A little perspective is needed

#127
#127
volgr said:
We beat the #2 seed OSU and then played MSU down to the wire. Let's see what we do this weekend, which was you know part of my original post.
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Yes I know, I was there in St. Louis to enjoy it, and it is one of my favorite sports memories. We did not beat the #2 seed OSU to get to the Sweet 16 which is my point. We had already accomplished something special by getting to the Sweet 16 via beating the #14 seeded Ohio team, thus the analogy to the present day. We don't need to see what we do this weekend to be extremely proud of that which has already been accomplished. Perhaps it is not good enough for you, but for me and by reading this thread a lot of other Vol fans, it's pretty great. You don't need "perspective", you only need to understand the enormity of the feat of making it to the Sweet 16, especially having to win 3 games to get there. Perspective is needed when people are bragging about stomping Austin Peay and claiming our football team should be in the top 10 or when losing to Bama on the road and claiming that they are in the bottom 10. But not here. Not even close.
 
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#128
#128
volgr said:
Ohh, we are going to go by preseason polls? LOL. Well we were picked to finish 3rd in the SEC by the media in the pre-season, but we finished 4th. Darn that underachieving Martin. :hmm:
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You were saying that expectations for the team this season hadn't been met yet - and wouldn't be until we beat Mich and KY/UL. I merely pointed out that we weren't ranked in the pre-season polls...hello?

Seriously dude...expectations have been met and exceeded when an unranked team makes the Swt16. I kinda think you know that. Not a bad troll effort though.
 
#129
#129
volgr said:
We beat the #2 seed OSU and then played MSU down to the wire. Let's see what we do this weekend, which was you know part of my original post.
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Which if you're being consistent, then you weren't impressed with what the Vols had done up until that point, no?
 
#130
#130
Wow...........I missed the Statue information. I'm thinking that a little bogus, untrue, exaggerated and just made up.

Link?
 
#131
#131
volgr said:
Let's review the teams and their Kenpom ranking that Coach Martin has beaten during this run.

#84 Mercer
#55 UMass
#31 Iowa

So why are people rushing to build a statue of this guy for beating a bunch of mediocre teams? .
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I wasn't aware that UT was able to choose which teams it plays in the NCAAT.

Can you point me to where UT opted to play Mercer over Duke? Thanks.
 
#132
#132
Ask Duke about Mercer's ability to compete in this tournament.

Volgr, show us your post from October, November, or even December predicting a Sweet 16 for this program. I'd like to see where you were at that time regarding your prediction for Tennessee basketball. My guess is you were expecting failure and a clear route for the return of the old coach.

There is an irony at work here: those who expected the least from this basketball program before the season started are now acting as if they expected Tennessee to be right where it now stands all along.

I expected them to make the tournament. I was critical of this coach when it looked as if this program was too inconsistent to win a place in a conference where tournament slots were going to be at a premium. There were moments when I didn't believe he was up to the job. But there was never a time where I didn't want Coach Martin to succeed for himself and for Tennessee. My perspective is Big Orange and my agenda is Big Orange.

Where is your agenda, OP? Somewhere in Lee County?
 
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#133
#133
VolsSportsFan said:
Put him on ignore, that's what I did. It's been great not having to read his idiocy.
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You said you ignored me then a couple days later you acknowledged content that was in a post I made, that wasn't quoted.

You're a fake ignorer. Pathetic.

And yea UT is my #1 team (hence my name... duh...) but I will now root for Auburn bball on the west. I'm a fan of Bruce Pearl... if he went to Boston College I'd root for those guys. Nothing wrong with that. Don't hate cause I'm beautiful.
 
#134
#134
UT's#1Fan said:
You said you ignored me then a couple days later you acknowledged content that was in a post I made, that wasn't quoted.

You're a fake ignorer. Pathetic.

And yea UT is my #1 team (hence my name... duh...) but I will now root for Auburn bball on the west. I'm a fan of Bruce Pearl... if he went to Boston College I'd root for those guys. Nothing wrong with that. Don't hate cause I'm beautiful.
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Aubie's band Wagon filling up, can't be to much room left.
 
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#137
#137
volgr said:
While I appreciate the effort from the coaching staff and team during their current run, I think a little perspective is needed. After a regular season filled with underachievement and bad losses, it is refreshing to see this team playing up to their potential in time for postseason play. Some fans, who just a few weeks ago where ready to can Coach Martin are now ready to erect a statue in his honor. Quite unbelievable. Let's review the teams and their Kenpom ranking that Coach Martin has beaten during this run.

#84 Mercer
#55 UMass
#31 Iowa
#114 South Carolina
#77 Missouri
#129 Auburn
#113 Vandy
#208 Miss State

So why are people rushing to build a statue of this guy for beating a bunch of mediocre teams? These are teams we should be beating. These are things that were expected of this team. Did Coach Martin set the bar so low during the regular season that now any semblance of a pulse from this team is surprising?

