Affordability discussion (split from Iran thread)

#1
hog88

hog88

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#1
Ttucke11 said:
Its going to be the destruction of the Republican party. The older generation is going to scold the younger conservatives until a clear divide happens (already is happening). Which could be a great thing if it didn't allow the Democrats to run wild.

Israel support will completely bottom out in the next decade or 2. Young people will not deal well with their quality of life being worse than their grandparents when an entire nation lives off of our own dime.

A nation that comes off extremely arrogant and pompous I might add probably doesn't help either.
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When in our history has the next generations quality of life been worse than their parents/grandparents?

Now, I do think what qualities an individual values can lead to someone considering that it's worse but overall our quality of life has never diminished.
 
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#2
#2
hog88 said:
When in our history has the next generations quality of life been worse than their parents/grandparents?

Now, I do think what qualities an individual values can lead to someone considering that it's worse but overall our quality of life has never diminished.
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Ah, see Hog you are proving my point. It hasn't, until now. That's the point.

Less spending power, lower home ownership rates, more competitive job market, more debt, wage stagnation, hyper inflation, etc. Gen Z will be the first generation where they overwhelmingly have a lower QOL than their parents. Young millennials probably count in this as well.
 
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#3
#3
Ttucke11 said:
Ah, see Hog you are proving my point. It hasn't, until now. That's the point.

Less spending power, lower home ownership rates, more competitive job market, more debt, wage stagnation, hyper inflation, etc. Gen Z will be the first generation where they overwhelmingly have a lower QOL than their parents. Young millennials probably count in this as well.
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Understand why you are coming to those conclusions. But I think it is very premature to make those declarations. Lot of time left for Gen Z and Millennials for QOL determinations.
 
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#4
#4
McDad said:
Understand why you are coming to those conclusions. But I think it is very premature to make those declarations. Lot of time left for Gen Z and Millennials for QOL determinations.
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Fair enough, I do disagree though. I think if anything it will continue to get progressively worse. Its not like any good news is coming down the pipe.

Hog will probably disagree, and I respect his opinion, but the older generation is completely blind to this. Or they don't care, not sure which.

Its going to create a lot of apathetic people who completely disengage from society (already happening) and it will also probably cause some radicalization as well. Kids were sold a false reality.
 
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#5
#5
Ttucke11 said:
Fair enough, I do disagree though. I think if anything it will continue to get progressively worse. Its not like any good news is coming down the pipe.

Hog will probably disagree, and I respect his opinion, but the older generation is completely blind to this. Or they don't care, not sure which.

Its going to create a lot of apathetic people who completely disengage from society (already happening) and it will also probably cause some radicalization as well. Kids were sold a false reality.
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The biggest issue to me is that while it's true wages have gone up, the combined cost of everything else (insurance, healthcare, and home prices) means it gets darn close to impossible to save like our parents did. I make way more than my parents combined, even adjusting for inflation, and if I had wanted to buy their old house (which they bought on a single salary at basically my same age in 1996), I'd be putting about half of my earnings into the loan alone, and that's not counting the home insurance, the health insurance, all the costs of a new baby that I have, etc.. Things are just not sustainable and I really think they don't see it.

My wife and I are extremely fiscally responsible. Very low debt (basically only a small part of a 2-year old mortgage left) with two pretty modest homes in Peru and in the US (price combined for both is less than a "normal" 2-bedroom in the regular middle-class neighborhoods where we have our townhouse). That's the only way I've been able to save anything, and I'm in my mid-30s. We are getting less and less for our dollar, and this problem is only escalating with decisions made by a bunch of old people in DC.
 
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#6
#6
ButchPlz said:
The biggest issue to me is that while it's true wages have gone up, the combined cost of everything else (insurance, healthcare, and home prices) means it gets darn close to impossible to save like our parents did. I make way more than my parents combined, even adjusting for inflation, and if I had wanted to buy their old house (which they bought on a single salary at basically my same age in 1996), I'd be putting about half of my earnings into the loan alone, and that's not counting the home insurance, the health insurance, all the costs of a new baby that I have, etc.. Things are just not sustainable and I really think they don't see it.

My wife and I are extremely fiscally responsible. Very low debt (basically only a small part of a 2-year old mortgage left) with two pretty modest homes in Peru and in the US (price combined for both is less than a "normal" 2-bedroom in the regular middle-class neighborhoods where we have our townhouse). That's the only way I've been able to save anything, and I'm in my mid-30s.
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No clue how accurate but I read if the minimum wage kept up with inflation it would be around 24$ a hour. So basically inflation has left us in the dust. My grandparents bought a house in the 70s and he was a ditch digger and she was a server at crack barrel. Goodluck doing that nowadays.
 
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#7
#7
Berry4Heisman14 said:
No clue how accurate but I read if the minimum wage kept up with inflation it would be around 24$ a hour. So basically inflation has left us in the dust. My grandparents bought a house in the 70s and he was a ditch digger and she was a server at crack barrel. Goodluck doing that nowadays.
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I have a great quality of life, and I work smart, and like I said my wife and I make good- dare I say it, usually great- financial decisions.

While we can "afford" it, we still can't balance out the need for regular life things and the responsible ability to buy the square of land and the 2-3 bedroom house in a quiet neighborhood. It's a type of "shrinkflation", if we want to call it that.
 
