Another injury thread (with a twist)

#1
OrangeBlitz

OrangeBlitz

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#1
I know that most posters on VN recognize the fact that our injury situation this year has been pretty ridiculous. In pondering the depth of the impact this has had/should have on our schedule, I thought it might be interesting to compare it to the NFL.

We started the year at #9 and, going by the futures odds for winning the Super Bowl, that would equate us with the Denver Broncos. So I thought I’d see who they would be playing without if their two deep was as depleted as ours currently is.

For our injuries, I went with this list from another thread and added Kamara:

1. JRM - shoulder, out for the year
2. Kirkland -- ankle, should be back hopefully in two weeks
3. Sutton - broken ankle, out 8 weeks or so. That would be second week of November. He hopes to get back to play this season. We will see if he can.
4. Weisman - concussion, should be back after the bye
5. McDowell - concussion, should be back after the bye
6. Foreman -- shoulder, should be back after the bye
8. Kendrick - ankle, should be back after the bye
9. Robertson - ankle, should be back after the bye
10. Chance Hall - leg, not sure if knee or ankle, not sure the extent
11. McKenzie -- shoulder, didn't return yesterday could miss extended time, we will see what further testing shows.
12. Vickers - ankle, should be back after the bye
13. Buchanan - shoulder, to be evaluated.
14. Evan Berry - limped off in second half, not sure the injury
15. Abernathy - hamstring, should be better in two weeks.
16. O'Brien - dismissed wont be back
17. Preston Williams - quit, wont be back
18. Jack Jones - torn ligaments in thumb. continued to play. will have or has had surgery
19. Sapp - knee out for the year
20. Alvin Kamara

So, using that and making some accommodations for a different defensive scheme , the Broncos would be without:

1. Von Miller
2. Demarcus Ware
3. Aquib Talib
4. Michael Schofield
5. Dekoda Watson
6. Brandon Marshall (They don’t run a NB, so I took an Inside LB)
7. For whatever reason, #7 was missing from the list above so for clarity, I’ll leave it out here too.
8. Ty Sambrailo
9. Max Garcia
10. Donald Stephenson
11. Sylvester Williams
12. Darius Kilgo
13. Lorenzo Doss
14. T.J. Ward
15. Justin Simmons
16. Billy Winn (DE, but they run a 3-4)
17. Demaryius Thomas (or Emmanuel Sanders, depending on whether you think Williams or Malone was WR1)
18. Darion Weems
19. Todd Davis
20. Devontae Booker

So…that’s some talent missing. With that much of a depleted core, how much money would you put on the Broncos beating the Patriots? They’re listed as the odds on favorite to win the superbowl at 3 to 1. My guess is not much, if any.

So, why do some insist on saying that we were “exposed” by Alabama (ranked #1)? I mean, I guess they exposed the youth and inexperience of our 3rd and 4th string replacements, for what that's worth. I know that complaining about what other say on this board isn’t, by any means, a novel concept, but I thought this comparison was interesting and shone a new light on the situation.
 
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#2
#2
There is a story regarding why we had to let our strength coach go and it has nothing to do with strength and conditioning. We should probably go out and try to hire the best strength coach possible. Like Swain said...this is Tennessee. I'm not blaming the strength coach for the injuries, I'm just saying we should have the best.
 
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#3
#3
That is a new way to look at the issue for sure.

The other thing to note. NFL teams only have a 53 man roster. That would totally decimate a NFL team. It is a good thing that we dress 80 something for away games. Your post makes you stop and think about how bad it really is in a different way. Good job.
 