The next 2 games (if we win the 1st) are where Coach Martin will prove himself. (#10 Michigan and #3Louisville/#13KY). If we win and or compete in those games then it is time to start considering a raise and extension. Until that happens, all Coach Martin has done is what is to be expected.
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Have you seen what has happened in this tourney so far? With so many upsets and weaker seeds beating better seeds the fact that we have handily beaten our opponents, except for Iowa, deserves some recognition. Now I concede your point in that perhaps we need to take this run with a little grain of salt. However, the fact that we are even in this tourney and have gotten into the Sweet Sixteen is amazing, considering where we were mid-season. I would rather acknowledge the hard work the players and coaches have done- and enjoy the ride.

Correct me if I'm wrong but we have only reached this point 8 times in school history (4 of those being under BP)- regardless of how we have gotten to this point its still an amazing accomplishment. Some people were spoiled by Pearl's success and have forgot that this was unusual for the better part a century. Not to take away from the regular season success of many teams in the past, I'm speaking of tourney success- which until this century was virtually nonexistent. So we are historically not known for this kind of success. So If somehow we win Friday, put up a darn statue, lol :) JK.
 
#138
#138
Bruce Wayne said:
Never seen people so upset about a sweet sixteen...
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We are upset because we have allowed moronic trolls to change the subject from the great accomplishment of this team to trying to fix their damaged egos (cause they were all wrong about Cuonzo and can't man up and admit it :)). That's all this is.
 
#140
#140
VolsSportsFan said:
Which if you're being consistent, then you weren't impressed with what the Vols had done up until that point, no?
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No, not really. I was impressed when we beat OSU and played well against a good MSU team. Which is why I said in my original post that we should wait until this weekend is over and judge Martin on that.
 
#142
#142
UTRavens said:
So, volgr, you keep dodging the elephant in the room. You bring up the Pomeroy ratings of the teams Tennessee faced, yet when people mention Tennessee's Pomeroy rating (6th!) you seem decidedly less eager to talk about it.
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I think there are plenty of threads that are willing to discuss that. Again, for the 100th time I have given the coaches and team many kudos for turning around the season and playing excellent basketball the last few weeks. There is no elephant in the room, that just isn't what this room was created for.
 
#143
#143
omghulkhands said:
Wow, so many hypotheticals.

The short answer is that hypotheticals don't matter. You reward based on merit or accomplishments. I said that success in the NCAA is largely predicated on NCAA tournament success IMO, ergo, raise and extension equal to sweet 16. What is that? I'm not sure exactly, but it isn't "go coach for your job next year". He would leave, I guarantee it.
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When you give a raise/extension to a coach who just 3 weeks earlier was on the chopping block, hypotheticals are part of the equation. We really don't know what we have in Martin and the fact that we have had a weak route to the Sweet 16 and played in a weak conference only muddies the water. This isn't to downplay our accomplishments, it just is what it is. You have to step out of your cave and view reality.
 
#144
#144
T.N. Buckingham said:
Ask Duke about Mercer's ability to compete in this tournament.
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Ask Oklahoma about ND State who then got blasted their next game. The tourney is full of upsets because that is what happens from time to time in basketball. One team gets hot for a game and one team is ice cold. That Mercer team may beat Duke 1 or 2 times out of 10. Your argument holds no validity.


Volgr, show us your post from October, November, or even December predicting a Sweet 16 for this program. I'd like to see where you were at that time regarding your prediction for Tennessee basketball. My guess is you were expecting failure and a clear route for the return of the old coach.
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My thoughts from January where there would be no way in hell this team would make the tourney at their current state. At that time we had a weak conference, 1 quality win and quite a few bad losses. At the end of the day these things above just about kept us out of the tourney despite our run at the end.

If your agenda is to view everything with orange colored glasses in a simpleton fashion, so be it. We shall disagree.
 
#145
#145
Aday25 said:
Some people were spoiled by Pearl's success and have forgot that this was unusual for the better part a century.
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I think a large portion of fans don't want to see what Pearl built be torn down. So many of us for a long time thirsted for the success that Pearl brought us. It would be a pity for that to be lost.
 
#146
#146
volgr said:
I think a large portion of fans don't want to see what Pearl built be torn down. So many of us for a long time thirsted for the success that Pearl brought us. It would be a pity for that to be lost.
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He tore it down himself. Martin is building a stronger foundation, similar to what Butch is doing in football. Just because he's not given you the instant gratification that you feel entitled to, doesn't mean he's tearing anything down.
 
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#147
#147
volgr said:
While I appreciate the effort from the coaching staff and team during their current run, I think a little perspective is needed. After a regular season filled with underachievement and bad losses, it is refreshing to see this team playing up to their potential in time for postseason play. Some fans, who just a few weeks ago where ready to can Coach Martin are now ready to erect a statue in his honor. Quite unbelievable. Let's review the teams and their Kenpom ranking that Coach Martin has beaten during this run.