#8
#8
ButchPlz said:
I have a great quality of life, and I work smart, and like I said my wife and I make good- dare I say it, usually great- financial decisions.

While we can "afford" it, we still can't balance out the need for regular life things and the responsible ability to buy the square of land and the 2-3 bedroom house in a quiet neighborhood. It's a type of "shrinkflation", if we want to call it that.
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Not everyone has a spouse who can help. Many are by themselves. It’s rough out there
 
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#11
#11
hog88 said:
The 90s
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Again, my parents bought a house on a single income. Most everyone else I grew up around- with one notable exception, where the dad worked a relatively low-skilled job- bought on one income.

What was the average income then compared to the average home price, across the country? What is it now?
 
#12
#12
ButchPlz said:
Again, my parents bought a house on a single income. Most everyone else I grew up around- with one notable exception, where the dad worked a relatively low-skilled job- bought on one income.

What was the average income then compared to the average home price, across the country? What is it now?
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The average home is larger now and has significantly more amenities. If you want an 800 sq ft home without central heat and air, you could afford it on one income
 
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#13
#13
ButchPlz said:
Again, my parents bought a house on a single income. Most everyone else I grew up around- with one notable exception, where the dad worked a relatively low-skilled job- bought on one income.

What was the average income then compared to the average home price, across the country? What is it now?
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according to Google:
1995 median household income = 34k
1995 median home price =115k - 134k

2026 median household income = 84k - 90k
2026 median home price = 400k - 420k

both are close to about 4 times income for home price. 2026 is slightly more.
 
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#17
#17
ButchPlz said:
The numbers I found are a little different but about the same, just note that it's closer to 5x for 2026. That's actually a big deal. Home would need to be about $50k-$90k less on average to be directly comparable. That's not nothing- especiallywith everything else involved,

Remember, nobody is buying a home in a vacuum.
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Don’t forget interest rates were close to 8% significantly reducing your 50-90k number.

Is your argument seriously that 50k or less is prohibiting people from buying a home?

If anything homeownership is slightly higher today
 
#18
#18
hog88 said:
Could part of the reason be a lot of the younger (mid 20s through 30s) generation doesn't want to own a home? They value flexibility and leisure time more?
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Oddly enough Gen Z is buying houses earlier than Millennials. Like 25% of 24 year olds already own homes. I don’t know why the average age has gone up so much
 
#19
#19
McDad said:
What's the source on this? 40 as an average seems off on the surface.
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Gen Z is defiantly ‘giving up’ on ever owning a home and is spending more than saving, working less, and making risky investments, study shows

One line from the article stood out to me.

In other words, younger generations are “giving up.” That’s according to Northwestern’s Seung Hyeong Lee and Chicago’s Younggeun Yoo, who also cited a 2024 Harris Poll survey about the state of real estate that showed 42% of Americans and 46% of Gen Z respondents agreed with this statement: “No matter how hard I work, I will never be able to afford a home I really love.”
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#20
#20
ButchPlz said:
Again, my parents bought a house on a single income. Most everyone else I grew up around- with one notable exception, where the dad worked a relatively low-skilled job- bought on one income.

What was the average income then compared to the average home price, across the country? What is it now?
Click to expand...
Some quick meatball math says average college grad (doing apples to apples here) makes 55K their first year of employment in 2025. Lower end of a median home is 405K in 2025. Roughly 7 and a half times the average wage.

In 1990 the average grad made 31K and the average home cost 96K. Just over 3 times the average wage.

That makes homes roughly 2.3 times more expensive today solely in spending power.
 
#21
#21
Ttucke11 said:
Some quick meatball math says average college grad (doing apples to apples here) makes 55K their first year of employment in 2025. Lower end of a median home is 405K in 2025. Roughly 7 and a half times the average wage.

In 1990 the average grad made 31K and the average home cost 96K. Just over 3 times the average wage.

That makes homes roughly 2.3 times more expensive today solely in spending power.
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In 1990 there were less college graduates.

If you guys are losing at life, it’s not because of the system
 
#23
#23
McDad said:
according to Google:
1995 median household income = 34k
1995 median home price =115k - 134k

2026 median household income = 84k - 90k
2026 median home price = 400k - 420k

both are close to about 4 times income for home price. 2026 is slightly more.
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Wait wait wait. Household income is only part of the equation here. I think our point before was about single incomes buying houses. How do we look at that?
 
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#24
#24
Ttucke11 said:
That is the most irrelevant point possible in response to my post. I'm doing great actually, I have this thing called concern for our future generations.
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The supply of college graduates is not relevant to the wage of college graduates?

I’m going to need you to think a little on that one. I trust you’ll figure it out
 
#25
#25
ButchPlz said:
Around $60k/yr at the time, so he was above average.

Living in Pulaski or Lee or Washington counties could certainly be affordable on $80-$100k. But how many jobs there actually pay that level? How many are open to hire at that level? What's it look like in places where there are jobs?

Like I said in my first post on this topic, it's not just about the home prices.
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A family can live in parts of Montgomery County on $80-100K, Franklin County, Floyd and Craig. All within commuting distance to Roanoke and Blacksburg.

Between the wife and I we bought our first house in Hendersonville on about $60k in 1996, it wasn't a smart decision at the time considering daycare and everything else but turned out well.
 
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