maybe it made sense.

Of course I realize that at least nowadays it matters if your team wins or not, but that wasn't the original intent of the Heisman I don't think.

 

[BanditVol]

I guess you meant to say 1943 to 1970, a period of 17 years that included part of WW II, when the Army understandably won two Heismans.

17 years? I guess Bamers have been teaching you math too.......you need help, dude. Serious help. Ate up with dumbass.....

Okay it was a simple typo, should be 27 years. Oooo! You got me! The fact is, I could give a rat's ass how many Heismans the SEC won historically, just trying to point out why bammer didn't win more when Bryant was there. More on that in a minute.

But since you are stooping to name calling, it's fair to return fire. Are you still credibly trying to claim that Bryant not promoting players was not a factor in bammer not winning a Heisman in the 60s and 70s? Because if you are, it's YOU who are the dumbass. Here are two more links. I am sure there are dozens.

1. SEC Football by the Numbers: Heisman Trophy history

Bryant once famously said, "At Alabama our players do not win Heisman Trophies, our teams win national championships." Bryant's only Heisman winner was John David Crow at Texas A&M in 1957.

2.
Back on the "SEC got snubbed by the national media" thing. I could give a rats ass what the media does or doesn't do. Focusing on it IMO is for losers with an inferiority complex. But do keep obsessing on it if you want.

 

[USAFgolferVol]

Ah, then my bias has stained my memory of that season - it felt like an entire season to me. But in reflecting, what you say makes sense. Ohio State - Michigan was the crescendo. For some reason I thought it was earlier in the year, but maybe it just felt like the highlights lasted a year from my memory. It was all "Woodson, Woodson, Woodson," and then he had a good game and the tone became "See? See? Peyton couldn't beat Florida but Woodson beat Ohio State so he's clearly the better choice." It was crap then and it is crap now.

I think if Tennessee had beaten Florida that year Manning would have overcome the ESPN effect, sadly, but we all know how that went.

Yes, and it didn't help that he played poorly in the last game against Vandy on the same day Woodson shined against OSU