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#4
#4
1. JRM - shoulder, out for the year
2. Kirkland -- ankle, should be back hopefully in two weeks
3. Sutton - broken ankle, out 8 weeks or so. That would be second week of November. He hopes to get back to play this season. We will see if he can.
4. Weisman - concussion, should be back after the bye
5. McDowell - concussion, should be back after the bye
6. Foreman -- shoulder, should be back after the bye
8. Kendrick - ankle, should be back after the bye
9. Robertson - ankle, should be back after the bye
10. Chance Hall - leg, not sure if knee or ankle, not sure the extent
11. McKenzie -- shoulder, didn't return yesterday could miss extended time, we will see what further testing shows.
12. Vickers - ankle, should be back after the bye
13. Buchanan - shoulder, to be evaluated.
14. Evan Berry - limped off in second half, not sure the injury
15. Abernathy - hamstring, should be better in two weeks.
16. O'Brien - dismissed wont be back
17. Preston Williams - quit, wont be back
18. Jack Jones - torn ligaments in thumb. continued to play. will have or has had surgery
19. Sapp - knee out for the year
20. Alvin Kamara


JEEZ!! When you look at the list and how many are starters or TOP players......HOLY CRAP!!

Surprised Bama game wasn't WORSE!! :no::no:



.
 
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#5
#5
biggestvols said:
There is a story regarding why we had to let our strength coach go and it has nothing to do with strength and conditioning. We should probably go out and try to hire the best strength coach possible. Like Swain said...this is Tennessee. I'm not blaming the strength coach for the injuries, I'm just saying we should have the best.
Click to expand...

Yes, this IS Tennessee!

And that means we don't go out and pay top dollar for the best available. That would be... Alabama.
 
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#6
#6
That pretty much says it all, OP. What amazes me is the immediate state of denial that's hit the media (in general) regarding UT's radically overwhelming injury blitzkrieg. It seems more fashionable to drool over bama's creaming of our Vols as opposed to simply recognizing how worn out and decimated this group was when the tide rolled into Knoxville. It's not at all an impossibility for Butch to get 'em gathered best as he can and continue making a valiant run at winning the SEC east. Let's hang in there with 'em. There's a lot of football left and I, for one, am not going to stop smiling about this very special team 120.
 
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#8
#8
Aerie Vol said:
This isn't a thread about players. :rofl:

AV
Click to expand...

LOL.

I agree with Sameolvol. I think this team is special. To have this many injuries at key positions, turn the ball over 7 times, and STILL take A&M to double overtime is mind boggling.

This team has no quit in them. Nothing you can say will change my mind on that. Now, somewhere down the line, if we should get up by 2-3 scores going into the half (which is entirely possible with the remaining games on the slate) and come out super flat for the second half, then I may revise my opinion.

To this point, though, what we've done with what's been dealt to us is, in my own most humble but readily offered opinion, impressive.
 
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#9
#9
This thread has me wishing we had a few of the Denver backups on our team.....
 
#10
#10
Chilmonty said:
1. JRM - shoulder, out for the year
2. Kirkland -- ankle, should be back hopefully in two weeks
3. Sutton - broken ankle, out 8 weeks or so. That would be second week of November. He hopes to get back to play this season. We will see if he can.
4. Weisman - concussion, should be back after the bye
5. McDowell - concussion, should be back after the bye
6. Foreman -- shoulder, should be back after the bye
8. Kendrick - ankle, should be back after the bye
9. Robertson - ankle, should be back after the bye
10. Chance Hall - leg, not sure if knee or ankle, not sure the extent
11. McKenzie -- shoulder, didn't return yesterday could miss extended time, we will see what further testing shows.
12. Vickers - ankle, should be back after the bye
13. Buchanan - shoulder, to be evaluated.
14. Evan Berry - limped off in second half, not sure the injury
15. Abernathy - hamstring, should be better in two weeks.
16. O'Brien - dismissed wont be back
17. Preston Williams - quit, wont be back
18. Jack Jones - torn ligaments in thumb. continued to play. will have or has had surgery
19. Sapp - knee out for the year
20. Alvin Kamara


JEEZ!! When you look at the list and how many are starters or TOP players......HOLY CRAP!!

Surprised Bama game wasn't WORSE!! :no::no:



.
Click to expand...