#84 Mercer
#55 UMass
#31 Iowa
#114 South Carolina
#77 Missouri
#129 Auburn
#113 Vandy
#208 Miss State

So why are people rushing to build a statue of this guy for beating a bunch of mediocre teams? These are teams we should be beating. These are things that were expected of this team. Did Coach Martin set the bar so low during the regular season that now any semblance of a pulse from this team is surprising?

The next 2 games (if we win the 1st) are where Coach Martin will prove himself. (#10 Michigan and #3Louisville/#13KY). If we win and or compete in those games then it is time to start considering a raise and extension. Until that happens, all Coach Martin has done is what is to be expected.
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nice post and you are correct!
 
#148
#148
volgr said:
When you give a raise/extension to a coach who just 3 weeks earlier was on the chopping block, hypotheticals are part of the equation. We really don't know what we have in Martin and the fact that we have had a weak route to the Sweet 16 and played in a weak conference only muddies the water. This isn't to downplay our accomplishments, it just is what it is. You have to step out of your cave and view reality.
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I bolded the two parts of your argument that are laughably contradictory.
 
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#149
#149
volgr said:
While I appreciate the effort from the coaching staff and team during their current run, I think a little perspective is needed. After a regular season filled with underachievement and bad losses, it is refreshing to see this team playing up to their potential in time for postseason play. Some fans, who just a few weeks ago where ready to can Coach Martin are now ready to erect a statue in his honor. Quite unbelievable. Let's review the teams and their Kenpom ranking that Coach Martin has beaten during this run.

#84 Mercer
#55 UMass
#31 Iowa
#114 South Carolina
#77 Missouri
#129 Auburn
#113 Vandy
#208 Miss State

So why are people rushing to build a statue of this guy for beating a bunch of mediocre teams? These are teams we should be beating. These are things that were expected of this team. Did Coach Martin set the bar so low during the regular season that now any semblance of a pulse from this team is surprising?

The next 2 games (if we win the 1st) are where Coach Martin will prove himself. (#10 Michigan and #3Louisville/#13KY). If we win and or compete in those games then it is time to start considering a raise and extension. Until that happens, all Coach Martin has done is what is to be expected.
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**** perspective....I'm a fan, I don't need no perspective.
 
#150
#150
volgr said:
While I appreciate the effort from the coaching staff and team during their current run, I think a little perspective is needed. After a regular season filled with underachievement and bad losses, it is refreshing to see this team playing up to their potential in time for postseason play. Some fans, who just a few weeks ago where ready to can Coach Martin are now ready to erect a statue in his honor. Quite unbelievable. Let's review the teams and their Kenpom ranking that Coach Martin has beaten during this run.

#84 Mercer
#55 UMass
#31 Iowa
#114 South Carolina
#77 Missouri
#129 Auburn
#113 Vandy
#208 Miss State

So why are people rushing to build a statue of this guy for beating a bunch of mediocre teams? These are teams we should be beating. These are things that were expected of this team. Did Coach Martin set the bar so low during the regular season that now any semblance of a pulse from this team is surprising?

The next 2 games (if we win the 1st) are where Coach Martin will prove himself. (#10 Michigan and #3Louisville/#13KY). If we win and or compete in those games then it is time to start considering a raise and extension. Until that happens, all Coach Martin has done is what is to be expected.
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The team plays who is on the schedule. They can not go out and choose to play Wichita States, Kentucky, Florida each and every game.

The facts are that this team beat the teams that were on their schedule they beat them with convincing fashion in those games. This team did not have the choice to play Duke in the Tourney because Mercer beat Duke and we destroyed Mercer.

Now here is your perspective that you said is needed:

Think about this…when was the last time that a college basketball team finished the season undefeated?

Teams That Won The NCAA Tournament With the Most Losses
* Kansas (1988) - 11 losses
* North Carolina State (1983) - 10 losses
* Villanova (1985) - 10 losses
* UConn (2011) - 9 losses
* Indiana (1981) - 9 losses

You can not look at basketball records and judge a team like you would the record and standing of a team in football. There are a lot more games played in a basketball season and you don't win a game because your team is stronger, or faster than everyone else. There is a lot more party in college basketball than there is in football. The parity is not artificially created as in the NFL, but rather because basketball players develop differently than a football player-it is more skill driven and getting the teams to work well together.

Did you know that in over 73 years or more of the NCAA Basketball Tournament that there have only been 7 undefeated champions? The last one was Indiana in 1976- 38 years ago.

What matters is that you catch lightning in bottle at the right time. We got screwed by the selection committee two years in a row and were fortunate enough that we got into the lay in game. Vegas has always liked our team, but politics against the SEC has limited the league in the tournament in recent years. Much of that is due to Mike Slive wielding a heavy hammer in football talks.
 
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