Alexis Johnson arrested (merged/updated 4/21)

#726
#726
HATINGBAMAISAWAYOFLIFE said:
I'm tired of these idiots putting themselves in these situations... and I mean the guys...
dumbasses... girls want you.. why do you have to mess with the ones that don't or beat on them
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how would they know which ones want them? the ones that they sleep with multiple times? Nope, that don't work. Ask both AJ's.
 
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#727
#727
If I understand the basis for the lawsuit and the underlying causes, the big issue is that reports/ accusations of sexual assault go to an internal review process within the university system instead of directly to the police. If it had gone directly to the police, the plaintiffs would have no case against UT. It would all have been in the prosecutor's office and the courts not in some university review board. The internal review board should act as a secondary phase of the assault review process, not the primary or initial. Just my thoughts.
 
#729
#729
hcvol said:
Call me old fashioned... but why can't you just settle on ONE girlfriend and treat her with respect?
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So you're saying date one girl and stay with her whether you are happy or not? I will call you a lot of things, but old fashioned isn't one of them. Miserable, foolish, unhappy....what else?
 
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#730
#730
its 2am, you're 19-22, you're out with the guys and a cute little thing (or big thing if that's your bag) comes strong at you, talkin all kinds of game, wants to come over to your place....what you gonna do?

90% of the males I know will hit it.
 
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#734
#734
titansvolsfaninga said:
So you're saying date one girl and stay with her whether you are happy or not? I will call you a lot of things, but old fashioned isn't one of them. Miserable, foolish, unhappy....what else?
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Wow.. You took the ball and ran with that.

Just assume both parties like each other, and they smile when they see each other, and then go read his post again.
 
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#735
#735
VAVolsFan2009 said:
If I understand the basis for the lawsuit and the underlying causes, the big issue is that reports/ accusations of sexual assault go to an internal review process within the university system instead of directly to the police. If it had gone directly to the police, the plaintiffs would have no case against UT. It would all have been in the prosecutor's office and the courts not in some university review board. The internal review board should act as a secondary phase of the assault review process, not the primary or initial. Just my thoughts.
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The internal review board should not exist. It should not be the responsibility of a university to be the police.
 
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#736
#736
hcvol said:
Call me old fashioned... but why can't you just settle on ONE girlfriend and treat her with respect?
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Heard Swain say that this is what the older, more mature, upperclassmen did when he was at UT. Got off the street chasing tail and getting in trouble. Found a girlfriend who they knew well who they trusted, who would still "satisfy their urges".
 
#737
#737
VAVolsFan2009 said:
If I understand the basis for the lawsuit and the underlying causes, the big issue is that reports/ accusations of sexual assault go to an internal review process within the university system instead of directly to the police. If it had gone directly to the police, the plaintiffs would have no case against UT. It would all have been in the prosecutor's office and the courts not in some university review board. The internal review board should act as a secondary phase of the assault review process, not the primary or initial. Just my thoughts.
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IF the woman filed a report with the police, the police investigated. My understanding is not all of the women went to the police. They filed a complaint with the University. The only power the University holds is the power of dismissal from school. Basically, if the women didn't pursue criminal charges, they were asking the University to kick the accused out of school. UT has a state mandated process on how to handle it. The women are claiming the process doesn't work quickly enough and that it is unfair. They're claim is the process is biased toward the accused and therefore creates a "culture of rape." Apparently they were offended the accused had the right to counsel.
 
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#738
#738
Iam4utalways said:
The internal review board should not exist. It should not be the responsibility of a university to be the police.
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It's not the University's responsibility to police crime, but it is their responsibility to police student behavior. If a student is found to have violated school policies, the University decides if they should be dismissed or not. They have no legal power, only administrative power.
 
#739
#739
Weezer said:
It's not the University's responsibility to police crime, but it is their responsibility to police student behavior. If a student is found to have violated school policies, the University decides if they should be dismissed or not. They have no legal power, only administrative power.
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That's the tricky part. If a student brings accusations to the police, and then the police says not enough evidence to file charges, with the same evidence how should the University proceed. If they kick them out, the University gets sued(Montana), if they let them stay the get sued.
 
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#740
#740
KBVol said:
Heard Swain say that this is what the older, more mature, upperclassmen did when he was at UT. Got off the street chasing tail and getting in trouble. Found a girlfriend who they knew well who they trusted, who would still "satisfy their urges".
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Unfortunately it takes time to know someone well. Before you meet a girl that you know well and can determine is not a crazy person who is out to hurt you, there may be a few psychos that you have to Wade through. It's not all rainbows and Disney movies on college campuses in 2016.

By no means am I saying that if any of these accusations are true that they are justifiable. Just saying that there are bad people who are females just as there are bad people who are males. Sometimes you don't see the crazy until it's too late.

I still feel that the kid needs to be given a chance to let all of the information about this event come out before being publicly crucified in the name of The University of Tennesse's culture.
 
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#741
#741
Iam4utalways said:
That's the tricky part. If a student brings accusations to the police, and then the police says not enough evidence to file charges, with the same evidence how should the University proceed. If they kick them out, the University gets sued(Montana), if they let them stay the get sued.
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There's a different level of proof, if I understand the system correctly. When charged with a crime, burden of proof is beyond a reasonable doubt. I believe student hearings are similar to civil trials where burden of proof is preponderance of the evidence.
 
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#742
#742
Weezer said:
There's a different level of proof, if I understand the system correctly. When charged with a crime, burden of proof is beyond a reasonable doubt. I believe student hearings are similar to civil trials where burden of proof is preponderance of the evidence.
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That makes sense, and then even with a lesser standard need to prove guilt, it becomes more of an issue. Lose, lose for the University, expect a law suit. Maybe they won't settle and both sides of all incidents will come out and it will show that UT was diligent in the way they handled these cases.
 