Rewatched the Battle at Bristol last night. Not anywhere near the same team we fielded against Bama. That said we looked sloppy, but there is a noticeable difference in speed and athleticism at linebacker and in the secondary without Maybin, Kirkland, and Sutton. Oline was a mess similar to what it is now. I think we had settled into a good rotation there around the FL game, then injuries got us all messed up again.
 
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#11
#11
OrangeBlitz said:
I know that most posters on VN recognize the fact that our injury situation this year has been pretty ridiculous. In pondering the depth of the impact this has had/should have on our schedule, I thought it might be interesting to compare it to the NFL.

We started the year at #9 and, going by the futures odds for winning the Super Bowl, that would equate us with the Denver Broncos. So I thought I’d see who they would be playing without if their two deep was as depleted as ours currently is.

For our injuries, I went with this list from another thread and added Kamara:

1. JRM - shoulder, out for the year
2. Kirkland -- ankle, should be back hopefully in two weeks
3. Sutton - broken ankle, out 8 weeks or so. That would be second week of November. He hopes to get back to play this season. We will see if he can.
4. Weisman - concussion, should be back after the bye
5. McDowell - concussion, should be back after the bye
6. Foreman -- shoulder, should be back after the bye
8. Kendrick - ankle, should be back after the bye
9. Robertson - ankle, should be back after the bye
10. Chance Hall - leg, not sure if knee or ankle, not sure the extent
11. McKenzie -- shoulder, didn't return yesterday could miss extended time, we will see what further testing shows.
12. Vickers - ankle, should be back after the bye
13. Buchanan - shoulder, to be evaluated.
14. Evan Berry - limped off in second half, not sure the injury
15. Abernathy - hamstring, should be better in two weeks.
16. O'Brien - dismissed wont be back
17. Preston Williams - quit, wont be back
18. Jack Jones - torn ligaments in thumb. continued to play. will have or has had surgery
19. Sapp - knee out for the year
20. Alvin Kamara

So, using that and making some accommodations for a different defensive scheme , the Broncos would be without:

1. Von Miller
2. Demarcus Ware
3. Aquib Talib
4. Michael Schofield
5. Dekoda Watson
6. Brandon Marshall (They don’t run a NB, so I took an Inside LB)
7. For whatever reason, #7 was missing from the list above so for clarity, I’ll leave it out here too.
8. Ty Sambrailo
9. Max Garcia
10. Donald Stephenson
11. Sylvester Williams
12. Darius Kilgo
13. Lorenzo Doss
14. T.J. Ward
15. Justin Simmons
16. Billy Winn (DE, but they run a 3-4)
17. Demaryius Thomas (or Emmanuel Sanders, depending on whether you think Williams or Malone was WR1)
18. Darion Weems
19. Todd Davis
20. Devontae Booker

So…that’s some talent missing. With that much of a depleted core, how much money would you put on the Broncos beating the Patriots? They’re listed as the odds on favorite to win the superbowl at 3 to 1. My guess is not much, if any.

So, why do some insist on saying that we were “exposed” by Alabama (ranked #1)? I mean, I guess they exposed the youth and inexperience of our 3rd and 4th string replacements, for what that's worth. I know that complaining about what other say on this board isn’t, by any means, a novel concept, but I thought this comparison was interesting and shone a new light on the situation.
Click to expand...

You are wrong op. They exposed everyone and I mean everyone. Last I saw Dobbs/Kamara/Hurd/Wolf/Jennings/Malone weren't replacements.
Quit trying to find a rationale for our loss that isn't logical. They whipped us. End of story. Time to move on.
 
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#12
#12
jkleno said:
You are wrong op. They exposed everyone and I mean everyone. Last I saw Dobbs/Kamara/Hurd/Wolf/Jennings/Malone weren't replacements.
Quit trying to find a rationale for our loss that isn't logical. They whipped us. End of story. Time to move on.
Click to expand...

I've wondered about this for some time and now, that you're here and provide a good representative, I'll ask you.

What do you want?

You say we were whipped and I should accept it and move on. Ok...move on to what? Do you think we should scrap the rest of the season? Are we going to lose another game, or two, or three before it's done?

If we don't, and go 10-2 in the regular season will you be happy with that result? Where do you think we should be at this point in Butch's tenure? Should we be at preseason #1 and vying for the Natty?

Is it to be laid at Deboard's feet...or Shoop's...or the position coaches...or the players'?

Should all us "sunshine pumpers" just stop posting?

Move on to what?

Back to the question I put in the original post, but directed at you now, would you put money on the Broncos, without the players listed, against the Pats? If so, how much? If not, then why? Injuries are, as you've said, no excuse. Why wouldn't Denver have just as much chance to beat NE as they would with a full roster?

You're the AD at UT...what do you do? Go.

(Edited to say, I think at full roster we still lose...but it would have been much, MUCH closer. Along the lines of a 3-7 point loss. And, at that point, we wouldn't be hearing all the "exposed" talk.)
 
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#13
#13
Great post! Kinda of makes ya think huh.
Instead of blame game and criticism, why not congratulate the coaching staff and players who have gave their all for Tennessee?
I'm a Vols fan for life, but some of our fans are our worst enemy.
 
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#14
#14
Butch better take a slight pay cut out of the football budget and get a QUALIFIED strength and conditioning coach........because these boys are getting pushed around and getting knocked out on the field and just not strong enough...... for instance, when you see those boys on Bama hit somebody, they hit you w/ bad intentions, but when you see us tackle it looks like we are just happy to make the stop..........our defense puts NO FEAR in players.....
 
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#15
#15
Halph66 said:
That is a new way to look at the issue for sure.

The other thing to note. NFL teams only have a 53 man roster. That would totally decimate a NFL team. It is a good thing that we dress 80 something for away games. Your post makes you stop and think about how bad it really is in a different way. Good job.
Click to expand...

The pros have a smaller roster but can add players during the season...still, losing a starter and picking up a practice squad player is similar to a college team losing a starter and plugging in a true freshman...
 
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#18
#18
OrangeBlitz said:
The comparison to an NFL team to get the extent of the injury list. As opposed to the normal injury threads that just say, "wow, we're banged up" or "injuries don't matter, we shoulda beat Bama by 52 points!"
Click to expand...

Oh okay, so you had to explain to dumb people why 10% of our starters was not competitive with the number one team in the country?

Well done sir, I get it now:salute:
 
#19
#19
Comparing Tennessee's program to bama's is premature,saban has built the house, Butch has jut finished the foundation. :question:
 
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#20
#20
Halph66 said:
That is a new way to look at the issue for sure.

The other thing to note. NFL teams only have a 53 man roster. That would totally decimate a NFL team. It is a good thing that we dress 80 something for away games. Your post makes you stop and think about how bad it really is in a different way. Good job.
Click to expand...

An NFL team can bring someone up from a taxi squad, or go get a player that can still play really well that is retired or purchase a player from another team. In college football?? Not to argue, just pointing out a small difference.
 
#21
#21
Halph66 said:
That is a new way to look at the issue for sure.

The other thing to note. NFL teams only have a 53 man roster. That would totally decimate a NFL team. It is a good thing that we dress 80 something for away games. Your post makes you stop and think about how bad it really is in a different way. Good job.
Click to expand...
Huge difference. If an NFL player is lost for the season they are placed on IR. Then the team brings in a free agent to replace them on the 53 man roster. That roster changes from week to week based on injuries, free agency and players being cut.

In college you've got the roster you start with. If you're decimated by injuries you better hope the backups are ready.
 
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#25
#25
We pay our Strength and Conditioning coach a little over $69,000.

alabama pays their S&C coach $525,000.

Draw your own conclusions.
 
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