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#743
#743
vols 30 said:
We are almost on a championship level.
Thuggery = winning
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No, winning = opportunistic and jealous leeches arrive to knock you off your pedestal. Only the strong survive, We are plenty strong !

Cue: Hank Williams Jr. Are you ready for some Football!

:clapping:
 
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#744
#744
Weezer said:
There's a different level of proof, if I understand the system correctly. When charged with a crime, burden of proof is beyond a reasonable doubt. I believe student hearings are similar to civil trials where burden of proof is preponderance of the evidence.
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I believe you do not have an accurate understanding of the student hearing process. In theory you are probably correct, but there is no "beyond a reasonable doubt" clause and no Judge to ensure the process is correctly followed. They're not asking for some cash...they're kicking these students out of school and flagging their transcripts that follow them into their future employment.

It's basically a witch hunt in which some faculty members listen to the parties conflicting stories of the accuser and the accused (since it is typically a he said / she said) then decide who they think is telling the truth. In my book its completely wrong to punish someone who can't be "proven" to have committed a violation. I would much rather thousands of guilty get away than a single innocent be punished.

Do some internet reading, especially at some of the more historically "liberal" universities, and you'll find some astonishing misapplications of student "justice".
 
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#745
#745
VAVolsFan2009 said:
If I understand the basis for the lawsuit and the underlying causes, the big issue is that reports/ accusations of sexual assault go to an internal review process within the university system instead of directly to the police. If it had gone directly to the police, the plaintiffs would have no case against UT. It would all have been in the prosecutor's office and the courts not in some university review board. The internal review board should act as a secondary phase of the assault review process, not the primary or initial. Just my thoughts.
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Any woman who has been sexually assaulted and doesn't go directly to the police or hospital, which will involve the police, is quite frankly ignorant to the last 20-30 years of this topic, as to what anyone who has been violated needs to do, is supposed to do, and is told to do.

If it's my sister I expect her to do the same. Now, what happens after in relation to charges or other legal recourse, and as to whether or not the claims are true or not, are different stories.
 
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#746
#746
walkenvol said:
I believe you do not have an accurate understanding of the student hearing process. In theory you are probably correct, but there is no "beyond a reasonable doubt" clause and no Judge to ensure the process is correctly followed. They're not asking for some cash...they're kicking these students out of school and flagging their transcripts that follow them into their future employment.

It's basically a witch hunt in which some faculty members listen to the parties conflicting stories of the accuser and the accused (since it is typically a he said / she said) then decide who they think is telling the truth. In my book its completely wrong to punish someone who can't be "proven" to have committed a violation. I would much rather thousands of guilty get away than a single innocent be punished.

Do some internet reading, especially at some of the more historically "liberal" universities, and you'll find some astonishing misapplications of student "justice".
Click to expand...

I think you misread my post. I said criminal charges, as in charges brought by the DA, face beyond a reasonable doubt. I think the administrative hearing process that the schools conduct follow more closely to civil trials, where the burden of proof is preponderance of the evidence.
 
#747
#747
Weezer said:
I think you misread my post. I said criminal charges, as in charges brought by the DA, face beyond a reasonable doubt. I think the administrative hearing process that the schools conduct follow more closely to civil trials, where the burden of proof is preponderance of the evidence.
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I understood your point, just didn't do a good job explaining mine.

Students are being punished (kicked out of school, having transcript flagged which can be viewed by a future employer similar to having a criminal record) same as someone being prosecuted on criminal charges.

Even in a civil trial, there is a judge with a knowledge of the law who is supposed to ensure the rules of law are followed. He is empowered to rule on what evidence is admitted for consideration and to even set aside a judgment if the appropriate level of evidence doesn't justify the jury's ruling.

None of this happens in the student hearing process. Claims can be made and if untrained or under trained faculty person believes it then punishment is administered. No hard rules are in place to ensure at least a reasonable amount of evidence to support the accuser's claims.

There's a bunch of high profile cases that have since been proven to be completely false. UTC recently ruled against a member of their wrestling team on a case the DA refused to prosecute. The folks in our government we empower to enforce our laws said there was no case as it was another one of these drinking together at a party, PDA at the party, willingly left together, she says she willingly performed oral sex, then the next day decided she was too drunk to have gone all the way. UTC initially agrees until a threat of a title 9 suit then they back track. Drag it out a year with him suspended from competition until the wrestler's eligibility has expired then boot him in his last semester before graduating. Wrestler has been seeking relief via the court system and has been winning. I suspect UTC is fixing to pay him some substantial $.

These student hearings are nothing but a kangaroo court and if a biased faculty member with an agenda is placed in charge, then look out.
 
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#748
#748
RandySavage said:
Unfortunately it takes time to know someone well. Before you meet a girl that you know well and can determine is not a crazy person who is out to hurt you, there may be a few psychos that you have to Wade through. It's not all rainbows and Disney movies on college campuses in 2016.

By no means am I saying that if any of these accusations are true that they are justifiable. Just saying that there are bad people who are females just as there are bad people who are males. Sometimes you don't see the crazy until it's too late.

I still feel that the kid needs to be given a chance to let all of the information about this event come out before being publicly crucified in the name of The University of Tennesse's culture.
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All he was saying is that a lot of the guys, by the time they were upperclassmen, had pretty much learned their lesson regarding the potential for getting in trouble/being falsely accused after hooking up for one night with girls they didn't know. And that while there are always risks, that those risks were exponentially lower if they had one steady girlfriend with which to have sexual relations. Pretty simple, common sense stuff. That's all.
 
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